Ecumenical Excesses

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Rising_Suns

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NDIrish said:
Take another look at the canon. It's not referring to faith being sufficient for salvation, but rather as faith being sufficient for preparation for receiving communion.

Right, and again, not all Protestants believe in "faith alone".
 
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Benedicta00

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RS- you really are barking up the wrong tree comparing apples to oranges by bringing the EO into this, they are true Churches establish by the apostles who is in schism with one bishop in particular, they do not even compare to Luther or henry’s dissent.

They also have confession- VALID preists, so if they were to commune, we know they get it- you have to go to confession first least you take in judgment of your sins and condemn yourself.

Are you willing to chuck confession too for ecumenism davide?
 
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lonnienord

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Shelb5 said:
Oh my goodness…

Lonnie- the requirement is YOU HAVE TO BE CATHOLIC!

When you say Amen Lonnie it is not just that you are saying Amen to Jesus is there, but to ALL that holy mother Church purposes for our belief IN UNION with the bishop of Rome.

These non-catholics in no way can say Amen to that- they do not pledge obedience t the pope! They refuse to!

I’m in coronary shock again people…
When i say Amen i am saying Amen to the fact that i am recieving JESUS. I have never heard that when you say amen you are saying that i am in union with the Bishop of Rome. Why do you think "Amen" means that?????????????:scratch: :scratch: :scratch:
 
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Benedicta00

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lonnienord said:
When i say Amen i am saying Amen to the fact that i am recieving JESUS. I have never heard that when you say amen you are saying that i am in union with the Bishop of Rome. Why do you think "Amen" means that?????????????:scratch: :scratch: :scratch:
Lonnie-

the Church has always taught this. Please look it up.
 
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Benedicta00

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lonnienord said:
Why do you have to be Catholic in order to recieve JESUS???????

of course aren't all baptised christians Catholic? We recognize all baptism that is done properly.
Lonnie, PLEASEEEEEEEEEE do not get offended but where do you learn about the catholic faith? This stuff I am saying is basic.
 
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lonnienord

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Shelb5 said:
Lonnie-

the Church has always taught this. Please look it up.
i have been a Catholic for 30 years went to mass every sunday and many many times during the week and i've never heard this. Where do you suggest i look it up???
 
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Benedicta00

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lonnienord said:
i have been a Catholic for 30 years went to mass every sunday and many many times during the week and i've never heard this. Where do you suggest i look it up???
Every catechism the Church ever printed.


Lonnie, you really never heard that you have to be Catholic to take communion at Mass? You really never knew you have to go to confession if you have never been before to take it for the first time and every time you are in sin?

Do you watch the Mass on EWTN? They explain the requirements before every mass.
 
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lonnienord

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Shelb5 said:
Lonnie, PLEASEEEEEEEEEE do not get offended but where do you learn about the catholic faith? This stuff I am saying is basic.
i am a convert 30 years ago. 6 years ago i sponsored a convert and went through RCIA. I have read the Catachism of the Catholic Church; and most of the documents of Vatican two. I go do mass and listen to the homily weekly for 30 years and daily for the last 6 months.

what you are saying may be basic but i honstly have never heard that "Amen" means anything more than that i acknowledge that i am recieving the Body of JESUS
 
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Miss Shelby

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lonnienord said:
Why do you have to be Catholic in order to recieve JESUS???????
One has to be baptized and receive the Holy Sacrament of First Communion and First Confession in order to receive communion. (and Confirmation and if they're an adult)

If all that was required to receive was belief, then why would people have to go through the initiation rite and be received into the Church? They don't let the candidates receive until they are fully intiated. Think about it.

Michelle
 
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Benedicta00

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Milla said:
This would carry a lot more weight if you cited an offical Church source :)
It's on the back of the missel!

Am I in the twilight zone here???

You have to be a catholic to take communion at a catholic mass, you can not take communion with out prior sacramental confession if you have mortal sin on your soul least you take it in judgement of yourself.

In RCIA- you have to wait until your convert at the vigil and have made a prior sacramental confession before you can receive communion.
 
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lonnienord

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Shelb5 said:
Every catechism the Church ever printed.


Lonnie, you really never heard that you have to be Catholic to take communion at Mass? You really never knew you have to go to confession if you have never been before to take it for the first time and every time you are in sin?

Do you watch the Mass on EWTN? They explain the requirements before every mass.
I know the requirement that one be Catholic and be in a state of grace (yes i do watch mass on EWTN. I believe the pope, cardnal and bishops can allow non catholics to recieve communion. I also think that if we had a class and explained transubstansation and confession and the state of grace we could (if the teaching authority of the Church agreed) allow non catholics to recieve communion. (of course i don't really mean that cause since i think all baptised people are Catholics i would expect that we would only allow baptised people ie Catholics to partake)
 
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Benedicta00

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lonnienord said:
i am a convert 30 years ago. 6 years ago i sponsored a convert and went through RCIA. I have read the Catachism of the Catholic Church; and most of the documents of Vatican two. I go do mass and listen to the homily weekly for 30 years and daily for the last 6 months.

what you are saying may be basic but i honstly have never heard that "Amen" means anything more than that i acknowledge that i am recieving the Body of JESUS
Lonnie read the missel next time you are in church- ask the priest- if I am lying …I am dying.

When you say Amen you are saying that you believe all that the Church purposes for your belief in union with the pope.

When you were in RCIA when were you allowed to take communion?
 
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Milla

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Shelb5 said:
It's on the back of the missel!

Am I in the twilight zone here???

You have to be a catholic to take communion at a catholic mass, you can not take communion with out prior sacramental confession if you have mortal sin on your soul least you take it in judgement of yourself.

In RCIA- you have to wait until your convert at the vigil and have made a prior sacramental confession before you can receive communion.

Yes, but this:

Oh my goodness…

Lonnie- the requirement is YOU HAVE TO BE CATHOLIC!

When you say Amen Lonnie it is not just that you are saying Amen to Jesus is there, but to ALL that holy mother Church purposes for our belief IN UNION with the bishop of Rome.

These non-catholics in no way can say Amen to that- they do not pledge obedience t the pope! They refuse to!

I’m in coronary shock again people…


Is what I am asking you to support with sources. It would seem to me to be inaccurate, because as we all know, the RCC allows Orthodox to take communion, and they do not acknowledge the Pope as supreme leader of the Church on earth.
 
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D'Ann

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Cat59 said:
This is the link to the Taize website..
http://www.taize.fr/en
I would recomend reading Kasper's address at the funeral- it sums up Brother Roger..
http://www.taize.fr/en_article2543.html
What many people speak of, Brother Roger lived.
Sleep well Debbie and may the Lord always bless you and keep you safe in His care.

Thank you so much Cat59 for these links. I find the following message very sweet and wonderful. God be with him. God bless you too and your family always.

Pax,

Debbie

Eminences, Excellencies,
Dear Brothers of the Taizé Community
Brothers and sisters,
We are under the impact of the death of Brother Roger, one of the great spiritual leaders and also spiritual fathers of our time. But at the same time, our grief is being transformed into hope.

Surrender to God’s will and the humble gift of self had become in Brother Roger a source of inner peace, hope, and even happiness. Who would have thought that this humble gift of self would one day end in such circumstances? And yet, even and especially at this time, we can repeat the words which Brother Roger loved to say: “You love us; your forgiveness and your presence bring to birth in us the brightness of praise.”

By the witness of his friends and his servants, God never ceases to lead his Church and to prepare a future for it. By his presence, his words and his example, Brother Roger caused love and hope to shine around him, far beyond the barriers and the divisions of this world. A man of communion, he nourished in his heart and in his prayer a deep desire for reconciliation and encounter. With the Brothers of the Taizé Community, he wanted to place a ferment of unity in the Church and in the world.

The first split that hurt Brother Roger concerned the division between Christians. From his youth he united himself to Christ’s prayer “that all may be one, as you, Father, are in me, and I in you” (John 17:21). He wanted to live the faith of the undivided Church, without breaking with anybody, in a great brotherhood. He believed above all in the ecumenism of holiness, that holiness which changes the depths of the soul and which alone leads towards full communion. Yes, the springtime of ecumenism has flowered on the hill of Taizé, in this Church of Reconciliation, where members of different Christian traditions meet in respect and dialogue, in prayer and fraternal sharing, inspired by the presence and the example of Brother Roger.

The second split that hurt Brother Roger concerned the division between peoples and nations, between rich and poor countries. Every form of injustice or neglect made him very sad. He wanted some Brothers of the community to go and live in several countries with the poorest of the poor, in small groups, as a simple sign of love and communion. This simple witness was very dear to him, like a prophecy in miniature of the Kingdom of God, like a seed of friendship and reconciliation in a world plagued by indifference. For Brother Roger, there was complete continuity between the love of God and the love of human beings, between prayer and commitment, between action and contemplation.

Brother Roger was a contemplative, a man of prayer, whom the Lord had called to the silence and solitude of the monastic life. And yet he wanted to open his monk’s heart and the Taizé Community to young people from throughout the world, to their searching and their hope, to their joy and their suffering, to their faith- and life-journeys. Here are the final lines of his last book, published one month ago: “For my part, I would go to the ends of the earth, if I could, to tell again and again of my trust in the younger generations.” More than a guide or a spiritual master, Brother Roger was for many a kind of father, a reflection of the eternal Father and of the universality of his love.

We are not here together now in this church to tell the story of a life, but to praise and to pray to God. Grateful for all that the Church of Christ and humanity have received from the life of Brother Roger and from his witness, we entrust him today to the eternal love of God.

Lord, enable your servant to see “the heavens open and Jesus standing at the right hand of the Father” (Acts 7:55), that Jesus he loved and searched for so much throughout his entire lifetime. Enable him, in the Holy Spirit, to enter into the communion of saints and the perfect liturgy of heaven, that communion in God in which he desired to live, sing and pray each day. Enable him to contemplate the face of the eternal Father in all its beauty, that face in which every look of love finds its fulfillment and upon which shines endless life, and give us the grace to continue, according to his example and with hope, on the road of reconciliation, communion and peace, as an anticipation of your eternal Kingdom.


Last updated: 23 August 2005
 
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Benedicta00

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lonnienord said:
I know the requirement that one be Catholic and be in a state of grace (yes i do watch mass on EWTN. I believe the pope, cardnal and bishops can allow non catholics to recieve communion. I also think that if we had a class and explained transubstansation and confession and the state of grace we could (if the teaching authority of the Church agreed) allow non catholics to recieve communion. (of course i don't really mean that cause since i think all baptised people are Catholics i would expect that we would only allow baptised people ie Catholics to partake)
nope.

That insult how it goes. Dispensation are given in very specific situations like a funeral, like a wedding and only if the person is in danger of death. Love feasts are not a reason. sorry.

It takes way more that just believing inin the real presence and transubstantiation.

Communion is our becoming one with God Lonnie, the people are not in union with all that Christ left for us, and they reject his Church Lonnie. Come on, this isn’t that hard to understand why we can not allow them to commune all willy niiy.

Jesus said he who hears you, hears me. They do not listen to the Church Lonnie, they have made their own church and have made themselves pope.

I'm not trying to put anyone down but you have to have realized this? They broke away from Jesus’ church.
 
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