Can non-Christians be saved?

Originally posted by fragmentsofdreams
Is Christianity absolutely necessary for salvation or is it the best path to salvation and those in other religions might be guided by the Holy Spirit to be Christian by act if not in name?

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The central question comes down to "how do we interpret this", where "this" is Christ's comment that no one comes to the Father except through Him.

I interpret this as meaning that He has opened the way. I do not necessarily believe that you have to know Him by name, or even have heard of him.

What is the new covenant? Love god, love thy neighbor as thyself, and have faith. Faith in what? Faith in God? Faith that things are okay? Faith in Christ?

What happens to people who die before they ever hear of Christ?

I think that, if you find the world beautiful, and love the people who live in it, and believe that the world is essentially a kind and good place, that's probably salvation. You have loved God through His creation, you have loved your neighbor, and you have had faith. When you meet God, your response will not be hostility or rejection, but "Hey, nice job on the sunsets".

I could be wrong. I don't really have any way to know, and it's not mine to judge. I believe that God loves all of us, saints and sinners alike, Christian and heathen alike. Rejecting the teachings of a specific denomination, or even "those Christian folks I saw on TV harassing that poor man", is not the same as rejecting God.

Certainly, I hope He isn't so heartless as to condemn people to hell just because *we* drove them off. (And no one can honestly say that Christians don't sometimes drive people from God.)

Can you be more direct in the OP?
Is it possible that a muslim who knows who christ is to be saved?
Is it possible for a child that was raised in a christian home but decided to choose budda, or hindu, or islamic ECT as their religion to be saved?
NO. I bleive that one MUST be born of the spirit to enter heaven. It is the spirit that bears witness that WE are the children of God, not the children of the flesh.
You can be the sweeties most wonderful giving person in the whole world and live you life the best way you can...but if you don't have the spirit, you don't get heaven.
GEL
As for the whole "not knowing thing" What does the bible say about people who "don't know" about Christ?

Originally posted by GreenEyedLady

As for the whole "not knowing thing" What does the bible say about people who "don't know" about Christ?

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Basically nothing unambiguous, which is why it's a recurring theme of debate.

I distinguish between Christ, and the stories people tell about Him. It is possible to reject the stories, and to have never really heard of the man himself.

Originally posted by fragmentsofdreams
Is Christianity absolutely necessary for salvation or is it the best path to salvation and those in other religions might be guided by the Holy Spirit to be Christian by act if not in name?

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The Holy Spirit is only spoken of in the Boly Bible.

According to Jesus, he stated in the Gospel of John 16, begining at verse 7 that "it is expedient that I go away, I will send Him to you, He will convict the world of Sin, Righteousness and Judgement of SIN; He will lead in into all TRUTH; and will GLORIFY ME, and take of what is Mine and declare it to you. All things that the Father has made are Mine. and ends at verse 15.

So, the Holy Spirit is given only to those who are his chosen people. To guides and reveal, the unsearchable riches of Christ, which the world does not receive but are received by those that know and love him.

I don't where else, anyone can know anything about the Holy Spirit, especially to be able to say with assurance that He guides those that are non-christians.

ONLY IN THE BIBLE.


****I made a mistake when trying to edit this, but I have corrected errors in the next post with addl versess.****

The Holy Spirit is only spoken of in the Boly Bible.

According to Jesus, he stated in the Gospel of John 16, begining at verse 7 that "it is expedient that I go away, I will send Him to you, He will convict the world of Sin, Righteousness and Judgement of SIN; He will lead you into all TRUTH; and will GLORIFY ME, and take of what is Mine and declare it to you. All things that the Father has made are Mine. and ends at verse 15.

So, the Holy Spirit is given only to those who are his chosen people. To guide and reveal, the unsearchable riches of Christ, which the world does not receive but are received by those that know and love him.

In another place the bible teaches that this same spirit (Rom 8:16)is a witness with our spirit that we are children of God, giving us that assurance, and if children then heirs and co heirs with Christ, of the promised possession; refering to the gift of SALVATION by faith in JESUS Christ, seen that we are justified by faith in HIM. (Rom 3:21-26)

I don't know where else, anyone can know anything about the Holy Spirit, especially to be able to say with assurance that He guides those or is of any value to them that are non-christians.

ONLY IN THE BIBLE.

Here is another verse: Eph 2:1-16



Hope this helps.




RICHARD

I think that, if you find the world beautiful, and love the people who live in it, and believe that the world is essentially a kind and good place, that's probably salvation. You have loved God through His creation, you have loved your neighbor, and you have had faith. When you meet God, your response will not be hostility or rejection, but "Hey, nice job on the sunsets".

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That's the problem ... you think too much.

So if you ever become God and have your world then you will have all your rules for salvation laid out.

Give you one clue... This is God's creation. It is his World! It will only work for you if you play by his rules. You are not to judge another. But you are to love God with all your heart, mind, and soul. You are to show this love by loving all of humanity.

You are too stay firm in your Faith! Spread the Gospel of Christ so that all who believe will be saved.

LOVE

Originally posted by Catchup

That's the problem ... you think too much.

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Huh?

So if you ever become God and have your world then you will have all your rules for salvation laid out.

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Uh. No, I'll use the existing ones.

Give you one clue... This is God's creation. It is his World! It will only work for you if you play by his rules. You are not to judge another. But you are too love God with all your heart, mind, and soul. You are to show this love by loving all of humanity.

You are too stay firm in your Faith! Spread the Gospel of Christ so that all who believe will be saved.

LOVE

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And what does this have to do with anything I said? We don't know for sure every detail of God's will.

So, I tell people what I believe, but if God wants to save people for reasons I don't understand, He's welcome to, and I'm glad that more people are saved, for whatever reasons.

Your words, although innocent, in intent...give non-Christians a false sense of security. This is not what you are here to do. I am sorry if my words hurt. But when it comes to Faith too much thinking can cause damage. Better that you have the Faith of a "Child".

LOVE

YES! Saved for eternity from the presence of God due to the work of Satan. If you want to eternally get away from God, if you are not a Christian, simply remain as you are!

In the time to come, the powers that seek to control this world will strive to make Christ less and less. But this will only be within human thoughts. It will never be a part of the reality of God.

LOVE

Originally posted by GreenEyedLady
As for the whole "not knowing thing" What does the bible say about people who "don't know" about Christ?

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Romans 1:19-21 "19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened."

Salvation comes from putting your faith in the finished work of Jesus Christ and His shed blood for your sins.

A Christian is someone who is following Christ or is Christ-like.

Can a saved person not follow Christ or not be Christ-like?

> Can non-Christians be saved? Sure, anyone can be saved, Jesus Christ came to save sinners! That was good news to me when I heard it!
Julie

Cheezit...you are awesome!
Good verse!
GEL

Originally posted by cheezit


Romans 1:19-21 "19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.

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CHEESEIT,

Refer to;

Hebrews Chapter 11 Read the line up of all those who heard about Jesus the Coming Messiah, from the begining, who believed God and he Justified them by their faith,
24 By faith Moses,
26 Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompense of the reward.

39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

By faith all men thruout the generations of mankind have known of Christ the REDEEMER who saves HIS people from their SIN. God even provided that sacrifice accepotable to himself for their sins.



1 Peter 3

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened."

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Remember this was written after Christ had been murdered, rising and then arising to his heavenly place at the right hand of the father, where he intercedes day and night for all his people who are the total some of all those God has given to him.

Rev 12
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
and the prohet jude states;

Jude 1
14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

The eternal everlasting gospel was preached from the begining, to Adam, even his sons new they had to bring an blood offering to God. Which was a picture of the Lamb of God slain from before the foundations of he world.


Praise Him for the reading & sharing of his word, for his promises are the truth.


THIS IS WHY MAN IS WITHOUT EXCUSE. RICHARD

NO ONE COMES TO THE FATHER EXCEPT THROUGH JESUS. I interpret this as meaning that He has opened the way. I do not necessarily believe that you have to know Him by name, or even have heard of him.
no one comes to the Father except through Him. one MUST be born of the spirit to enter heaven. It is the Spirit that bears witness that WE are the children of God, not the children of the flesh. You can be the sweeties most wonderful giving person in the whole world and live you life the best way you can. ...but if you don't have the Spirit, you don't get heaven.

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Which one is true? Red? Blue? (UH-oh, am I starting to sound like Dr. Seuss?)

Jesus IS the only way to God (Jn14:6). But, never having HEARD of Jesus, one is still responsible, and CAN go to Heaven:

"For when Gentiles who do not have the Law (JESUS is now "The LAW"), do instinctively the things of the Law, thewe not having the Law are a law unto themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness, and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on that day when ...God will jude the secrets of men through Christ Jesus." Rom2:14-16

Originally posted by Ben johnson
Which one is true? Red? Blue? (UH-oh, am I starting to sound like Dr. Seuss?)

Jesus IS the only way to God (Jn14:6). But, never having HEARD of Jesus, one is still responsible, and CAN go to Heaven:

"For when Gentiles who do not have the Law (JESUS is now "The LAW&quot, do instinctively the things of the Law, thewe not having the Law are a law unto themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness, and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on that day when ...God will jude the secrets of men through Christ Jesus." Rom2:14-16

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I think it comes down to something where interpretation can guide you in multiple ways. Have faith; God will sort it all out well enough.

What I often ask myself when I start asking similar questions is; "Why should it matter? I know what it takes, none of those what-if scenarios apply to me and I am making it my personal goal to reach the most people humanly (inhumanly if need-be) possible so that they may also know and make that decision for themself"

I have decided, after reading the writings of many people here, and my other experiences with christians, that if being 'saved' means spending an eternity with uber-righteous peoples that would likely continue to judge my actions by their own for the rest of time, I'd rather take my chances in hell, limbo, nirvana, shangri-la or reincarnation back into this world.


LOVE
My love, bigger than yours.