Christian Warning!

They must force their belief on others. " (Sura 2:21)

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O mankind! worship your Lord, Who hath created you and those before you, so that ye may ward off (evil). [The Noble Qur'an 2:21]
Where does it say that we force our belief on others?
However let's look at the Holy Bible regarding this subject:
Christians claim that Biblical Jesus is God. They also claim that Biblical Jesus is the Sultan of mercy, the lamb, our savior, the king of peace, the embodiment of love, the one who said love you enemies and pray for those who persecute you, the one who prohibited to say “fool”, the one who said “don’t resist evil”, etc…

Let’s see:

Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill the followers of other religions Exodus [22:19]

Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill the entire town if some persons worship another god [Deuteronomy 13:13-19]


Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill the nonbelievers [2 Chronicles 15:12-13]





Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill people who don't listen to priests [Deuteronomy 17:12]


Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill witches [Exodus 22:17]

Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill the blasphemer [Leviticus 24:10-16].


Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill any stranger who approaches the Tabernacle [Numbers 1:48-51]


Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill people for working on the Sabbath [Exodus 31:12-15]


Biblical Jesus was the one who ordered to kill 250 Levite princes who disagreed with Moses’ leadership [Numbers 16:35]

are to beat their wives into submission. " (Sura 4:15,16,34)

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The problem comes from the word "Idribuhunne" which we used to translate as "beat them". The root of this word is "DaRaBa". If you look at any Arabic dictionary you will find a long list of meanings ascribed to this word. That list is one of the longest list in whole Arabic dictionary. It can be said that "DaRaBa" is the number-one multi-meaning word in Arabic. It has so many different meanings, we can find numerous different meanings ascribed to it in the Quran.

· To travel, to get out: 3:156; 4:101; 38:44; 73:20; 2:273

· To strike: 2:60,73; 7:160; 8:12; 20:77; 24:31; 26:63; 37:93; 47:4

· To beat: 8:50; 47:27

· To set up: 43:58; 57:13

· To give (examples): 14:24,45; 16:75,76,112; 18:32,45; 24:35; 30:28,58; 36:78; 39:27,29; 43:17; 59:21; 66:10,11

· To take away, to ignore: 43:5

· To condemn: 2:61

· To seal, to draw over: 18:11

· To cover: 24:31

· To explain: 13:17

As you see, in Quran alone we can witness the verb "DaRaBa" having at least ten different meanings. "DaRaBa" has also other meanings which are not mentioned in the Quran. For example, in the Arabic language, you do not print money--you "DaRaBa" money, you do not multiply numbers--you "DaRaBa" numbers, you do not cease the work--you "DaRaBa" the work.

So "Daraba" here come with the meaning of "leave them alone".
For more refer to this site:
http://www.crescentlife.com/thisthat/does_the_quran_sanction_the_beating_of_women.htm

Promisses Jihad muslim terrorist and their supporters murdering non-believers a heavenly sexual orgy of 500 friends, 4,000 virgins, and 8,000 divorced woman. " (Sura 9:20)

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Those who believe, and suffer exile and strive with might and main, in Allah's cause, with their goods and their persons, have the highest rank in the sight of Allah: they are the people who will achieve (salvation). [The Noble Qur'an 9:20]
Where does the verse say terrorism? If someone wage war against you, then you defend yourself, so you are a terrorist?
Where does the verse say all these numbers?
For Sexual orgy in heaven according to some Christians, please refer to these sites:
http://www.rockvillecogop.citymax.com/articles/article/542895/3915.htm
http://heavenlyparadise.cjb.net/heaven/sexinhev.htm
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2003/122/51.0.html

Be aware! Since several religious Muslims insist on imposing their god on us we need to be educated. They may appear as innocent lambs with their occasional " Time Out " (Sura 9:5) but the only way for permanent peace is for every nation to give Israel full control of their land and deporting Muslims to their 21 arab countries

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Given the right explanation of that verse, so you "awarness" is just in your square brain and the brain of other closed-mind fanatics.

Thx
Alexei

Well so much for Muslims not insulting Christians, "spreading hatred" and accusing Christ of being a violent person. I knew their true feelings would show up, again.

So basically you are saying Christ was really just as violent as Muhammed. Correct Alexei? Is that your argument?

That would certainly explain how you justify the violence of Muslims today.

Rad

One thing I noticed (referring to the first post)...isn't "Allah" just an Arabic word for "God" (like saying "Dios" if you're speaking Spanish)?

and thus begins another, "Muslims are all evil people who want to murder and kill, look I can show you by misquoting their holy book" thread.

WWJD, Yes I believe Allah is just a title. Like King, or prince, etc. Except that its the highest title anything could ever have.

Peace Radorth

Well so much for Muslims not insulting Christians, "spreading hatred" and accusing Christ of being a violent person. I knew their true feelings would show up, again.

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Spreadind hatred and accusing Christ of being a violent person?
I was just quoting the Holy Bible every Christian has at home... Just quoting my friend.
If someone should be blamed here, it's The Holy Bible not me.

So basically you are saying Christ was really just as violent as Muhammed. Correct Alexei? Is that your argument?

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Muhammed was not violent, just refer to the reply above and see that it was a self defense action.
Jesus Christ was not a violent, however the bunch who corrupted the Holy Bible made the Biblical Jesus a murderer.

That would certainly explain how you justify the violence of Muslims today.

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And

and thus begins another, "Muslims are all evil people who want to murder and kill, look I can show you by misquoting their holy book" thread

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It's like a conversation between deaf

Thx
Alexei</FONT>

Assalamu Aleikom.

Let's see... as far as I know, there's Five pilars of Islam:
Faith
Pray
Charity
Fastening
Travel to Mecca

Hm... it must be me, but I don't see any attack on those. Let's not judge a people for half-dozen maniacs, please.

Spreadind hatred and accusing Christ of being a violent person?
I was just quoting the Holy Bible every Christian has at home... Just quoting my friend.
If someone should be blamed here, it's The Holy Bible not me.

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And the difference between you doing that and us quoting the Koran is.......

(None)

Hey man, don't blame me. Blame the Koran.

OK, now what are these changes that were made to the NT exactly? We keep hearing these vague assertions, but no one has made a list for us to challenge- I assume because you have zero evidence of what was changed and what wasn't.

Rad

Let's see... as far as I know, there's Five pilars of Islam:
Faith
Pray
Charity
Fastening
Travel to Mecca

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Hey Alexei, anything wrong with this list? Tell the truth now.

Rad

Yeah, fastening isn't usually one of the five pillars.

Are these folks Muslims Alexei, or no?

http://www.yahoodi.com/peace/jihad.html

What is Jihad according to Muslim and Islamic Scholars and Authors?

"Islam wishes to destroy all States and Governments anywhere on the face of the earth which are opposed to the ideology and program of Islam. Islam requires the earth - not just a portion, but the whole planet." And that God's Law (Shariah) should be enforced in the world "by force of arms." Truth cannot be confined within geographical borders. "The allegiance of a Muslim does not rest on his domicile in the country which is his, but on the faith to which he belongs ... wherever there is the rule of Islam, there is his own country."

- S.A.A. Maududi "Jihad in Islam", Lahore, 1991

"Jihad has been decreed to repel aggression and to remove obstructions impeding the propagation of Islam in non-Islamic countries." As Lt.Col. M.M. Qureshi points out in his "Landmarks of Jihad", "only a war which has an ultimate religious purpose can be termed as jihad."

- Shayk Muhammad Abu Zahra, Egyptian member of the Academy of Islamic Research

Hasan al Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, called Jihad the sixth pillar of Islam. Its invitation is "to join a movement of social revolution to enforce its own program of reform which it deems best for the well-being of mankind." (Beware of an elite which thinks it knows best the needs of a class, a nation or mankind.) This movement which, the Qur'an calls "Hizb Allah", the Party of God, is left with no other choice except to capture State Authority. Thus Jihad will include Qital (fighting). But "war in Islam is not a casual phenomenon of violence; it is one of the phases of man's striving (Jihad) against all that is evil ... The raising of the sword is only one aspect of the all-round struggle to establish Islam in the world." "Wage war for the sake of Allah. Kill whoever denies Him." (Muhammad) "Jihad has been made obligatory (against pagans and people of the Book) on every Muslim by ....... and in His eyes avoidance of Jihad is the greatest sin."

Each Muslim should have an ambition for martyrdom, be a lover of death. (Every martyr shall have seventy deer-eyed houris as his consorts. ) "Jihad shall continue until the Day of Judgment." (Muhammad)

- S.A.A. Maududi & A.H. Siddiqi "Jihad in Islam", Lahore, 1991

revolutio said:

Yeah, fastening isn't usually one of the five pillars.

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You mean they can drive without seatbelts? Is that it?

Rad

aforchrist33 said:

...I sugested every nation agree to help return Israel completely to the Jews! And yes deport if I may add every Israeli government rebelious trespassers to their own native land.

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That will be rather difficult in many cases. Genetic research shows that a great many Palestinians actually could be of Israeli descent! They are merely converts to Islam (along with a number who are adherents of Christianity). To deport them is to deport genetic Israelis from their own land--genetically speaking, that is.

Anyone else notice that our friend has taken an extremist possition because he doesn't like the muslim extremists?

Look, I'm no more pro-Islamic than I am pro-Christian. What would you say if a Muslim qoted Fred Phelps of Westborough Baptist Church, Christian Identity, the Coucil of Conservative Christians, or a host of other Christian Hate groups? Most Chrisitans would say they do not truely represent Christianity, well most Muslims would say the same thing about the people your quoting. The same could be said for taking passages out of context, before cutting and pasting text from some hate website perhaps you should take a few minutes to try and understand the context of the passage. Maybe even ask one of the Muslims on this board for an explanation.

It's my understanding that it is possible to take Bible passages, twist them and make the Bible say anything you want it to say. Might not the same be possible with other scriptures?

radorth said:

Are these folks Muslims Alexei, or no?

http://www.yahoodi.com/peace/jihad.html

What is Jihad according to Muslim and Islamic Scholars and Authors?

"Islam wishes to destroy all States and Governments anywhere on the face of the earth which are opposed to the ideology and program of Islam. Islam requires the earth - not just a portion, but the whole planet." And that God's Law (Shariah) should be enforced in the world "by force of arms." Truth cannot be confined within geographical borders. "The allegiance of a Muslim does not rest on his domicile in the country which is his, but on the faith to which he belongs ... wherever there is the rule of Islam, there is his own country."

- S.A.A. Maududi "Jihad in Islam", Lahore, 1991

"Jihad has been decreed to repel aggression and to remove obstructions impeding the propagation of Islam in non-Islamic countries." As Lt.Col. M.M. Qureshi points out in his "Landmarks of Jihad", "only a war which has an ultimate religious purpose can be termed as jihad."

- Shayk Muhammad Abu Zahra, Egyptian member of the Academy of Islamic Research

Hasan al Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, called Jihad the sixth pillar of Islam. Its invitation is "to join a movement of social revolution to enforce its own program of reform which it deems best for the well-being of mankind." (Beware of an elite which thinks it knows best the needs of a class, a nation or mankind.) This movement which, the Qur'an calls "Hizb Allah", the Party of God, is left with no other choice except to capture State Authority. Thus Jihad will include Qital (fighting). But "war in Islam is not a casual phenomenon of violence; it is one of the phases of man's striving (Jihad) against all that is evil ... The raising of the sword is only one aspect of the all-round struggle to establish Islam in the world." "Wage war for the sake of Allah. Kill whoever denies Him." (Muhammad) "Jihad has been made obligatory (against pagans and people of the Book) on every Muslim by ....... and in His eyes avoidance of Jihad is the greatest sin."

Each Muslim should have an ambition for martyrdom, be a lover of death. (Every martyr shall have seventy deer-eyed houris as his consorts. ) "Jihad shall continue until the Day of Judgment." (Muhammad)

- S.A.A. Maududi & A.H. Siddiqi "Jihad in Islam", Lahore, 1991

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You missed part of the quote there.

So, why dont you show that love?

aforchrist33 said:

Anyone else suppose "Our Friend" might love all People but not their actions? Or should anyone else chose to rather "notice that our friend doesn't like the muslim" ?

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Here is something I find so funny, the one of the founders of the Muslim religion was introduced........in the bible, when Abraham impregnanted the Sarah's maid instead of doing what God says, the baby (Ishmael) and mother was suppose to go in hiding (I believe, someone please corrected me, I can't remember the story that well right now)...interesting...I'm not going to debate just wanted to point it out.

It is in Genesis 21:8, I find it funny but it's just me, I'm weird like that.