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hindsey said:
How do you find it to be more "truthful?"

Have you read that particular translation?

Here's an example of what's in this particular translation, which is not in the current translation(s):

Lection XC
1. AGAIN the twelve were gathered together in the Circle of palm trees, and one of them even Thomas said to the other, What is Truth? for the same things appear different to different minds, and even to the same mind at different times. What, then, is Truth?
2. And as they were speaking Jesus appeared in their midst and said, Truth, one and absolute, is in God alone, for no man, neither any body of men, knoweth that which God alone knoweth, who is the All in All.. To men is Truth revealed, according to their capacity to understand and receive.
3. The One Truth hath many sides, and one seeth one side only, another seeth another, and some see more than others, according as it is given to them.
4. Behold this crystal: how the one light its manifest in twelve faces, yea four times twelve, and each face reflecteth one ray of light, and one regardeth one face, and another another, but it is the one crystal and the one light that shineth in all.
5. Behold again, When one climbeth a mountain and attaining one height, he saith, This is the top of the mountain, let us reach it, and when they have reached that height, lo, they see another beyond it until they come to that height from which no other height is to be seen, if so be they can attain it.
6. So it is with Truth. I am the Truth and the Way and the Life, and have given to you the Truth I have received from above. And that which is seen and received by one, is not seen and received by another. That which appeareth true to some, seemeth not true to others. They who are in the valley see not as they who are on the hill top.
7. But to each, it is the Truth as the one mind seeth it, and for that time, till a higher Truth shall be revealed unto the same: and to the soul which receiveth higher light, shall be given more light. Wherefore condemn not others, that ye be not condemned.
8. As ye keep the holy Law of Love, which I have given unto you, so shall the Truth be revealed more and more unto you, and the Spirit of Truth which cometh from above shall guide you, albeit through many wanderings, into all Truth, even as the fiery cloud guided the children of Israel through the wilderness.
9. Be faithful to the light ye have, till a higher light is given to you. Seek more light, and ye shall have abundantly; rest not, till ye find.
10. God giveth you all Truth, as a ladder with many steps, for the salvation and perfection of the soul, and the truth which seemeth to day, ye will abandon for the higher truth of the morrow. Press ye unto Perfection.
11. Whoso keepeth the holy Law which I have given, the same shall save their souls, however differently they may see the truths which I have given.
12. Many shall say unto me, Lord, Lord, we have been zealous for thy Truth. But I shall say unto them, Nay, but, that others may see as ye see, and none other truth beside. Faith without charity is dead. Love is the fulfilling of the Law.
13. How shall faith in what they receive profit them that hold it in unrighteousness? They who have love have all things, and without love there is nothing worth. Let each hold what they see to be the truth in love, knowing that where love is not, truth is a dead letter and profiteth nothing.
14. There abide Goodness, and Truth, and Beauty, but the greatest of these is Goodness. If any have hatred to their fellows, and harden their hearts to the creatures of God’s hands, how can they see Truth unto salvation, seeing their eyes are blinded and their hearts are hardened to God’s creation?
15. As I have reveived the Truth, so have I given it to you. Let each receive it according to their light and ability to understand, and persecute not those who receive it after a different interpretation.
16. For Truth is the Might of God, and it shall prevail in the end over all errors. But the holy Law which I have given is plain for all, and just and good. Let all observe it for the salvation of their souls.
 
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dvd_holc

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"I do think there are people that pick a version because it matches the doctrine that they like better. And I know there are people that have made a new translation in order to make it match their doctrine. I am not saying that's the norm. It's more important to try to get to the right meaning than trying to get to the one that you want."

I agree...But I am not making my own doctrine. I have heard about a bible that changed God from God the Father to God the Mother, and all the other associated things that surround that to reflect that. I don't agree with that. I do think that ideas of some words none a days don't convey the message that some words meant awhile ago to a different culture. Also, there are differences between LAB to TNIV and other bibles...the differences are in the structuring of words within the sentence. I still like the LAB for all the commentary in it. I have had trouble following people while reading LAB, but I ask myself does the passage say the samething. The ultimate authority is the Holy Spirit. No one can read the bible and understand unless you ask the HS. So when guided by the HS we will know the truth. Let God deals with the false doctrines...I am not saying we should let them go by...but we should always profess the truth and support the truth. If others disagree, look at the supporting details. If it does not glorify God then...you know the answer.

I do not think the KJV is the best for me since it is structured in a language that I don't use. I can read it, but it is still not under my normal thought process which makes me work harder to understand. There is a difference from English in the time (OLD, Middle, Mordern)...and there is difference in English between American and Britain...I have said this so that you will know that language is point of matter to me. I am not going to by rigid to think just one form of the bible is the only form when I know:
1) we have a difference in ideas of certain words like peace. Look at Greek meaning verses Hebrew.
2) the orgins of the thoughts were in another culture and time that although I have a little knowledge about them does not mean I understand how it was intend in it's orignal context.
 
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Saint_George

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No offense or anything but I don't like the KJV. It's got to many errors.


[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Here is a partial listing of King James Version translation errors:[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Genesis 1:2 should read "And the earth became without form . . . ." The word translated "was" is hayah, and denotes a condition different than a former condition, as in Genesis 19:26.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Genesis 10:9 should read " . . . Nimrod the mighty hunter in place of [in opposition to] the LORD." The word "before" is incorrect and gives the connotation that Nimrod was a good guy, which is false.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Leviticus 16:8, 10, 26 in the KJV is "scapegoat" which today has the connotation of someone who is unjustly blamed for other's sins. The Hebrew is Azazel, which means "one removed or separated." The Azazel goal represents Satan, who is no scapegoat. He is guilty of his part in our sins.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Deuteronomy 24:1, "then let him" should be "and he." As the Savior explained in Matthew 19, Moses did not command divorcement. This statute is regulating the permission of divorce because of the hardness of their hearts.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]II Kings 2:23, should be "young men", not "little children." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Isaiah 65:17 should be "I am creating [am about to create] new heavens and new earth . . . ."[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Ezekiel 20:25 should read "Wherefore I permitted them, or gave them over to, [false] statutes that are not good, and judgments whereby they should not live." God's laws are good, perfect and right. This verse shows that since Israel rejected God's laws, He allowed them to hurt themselves by following false man made customs and laws. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Daniel 8:14 is correct in the margin, which substitutes "evening morning" for "days." Too bad William Miller didn't realize this. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Malachi 4:6 should read " . . . lest I come and smite the earth with utter destruction." "Curse" doesn't give the proper sense here. Same word used in Zechariah 14:11. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Matthew 5:48 should be "Become ye therefore perfect" rather than "be ye therefore perfect." "Perfect" here means "spiritually mature." Sanctification is a process of overcoming with the aid of the Holy Spirit. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Matthew 24:22 needs an additional word to clarify the meaning. It should say "there should no flesh be saved alive." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Matthew 27:49 omits text which was in the original. Moffatt correctly adds it, while the RSV puts it in a footnote: "And another took a spear and pierced His side, and out came water and blood." The Savior's death came when a soldier pierced His side, Revelation 1:7. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Matthew 28:1, "In the end of the sabbath as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week . . ." should be translated literally, "Now late on Sabbath, as it was getting dusk toward the first day of the week . . . ." The Sabbath does not end at dawn but at dusk. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Luke 2:14 should say, "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace among men of God's good pleasure or choosing." That is, there will be peace on earth among men who have God's good will in their hearts. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Luke 14:26 has the unfortunate translation of the Greek word miseo, Strong's #3404, as "hate", when it should be rendered "love less by comparison." We are not to hate our parents and family! [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]John 1:31, 33 should say "baptize" or "baptizing IN water" not with water. Pouring or sprinkling with water is not the scriptural method of baptism, but only thorough immersion in water. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]John 1:17 is another instance of a poor preposition. "By" should be "through": "For the law was given by [through] Moses . . . ." Moses did not proclaim his law, but God's Law. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]John 13:2 should be "And during supper" (RSV) rather than "And supper being ended" (KJV).[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Acts 12:4 has the inaccurate word "Easter" which should be rendered "Passover." The Greek word is pascha which is translated correctly as Passover in Matthew 26:2, etc.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I Corinthians 1:18 should be: "For the preaching of the cross is to them that are perishing foolishness; but unto us which are being saved it is the power of God", rather than "perish" and "are saved." Likewise, II Thessalonians 2:10 should be "are perishing" rather than "perish." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I Corinthians 15:29 should be: "Else what shall they do which are baptized for the hope of the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the hope of the dead?" [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]II Corinthians 6:2 should be "a day of salvation", instead of "the day of salvation." This is a quote from Isaiah 49:8, which is correct. The day of salvation is not the same for each individual. The firstfruits have their day of salvation during this life. The rest in the second resurrection. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I Timothy 4:8 should say, "For bodily exercise profiteth for a little time: but godliness in profitable unto all things . . . ." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I Timothy 6:10 should be, "For the love of money is a [not the] root of all evil . . . ." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Hebrews 4:8 should be "Joshua" rather than "Jesus", although these two words are Hebrew and Greek equivalents. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Hebrews 4:9 should read, "There remaineth therefore a keeping of a sabbath to the people of God." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Hebrews 9:28 is out of proper order in the King James. It should be: "So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them without sin that look for him shall he appear the second time unto salvation." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I John 5:7-8 contains additional text which was added to the original. "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one." The italicized text was added to the original manuscripts. Most modern translations agree that this was an uninspired addition to the Latin Vulgate to support the unscriptural trinity doctrine. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Revelation 14:4 should be "a firstfruits", because the 144,000 are not all the firstfruits. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Revelation 20:4-5 in the KJV is a little confusing until you realize that the sentence "This is the first resurrection." in verse five refers back to "they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years" in verse four. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Revelation 20:10, "And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are [correction: should be 'were cast' because the beast and false prophet were mortal human beings who were burned up in the lake of fire 1,000 years previous to this time, Revelation 19:20], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." The point is that Satan will be cast into the same lake of fire into which the beast and false prophet were cast a thousand years previously. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Revelation 22:2 should be "health" rather than "healing."[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Italics: Sometimes Helpful, Sometimes Wrong [/font]
[font=Times New Roman, Arial]No language can be translated word for word into another language. Hebrew and Greek idioms often do not come through clearly into literal English. Thus, beginning in 1560 with the Geneva Bible, translators initiated the practice of adding italicized clarifying words to make the original language more plain. The fifty-four King James translators did the same. Often, the added italicized words do help make the meaning clearer. At other times, the translators through their doctrinal misunderstandings added errors instead. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]In Psalms 81:4, "was" is totally uncalled for and not in the original Hebrew. New Moons are still a statute of God. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]We have shown how in Revelation 20:10 that the italicized "are" is incorrect and that "were cast" in italics would have been more appropriate. Another instance is John 8:28 where Jesus said (KJV), "I am he." The "he" is in italics and was not actually spoken by Jesus, completely obscuring the fact the Jesus was claiming to be the great "I AM" of the Old Testament, John 8:58 and Exodus 3:14. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]In Luke 3:23-38, the italicized words "the son" are not in the original Greek. Actually, Luke gives the fleshly descent of the Savior through Mary, while Matthew gives the legal descent through Joseph. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Matthew 24:24 should not have the italicized words "it were". It IS possible for the elect to be deceived. We need to be on guard! [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Romans 1:7 incorrectly has the italicized words "to be." The fact is, Christians are now saints. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I Corinthians 7:19 needs some italicized words to make the meaning clear. It should say: "Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but [the important thing is] the keeping of the commandments of God." [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Colossians 2:16-17 can be properly understood only if the KJV italicized word "is" in verse 17 is left out, as it should be. The message of these verses is: don't let men judge you as doing wrong when you observe the holy days, new moons and sabbaths; let the body of Christ (the Church) do the judging.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I Timothy 3:11 has "their" in italics, which is not implied in the original. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]II Peter 2:5 should not have "person, a." Noah was the eighth preacher of righteousness. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]I John 2:23 has "[but] he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also" in italics. This is an addition based upon the Latin text and not in the original Greek. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Punctuation Problems [/font]
[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Luke 23:43 has been erroneously used by some to claim that Jesus went straight to heaven at His death. The original Greek did not have punctuation marks as we do today. The KJV states, "And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." The comma should not be after "thee", but "day." The believing malefactor would be with Christ in the paradise of the redeemed when he was resurrected far into the future. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman, Arial]Mark 16:9 does not say that Jesus was resurrected Sunday morning. There is a missing implied comma between "risen" and "early" and there should be no comma after week as the KJV has it: "Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene . . . ." Thus, it should say, "Now when Jesus was risen, early the first day of the week he appeared first to Mary Magdalene . . . ."
[/font]
 
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hindsey

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Saint_George said:
No offense or anything but I don't like the KJV. It's got to many errors.


[/font]
Saint_George, I see that many of those "errors" (noticing specifically the first 3) all use the words "connotation." Your source is saying that it is an error because the language of today is different than the language of 1611. That is not an error, that is a change in language.

Everytime your source says that it should be "such and such" instead of "such and such." I have to say, "Says who?" When I read about the guys that translated the KJV, their knowledge of languages was incredible - ridiculously incredible actually. (I include a link if you're interested in seeing who they were: http://wilderness-cry.net/bible_study/translators/) So, to say that these guys made a mistake in translating a word, I find it hard to believe. You can say that they translated from a different manuscript, and that is a differnet argumen. But I tend to believe that those guys that translated the KJV did an accurate job.
 
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Normann

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JBrian said:
Hello, are any of you out there King James Only? I am interested in your arguments if you are.

Thanks,

Brian

While I will not destroy a different version, I do question their intent. Many of the (other bibles) are not translations; they are intreptations. The problem is what mind or minds did the intreptation?

I will stay with the old standard KJV.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann
 
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Normann

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Uphill Battle said:
My parents church only uses the KJV, but I have no such bias. I tend to use NCV, NIV, and for just reading purposes, NLT.


Luke 2:14 KJV
Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.

Below is a problem with one of the (other bibles).
Warning: the following scripture is perverted...
Luke 2:14 RSV

Glory to God in the highest and on earth peace, good will among men with whom He is well pleased.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann
 
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Normann

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mrcrow said:
dangerous ground king james only...we need to paraphrase to understand better and use a comprehensive commentary regime...
unless you read direct from the greek and hebrew you might not get the whole biscuit..
...niv and message along with barclays and zondervan's commentaries
sometimes i wonder if jesus and paul really meant what they said
:sick: :scratch: :blush:


Dangerous thinking my friend, depending on another man's commentaries and paraphrase. Here are just two examples...
KJV John 3:16 ...he gave his only begotten Son...

NIV John 3:16 ...he gave his one and only son...

Note: God has more than one son; see Job 2:1; Rom 8:14; John 1:12 and other passages.

Jesus Christ is the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON.

Now compare KJV 1 Sam. 20:30 to the same passage in the Living Bible.

Space will not allow me to list the dozens of other changes in the so called (other bibles). This is not a "personal thing" because I at one time also believed the (other bibles) were just the same with different words.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann
 
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Zadok7000

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The KJV is the only one you can use to go back to the original Hebrew and Greek via the Stong's Concordance. Hence, the only one to use. The translators themselves in their "letter to the readers" acknowledge they probably made mistakes and to check them out. It has been an invaluable combination in my studies.
HIS WORD is written in Hebrew and Greek, not English, so it is incumbant upon us as Christians to study to show ourselves approved.
 
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Normann

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mrcrow said:
if you dont use a comprehensive commentary you will lose hundreds of years of personal revelation by the authors...

Just in the CF alone there are comments (personal revelations) and many of them differ. If we trust anyone or any thing other than the Bible, which commentator is correct?

For myself I will stay with the KJV and not depend on anyone to explain it. The Bible is clear enough within itself. Eternity is too long to put it in the hands of a commentator.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann
 
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Normann

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Zadok7000 said:
The KJV is the only one you can use to go back to the original Hebrew and Greek via the Stong's Concordance. Hence, the only one to use. The translators themselves in their "letter to the readers" acknowledge they probably made mistakes and to check them out. It has been an invaluable combination in my studies.
HIS WORD is written in Hebrew and Greek, not English, so it is incumbant upon us as Christians to study to show ourselves approved.


May I repeat your words, I like them.

Thanks,
Normann
 
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onajourney87

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Zadok7000 said:
The KJV is the only one you can use to go back to the original Hebrew and Greek via the Stong's Concordance. Hence, the only one to use. The translators themselves in their "letter to the readers" acknowledge they probably made mistakes and to check them out. It has been an invaluable combination in my studies.
HIS WORD is written in Hebrew and Greek, not English, so it is incumbant upon us as Christians to study to show ourselves approved.

NASB has the Strong's numbers stuff for original Hebrew/Greek; just harder to come by one of those than a KJV with 'em. :)

osm
 
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If I'm going to do a research paper, I'm not going to use just one source to help me understand the material. I will use multiple sources and make my conclusions based off similarities and/or differences between those sources. Similarly, when I look at a confusing Bible verse, I prefer to use multiple versions as well as look up the original Hebrew/Greek to get the most accurate picture of what I am trying to understand.

Therefore I am not KJV-only.
 
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Normann

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Scholar in training said:
If I'm going to do a research paper, I'm not going to use just one source to help me understand the material. I will use multiple sources and make my conclusions based off similarities and/or differences between those sources. Similarly, when I look at a confusing Bible verse, I prefer to use multiple versions as well as look up the original Hebrew/Greek to get the most accurate picture of what I am trying to understand.
Therefore I am not KJV-only.

KJV: Zech. 13:6
And one shall say unto him, What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.

Living Bible: Zech. 13:6 And if someone asks, then what are these scars on your chest and on your back? He will say, I got into a brawl at the home of a friend.

Two different views altogether.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann
 
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deu58

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Hi Normann

Normann said:
KJV: Zech. 13:6
And one shall say unto him, What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.

Living Bible: Zech. 13:6 And if someone asks, then what are these scars on your chest and on your back? He will say, I got into a brawl at the home of a friend.

Two different views altogether.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann

Which tranlation is the most correct? 13:16 is known as messianic prophecy becuase of the way it is worded ,

I know that there are acouple of the newer tranlations that have changed the John 8 passage where Jesus says "before Abraham was, I AM " to "because I existed before Abraham was born"

Which completely changes the meaning of that verse,
yours in Christ
deu 58
 
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