What EXACTLY happenes when you are saved?!?

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GreenEyedLady

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What are the specific event that happen to your soul when you are saved??
here is what i have found.

First there is confession from the heart comming out of your mouth.

1 John 4:15 _Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
Romans 10:9 _That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Then there is repenting of the sins..agknowleging that you are a sinner..this MUST happen after you realize that Jesus is Lord, if you cannot realize THAT then you cannot see how you are sinnful in your nature.

Acts 17:30 _And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31 _Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Here is where God comes in...
What does He do?
Colossians 2:12 _Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 _¶And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 _Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Ok so God preforms an operation by cutting off our "old Man" or fleshy sinning ways.

Romans 6:6 _Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Ephesians 4:22 _That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;

Colossians 3:9 _Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

So our here we are cut..but what sows us up from the operation? What are Gods stiches...what seals our operation?

Ephesians 1:13 _In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Ephesians 4:30 _And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

We are sealed...can anything break this operation? Can we have surgery and not have a scar? NO..it was done, finished right there..you cannot UNDO the operation of God..its there its marked and sealed with the holy spirit!

One who has been saved right after is a babe in Christ..They are not skilled enought to determaine what is completely rightous!
Hebrews 5:8 _Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 _And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
10 _¶Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.
11 _Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.
12 _For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
13 _For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
14 _But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

YOU are REBORN a child of God..YOU are his child..whether your an infant(who knows not right from wrong and sins alot) a toddler( who walks with the strenght of the holy spirit but stumbles in your sin) a teenager( who is slowly seeing the sins that are within you and finding yourself constanly asking for forgiveness) OR an adult (who eats meat, who has there senses excersized in the GROWTH of your salvation)

You are one of the above now what you are born again. You are ALWAYS a child of God, sealed until the day you die, nothing can take YOU away from HIM. His operation CANNOT be undone!
Can you UNDO the birth of your child? NO!

What comes next? Obedience!
Since you have already been baptized with the holy spirit, and you start to excersize your senses..you crave to be feed, you read HIS word, you get baptized and you crave food forever. That craveing will NEVER cease!
:hug:
GEL
 

kelco

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GEL this is a really interesting post. I usually just lurk but this one made me really think.

What about the passage in 2 Peter?

2:20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledege of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.

2:21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.

2:22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and , "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire." NASB

(the caps are to signify a quote from the OT)

I think it means that a person knows the Lord and is genuinely saved but then of his/her own free will turns away from the message and goes back to his old way of life. The person's knowledege was said to be real, their change of life was real and their return to their old way of life was real. But if the person would try to come back to the Lord his salvation has been lost and there is no way of regaining it.

Here are some other references if you would like to look them up:
Rom 11:21-22, 1 Cor 9:27, Heb 6:6.

Kelly
 
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GreenEyedLady

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2 Peter 2:12 _But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
13 _And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
14 _Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
15 _Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 _But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth] speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet.
17 _These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.
2:18 _For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
19 _While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
20 _For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 _For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

If you read the entire chapter you can tell that these people that have "knowledge of the Lord" had not accepted the Lord. These people are not those that are saved, they are those who have full knowledge of who Christ was, what he died for and who God is and flat our rejected it. To me even, it would be better for man to have no knowledge of GOD, than to have knowledge and reject it.
GEL
 
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GreenEyedLady

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Romans11:20
If you read further you see that romans 11:20 is reffering to the jews. I am not sure what your point is with this scripture...?????

Romans 11:25 _For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 _And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 _For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Hebrew 6:6
The falling away here mentioned, is an open and avowed renouncing of Christ, from enmity of heart against him, his cause, and people, by men approving in their minds the deeds of his murderers, and all this after they have received the knowledge of the truth, and tasted some of its comforts. Of these it is said, that it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance. Not because the blood of Christ is not sufficient to obtain pardon for this sin; but this sin, in its very nature, is opposite to repentance and every thing that leads to it. If those who through mistaken views of this passage, as well as of their own case, fear that there is no mercy for them, would attend to the account given of the nature of this sin, that it is a total and a willing renouncing of Christ, and his cause, and joining with his enemies, it would relieve them from wrong fears. We should ourselves beware, and caution others, of every approach near to a gulf so awful as apostacy; yet in doing this we should keep close to the word of God, and be careful not to wound and terrify the weak, or discourage the fallen and penitent. Believers not only taste of the word of God, but they drink it in. And this fruitful field or garden receives the blessing. But the merely nominal Christian, continuing unfruitful under the means of grace, or producing nothing but deceit and selfishness, was near the awful state above described; and everlasting misery was the end reserved for him. Let us watch with humble caution and prayer as to ourselves.
This was taken from MHC.
What really raised my eyebrows was this....
Hebrews 6:4 _For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 _And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 _If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
You see that..in verse 4....IT IS IMPOSSIBLE!
This means that the person is completely rejecting GOD...COMPLETELY!
When i say you are saved until the day you die..YOU ARE SAVED until the day you die...I cannot see someone who is truley saved with the holy spirit working in them and out of them and then rejecting GOD. Can it happen..maybe,but one who rejected HIM like that is surley never to go back again to HIM.
There is one sin that can remove your salvation...that is to completely reject Christ and everything HE is about. Can you do that?? Could you do that right now...with the holy spirit living in you?
GEL
PS..Kelly..I am so glad that I intreged you so much that you came out of the "wilderness" to get you feet wet in here!
God Bless YOU!
GEL
 
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kelco

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GEL,

Thanks for the welcome! :) To answer your last 2 questions I've been a christian for over 25 years and although there was a time or two when I was tempted very, very much to give up Christ, I'm glad to say that through the help of the Holy Spirit I did'nt. :clap: But I still think that it is possible for a person to know the Lord and be saved but through the work of Satan to turn from the Lord and to reject him. It will always be a mystery to me to think that someone who has a grasp on eternal life with God our Father can turn away.

Oh well that's what makes this forum so nice, that we can all agree to disagree in peace!

Take care and God Bless!

Kelly
 
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GreenEyedLady

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John 10:28 _And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
John 10:29 _My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

SATAN will LOSE!
You didn't give up because YOU knew the truth! Bless you!
Glad your here!
GEL
 
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Ben johnson

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If you read the entire chapter you can tell that these people that have "knowledge of the Lord" had not accepted the Lord. These people are not those that are saved, they are those who have full knowledge of who Christ was, what he died for and who God is and flat our rejected it. To me even, it would be better for man to have no knowledge of GOD, than to have knowledge and reject it.
Hey, GEL---you quoted it yourself, verse18: "they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error." "CLEAN ESCAPED", in the Greek, is "ONTOS APOFUEGO". "TRULY ESCAPED". What? "The defilements of the world". How? "By the EPIGNOSIS-TRUE-KNOWLEDGE of the LORD AND SAVIOR Jesus Christ". You say "they were NOT EVER SAVED".

All right, please turn to chapter 1, verses 1-4: "...To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ. Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the EPIGNOSIS-TRUE-KNOWLEDGE of God and of Jesus our LORD; seeing that His divine power has granted to us everything pertaining to life and godliness, through the EPIGNOSIS-TRUE-KNOWLEDGE of Him who called usby His own glory and excellence. For by these He has granted to us His precious and magnificent promises, that you might become partakers ofthe divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world by lust."

Can we agree that these ESCAPERS are SAVED? I don't see how that is deniable. THESE have the same kind of faith as Peter and the Apostles. They are saved.

Now, if the escapers of the world's corruption through the EPIGNOSIS-TRUE-KNOWLEDGE of the LORD and SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST, in chapter 1, are SAVED...

...then please help me to understand how you believe the escapers of the defilements of the world through the EPIGNOSIS-TRUE-KNOWLEDGE of the LORD and SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST, in chapter 2, are NOT saved?

Why are THESE in chapter 1 saved, but THOSE in chapter 2 are not??? Same words, same descriptions. What am I missing?

And verse 21 doesn't say "have knowledge", it says "better to have never KNOWN the way of righteousness, than having KNOWN it, to TURN from the holy commandment delivered to them." How is this a "superficial head-kowledge", rather than actually "having KNOWN the WAY OF RIGHTEOUSNESS"?
and tasted some of its comforts...
Heb6:4, says "partakers of the Holy Spirit". "Partakers" is "metochos", sharing-or-partaking. Please look at Heb3:1, "partakers of a heavenly calling", and 3:14 "partakers of Christ". In each case, "metochos". Please help me to understand how they were "only TASTING the Holy Spirit but not really INDWELT"?

In Heb6:6, it says "if they have fallen-away" ("parapipto"---fallen from the true faith), "adunatos" (weak, without power, impossible in that sense) to renew-again ("Palin"---AGAIN)...

If they WERE not saved, then what did they fall away FROM? If they were never saved, then they were never repentant; why does he say, "renew-again"? Why doesn't he say, "If they then leave you, they will not COME to repentance..."? Rather than what he DOES say, "If they FALL AWAY, they will not be RENEWED AGAIN to repentance (while they are falling)..."?

The "never saved" just doesn't make any sense here...
Can it happen..maybe,but one who rejected HIM like that is surley never to go back again to HIM.
...which, seems to be what he is sayin' here. If they FALL, they are CONTEMPTUOUS---and will not WANT to repent (WHILE they are falling---the tense is present-continuous---translated "SINCE" in NAS, "SEEING" in KJV, "BECAUSE" in NIV...)
There is one sin that can remove your salvation...that is to completely reject Christ and everything HE is about. Can you do that?? Could you do that right now...with the holy spirit living in you?
Well, that's the $64,000 question! In Eph1:13, it says we were "sealed with the Holy Spirit, by having believed". In Eph4:30, it says "do not GRIEVE the Holy Spirit, by whom you were sealed FOR ("Eis"---unTO, not unTIL) the day of redemption". If we disbelieve and DO grieve the Holy Spirit, will the Holy Spirit still live IN us? Will the seal remain unbroken?

Hey, Kelli! Welcome! Join in any time! There are no stupid questions. Usually, the one you ask, is the same that everyone else says, "YEAH! What SHE said!"

:)
 
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kelco

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Hi Guys! Just had a thought and I'll post it here.

If we disbelieve and DO grieve the Holy Spirit, will the Holy Spirit still live IN us? Will the seal remain unbroken?

Any seal can be broken. The Holy Spirit cannot dwell where there is unbelief. When we do not believe we break that seal.I think that all sin grieves the Holy Spirit but he convicts of that sin so we may ask forgivness from God. That is one of his works. When we are forgiven He continues to dwell in us. But if a person rejects God altogether then our heart is made hard and He cannot live in us anymore then that seal is broken and cannot be resealed and thus a person loses their salvation.

Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All their sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and their blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29 but whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit hath never forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin:
Mar 3:30 because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.

The unpardonable sin-attributing the works of Christ to Satan-is the same as rejecting him and the person guilty of this cannot be pardoned and will lose their salvation. So GEl, it is possible to lose your salvation! Like I said before,for me I can't imagine living without God but there are truly saved people who have turned their backs on Jesus and they can never be taken back.

I wish that I could belive that OSAS. The fault for me in this is that if you are saved forever no matter what then why should I not take that as a license to sin all I want to and still go to heaven.

Take care and God bless!
 
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Andrew

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kelco,
u said:
"If we disbelieve and DO grieve the Holy Spirit, will the Holy Spirit still live IN us? Will the seal remain unbroken? "
"Any seal can be broken. The Holy Spirit cannot dwell where there is unbelief. When we do not believe we break that seal."

In Roman times, Caesar's seal, if broken by anyone, that person faces death. Paul writing in Roman times, uses the same term, just rem it's a mil times more powerful than Caesar's seal, cos it's God's seal! So do you still think anyone can just break it like that?

And if the Holy Spirit leaves, the moment you grieve him, how in the world did you get back to God? by your own intellect and efforts? think abt it for a while. all Christians wld be lost forever if that were true!

In that verse, Paul also says the Holy Spirit is God's deposit. ie when you put a deposit somewhere, it means you are coming back to get the whole thing. ie Jesus is coming back to get us, cos he has put a deposit in us, the Holy Spirit, He is the guarantee, God's guarantee.
 
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eldermike

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Blackhawk expressed it correctly, IMHO.

I can't resist adding something <grin>
Before salvation we are dead, after we live. The new life comes with an improvement process but "saved" is an act of God based on our beleif that Jesus came to die for our sins. I think that's John 3:16 in different words.
Salvation is "poof" supernatural stuff, where learning to walk has to come after birth. Suppose we thought that our natural births were still going on. hmmmmm We might be confused, might we?

Saved = birth (life) in Christ. The only thing that happens at that instant is a new name is written in the book of life. Things begin to happen but not until we are born new in Christ. My new birth is in my past just like my first natural one. I can't undo either of them.

Blessings
 
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