Originally posted by mac_philo
I disagree, but if that's true, we're watching the death throes of the religion. It will soon be gone.
too bad the New Testament Church has been around longer than evolution.
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Originally posted by mac_philo
I disagree, but if that's true, we're watching the death throes of the religion. It will soon be gone.
Hilarious. Evolution's been around for a lot longer than people...much less their beliefs, myths, and traditions....Originally posted by BigJon
too bad the New Testament Church has been around longer than evolution.
Originally posted by BigJon
Disagreeing with God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit or any of there teaching there for means your not a sell out and you cant be called a Christian
Originally posted by elephanticity
Hilarious. Evolution's been around for a lot longer than people...much less their beliefs, myths, and traditions....
Originally posted by BigJon
ok the nicene creed isnt hog wash, but it has nothing to do with being or not being a christian.
Originally posted by seebs
To be fair, the *theory* of evolution hasn't... Although it's probably been around longer than BigJon's church, and they probably have at least one point of doctrine that's newer than the theory of evolution.
How about the theory of gravity? Is it more valid than Mormonism, just because it's older? Is the Mormon Church more valid than quantum theory, by virtue of age?Originally posted by seebs
To be fair, the *theory* of evolution hasn't... Although it's probably been around longer than BigJon's church, and they probably have at least one point of doctrine that's newer than the theory of evolution.
Originally posted by BigJon
ok the nicene creed isnt hog wash, but it has nothing to do with being or not being a christian. Basicly it states a few simple facts from the bible, however to be a christian it requires no creeds and or oaths or anything of the such.
I didnt say anything to the affect of not proving God, if you have questions and doubts then do the research, you'll find in the end God is right every time.
Originally posted by elephanticity
God says bats are birds. That grasshoppers have 4 legs? That the moon provides it's own illumination? Still waiting for any research that bolsters those ideas.
Anyway, the Nicene creed antedates (that means it is older than...) the bible as we know it today. There were a number of sects and churches that all considered themselves true christians. Even those that considered John The Baptist more important than Jesus, those that worshiped the Sun God (note: NOT the Son OF God), those that worshipped two Gods, one good and one evil....
A lot of the bible books were CHOSEN based on agreement with the Creed, not the other way around. Some were not included in the Bible, as they did not support it. It shaped the Church you belong to, whatever church it may be.
For a giggle, see some of the other doctrines that ALMOST made it to the creed, they made it as far as a full council vote:
And remember, every doctrine here, even those with Pagan elements, had a chance of being part of your basic belief system.
Article 1:
*I believe in one God,
*I believe in three Gods, which are:
*I believe in many gods, including:
Article 2:
*The Father, Almighty, maker of Heaven and Earth, of all things visible and invisible,
*The Unconquered Sun, Giver of Life and Victory,
Article 1&2:
I believe in two Gods, one Good, maker of all things unseen and invisible; one Evil, maker of all things visible and corrupt,
Article 3:
*I believe in One Lord, Jesus Christ, only begotten Son of God,
*I believe in the true prophets of the light, including Jesus Christ,
*I believe in One Lord, Jesus Christ, Foremost Prophet of God,
*Who appeared as Our Lord, Jesus Christ,
Article 4:
*Eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light, True God from True God, begotten not made,
*Begotten of the Father at His Incarnation,
*Fully Divine and Truly God,
*Whose spirit, the Divine Word, is eternally begotten of the Father,
*A light from the True Light,
*Created by the Father, Who named Him, "Son of God,"
*Whose spirit, the Divine Word, is eternally begotten of the Father,
Article 3 & 4:
*I believe in One Lord, Jesus Christ, perfectly guided by the Word of God,
Article 5:
*Being of a similar substance to the Father,
*Being of one substance with the Father,
*Being of a different substance to the Father,
*Being of a different substance but having the same will as the Father,
Article 3 & 4 & 5:
*I believe in John the Baptist, Foremost Prophet of God,
Article 6:
*Who appeared as a man, born of the Virgin Mary, and was crucified under Pontius Pilate;
*His divine Person became incarnate when His body was born of the Virgin Mary (who may not therefore, be called "Mother of God"
*By the Power of the Holy Spirit, He became incarnate of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate;
*His Spirit became incarnate with the body and soul of a man, which were crucified under Pontius Pilate;
Article 7:
*With the Father, He suffered and was buried.
*He suffered and was buried.
*He suffered, died, and was buried.
*He substituted the Wrong-doer upon the cross, and escaped death.
*He appeared to suffer, die and be buried.
Article 8:
*On the third day He rose again. He ascended into Heaven and was reunited with the Father. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and His kingdom shall have no end.
*On the third day, He rose again, in accordance with the Scriptures. He shall come again in glory, to restore Israel.
*He is said to have risen on the third day, showing that the dead shall indeed be raised to life.
*On the third day He appeared to rise again. He ascended into Heaven and sits on the right hand of the Father. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and His kingdom shall have no end.
Article 9:
*I believe in the Divine Wisdom, the Holy Spirit of the Light.
*I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father, with Whom He will be reunited.
*I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father and the Son, and with them is worshipped and glorified.
*I believe in the Holy Spirit.
*I believe in the Holy Spirit, Chief Agent of God's Work.
*I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father.
Article 10:
*The Dead shall be raised in Spirit, not in body.
*The Church must withdraw entirely from the world.
*The Church must abstain from all lusts of the flesh.
*The Clergy should be celibate.
*The Clergy, excluding Bishops, should be celibate.
*Only those who have "Gnosis" are truly saved.
*Those who lapse from the Faith must be re-baptized
*The Traditions of the Church are those followed by the Apostles, and should not be changed.
Really, if you're going to argue the errors in evolution, or the powers of the church, you need to read up a teeny bit more on either.....
"You use that word a lot, I don't think it means what you think it means."
Never mind what the **** you think of me for believing in evolution. I'll call Hovind an idiot, and i'm not fond of the politics of creationists, but watch what you're calling other xians, you self-centered, judgmental, name-dropping, history ignoring, literalist.as for evolution your right I dont know every stinkin nit pickin detail, I know the main points and thats enough to know its gibberish from people who dont want to believe theres a all powerful God, and for all those who say " I believe in God and evolution is right" well your all a bunch of hypocrites.
When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace - David Koresh, quoting LUKE 11:21
a. From the world, not from the bible#2 if you do have one Read Genesis 1:1-2:1 then answer the following questions.
A. Where in the world do you think it took millions of years?
B. Where do you get the idea we came from apes?
So, the sun comes out of his little doggie house, runs around the earth from one end to the other, and the sun shines everywhere....19:4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
19:5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
19:6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof
Originally posted by elephanticity
And why is a pagan the one defending christian evolutionists here? A little help?