Terri Schavio: Lastest Developments and Discussions (Take 2)

Yojimbo said:

WHOA!


Michael Schiavo agrees to allow autopsy of Terri

But...but...but Michael, everyone will uncover your murder plan!!!

So how do people think Michael will sneak into the autopsy lab to tamper with Terri's otherwise functional brain? I predict he'll dress up in a ninja suit and break in at past 2AM.

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That ought to add spice to the inevitable TV-movie...

[font=Verdana,Sans-serif]The husband of brain-damaged Florida woman Terri Schiavo has ordered an autopsy after she dies to silence allegations his plan to cremate her body is aimed at hiding something, his lawyer said on Monday.[/font]

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Uh-huh. They had better have NEUTRAL M.E's there to make sure that Michael does NOT have anything to hide.

I just don't buy this sudden change of heart from Michael; after all, his actions, his words, his behavior belie the loving husband role for over 7 years~ he refused Terri rehab, he refused her visitation rights, he refused a lot of things to Terri that we all take for granted...and she virtually had NO basic rights, even as a "living" body with SOME brain left in there.

Why do I get the feeling that one of those days, someone in Michael's life will step foward and says that Michael danced for joy over Terri's death?

BlessedMan said:

Definition please?

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This is regarding the comment I posted about living a life proper to a human being, so I'll clarify as best I can. It's late, I've just gotten off work and I have to be up early, so keep that in mind while you read this.

Life as a human being is more than respiring, digesting and blinking. This may fulfill the bare minimum of being alive, but it does not begin to be proper to the life of a human being.

Human life, fully human, involves far more subtle qualities: consciousness, self-awareness, will, meaningful action, abstraction from reality in the process of planning, creating and the reward of congruence the facts of nature, etc. These things we do on a daily basis, on a momentary thought, and this is proper to our nature as human beings. To be kept chained to a feeding tube, a respirator, to be kept physically alive when there is no consciousness to drive that body, is both an affront to Ms. Schiavo's dignity, and to everyone else's dignity as a human being.

The proponents of keeping her biologically alive don't argue that the brain damage she suffered is profound, nor do they argue that she probably has little hope of even partial recovery. And everyone agrees at this point at least, she's not the woman mentally she used to be.

The issue here is that they cling to the shred of an unfounded hope that "someday" she might recover. How much is anybody's guess, but the real crime here is that the supporters of the feeding tube ignore the facts of her existence RIGHT NOW, and try to invoke a nigh impossible fantasy as justification for keeping her body in this disgusting parody of life.

But, this view of a parody of a life is not inconsistent with writings I've read by Christians on the very nature of life; Mother Theresa of Calcutta lauds suffering and misery as being key to reaching oneness with God. Many Christians see the natural, the physical and the corporeal as being disgusting and depraved, and a satisfaction of that IMO is what they see in Terri Schiavo - her form is how they see human life, mindless, helpless, weak and perpetuated on the mercy of outsiders, i.e. God. Schaivo is the embodiment of their goal, to trap Man in dependence on God, to tie his hands with his own good will, to use the best in him to seek the worst expression of depravity.

In short, they take compassion and turn it against honor for life. What I argue is that life as a human being requires the abstract notion of dignity, respect, and right of self-determination. Terri did not want to live this way, none of us do. This is anathema to a life proper to our existence as human beings. The right thing to do is let her die, the way her mind died some 15 years ago, and let the memory of her be of a fully functioning person with dreams, hopes and successes, not as some political football, some drooling half-live zombie, or puppet for those who hate the most beautiful part of human life.

loribee59 said:

Uh-huh. They had better have NEUTRAL M.E's there to make sure that Michael does NOT have anything to hide.

I just don't buy this sudden change of heart from Michael; after all, his actions, his words, his behavior belie the loving husband role for over 7 years~ he refused Terri rehab, he refused her visitation rights, he refused a lot of things to Terri that we all take for granted...and she virtually had NO basic rights, even as a "living" body with SOME brain left in there.

Why do I get the feeling that one of those days, someone in Michael's life will step foward and says that Michael danced for joy over Terri's death?

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Because you've been misled about Michael's character? That's probably why you would think that he would dance in celebration at her death.

New York Times said:

List of Schiavo Donors Will Be Sold by Direct-Marketing Firm

By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK and JOHN SCHWARTZ

ASHINGTON, March 28 - The parents of Terri Schiavo have authorized a conservative direct-mailing firm to sell a list of their financial supporters, making it likely that thousands of strangers moved by her plight will receive a steady stream of solicitations from anti-abortion and conservative groups.

"These compassionate pro-lifers donated toward Bob Schindler's legal battle to keep Terri's estranged husband from removing the feeding tube from Terri," says a description of the list on the Web site of the firm, Response Unlimited, which is asking $150 a month for 6,000 names and $500 a month for 4,000 e-mail addresses of people who responded last month to an e-mail plea from Ms. Schiavo's father. "These individuals are passionate about the way they value human life, adamantly oppose euthanasia and are pro-life in every sense of the word!"

Privacy experts said the sale of the list was legal and even predictable, if ghoulish.

"I think it's amusing," said Robert Gellman, a privacy and information policy consultant. "I think it's absolutely classic America. Everything is for sale in America, every type of personal information."

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http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/29/politics/29donate.html?ei=5088&en=eff131665ae17165&ex=1269752400&partner=rssnyt&pagewanted=print&position=

I love this article. I wish I could make it its own thread is how much I love it. Everything is for sale, indeed...

BLESSEDBETHEMEEK said:

I just got done reading a report about Terri's brain activity.. there is none visible to to the doctors.
The whole Morphine thing is for her families comfort...

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This is exactly what I said they were doing when someone posted the article about the morphine earlier. Breathing becomes more labored, which can be unsettling for some, so you administer morphine to quell the family, it doesn't really do anything.

Yojimbo said:

WHOA!


Michael Schiavo agrees to allow autopsy of Terri

But...but...but Michael, everyone will uncover your murder plan!!!

So how do people think Michael will sneak into the autopsy lab to tamper with Terri's otherwise functional brain? I predict he'll dress up in a ninja suit and break in at past 2AM.

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If Michael needs a ninja, he definitely should get a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle! Turtle Power! Now let me get the shell out of here.

Packaging the Delivery

Some of the mind control work done to package the delivery:

• - "$1 million dollar baby" to present "euthanasia" as good for the victims: Hollywood made it film of the year
• - the media keeps repeating the official story of a vegetable dying, in the scope of the dehumanization of Terri, one of the reasons being it's a measurable link to the Florida Law that considers killing animals by starvation a crime;
• - $1 million dollar hoax to present the "husband" as good: the noble husband refused a (hoax) offer of $1 million to keep Terri alive
• - $1 million dollar hoax to present mass murder of elder, disabled and sick people as good for the economy: costs for Terri so far $1,1 million
• - the "liberal democrats" criticise the "christian fundamentalist" Bush, who "jumped out of bed" to "interrupt his holidays" and "sign a law" that is "interfering" with the "justice" to make people say "The Bushes have done everything possible."
• - media manufactures "polls" (the big lie sky, i.e. 80%, is no more the limit ...), "proving" that the large majority is behind the "husband" -The CBS News poll that reported 82 percent of all Americans wanted the government out of the case - which provide the right excuse for people to say "Bush sure turned silent in a hurry."

I just heard on talk radio that a friend of Terri's went into her room and began telling her stories about them dancing and Terri raised her arms and tried to dance.

I wasn't theres
so I dunno
but all I gotta say is
goooo Terri gooooo!!

I love you Terri

brinny said:

I just heard on talk radio that a friend of Terri's went into her room and began telling her stories about them dancing and Terri raised her arms and tried to dance.

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Haha. That's great. Talk radio sure is wacky.




You are joking, I presume.

brinny said:

I just heard on talk radio that a friend of Terri's went into her room and began telling her stories about them dancing and Terri raised her arms and tried to dance.

I wasn't theres
so I dunno
but all I gotta say is
goooo Terri gooooo!!

I love you Terri

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This story must be false because even at this point, a person fully conscious wouldn't be able to move after their feeding tube has been out for over a week.

charmtrap said:

Haha. That's great. Talk radio sure is wacky.

You are joking, I presume.

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I don't think it's a joke...

charmtrap said:

Haha. That's great. Talk radio sure is wacky.




You are joking, I presume.

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Aah I see you are full of joy as well.

MattMarriott said:

Packaging the Delivery

Some of the mind control work done to package the delivery:

• - media manufactures "polls" (the big lie sky, i.e. 80%, is no more the limit ...), "proving" that the large majority is behind the "husband" -The CBS News poll that reported 82 percent of all Americans wanted the government out of the case - which provide the right excuse for people to say "Bush sure turned silent in a hurry."

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You sure like scare quotes.

Question, though: How did CBS get Fox, CNN, ABC and Gallup to go along with the manufactured polls?

Man, those Illuminati guys are everywhere.

Ninja Turtles said:

This story must be false because even at this point, a person fully conscious wouldn't be able to move after their feeding tube has been out for over a week.

I don't think it's a joke...

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False? Ok, maybe.

But it's cool as can be
made me wanna
jump up n' down with glee
and go hee hee hee

*gives Terri a cyber high five*

Woooooooo Hooooooooooo!!!!

I am officially sick to death of the whole debacle.

brinny said:

False? Ok, maybe.

But it's cool as can be
made me wanna
jump up n' down with glee
and go hee hee hee

*gives Terri a cyber high five*

Woooooooo Hooooooooooo!!!!

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I personally don't think it's all that "cool" that people are manufacturing outright lies and impossible stories to get their way.

Hypocrisy is just plain sad. I think it's pretty clear at this point that neither side really cares about Terri Shiavo as a human being at this point.

To those who support her husband (and I include myself in this category), she's a legal conundrum -- a future footnote in the law histories, and an endorsement for living wills.

To those who support her family, she's a cause to fight for -- A martyr in the making, and a political goldmine of soundbytes and photo-ops.

And it's pretty clear that both sides have their share of zealots tossing the rule book out the window...

The difference? One side's claiming legal superiority, the other claims moral superiority.

And I'm fed up with the whole sordid thing.

Nathan Poe said:

I am officially sick to death of the whole debacle.



I personally don't think it's all that "cool" that people are manufacturing outright lies and impossible stories to get their way.

Hypocrisy is just plain sad. I think it's pretty clear at this point that neither side really cares about Terri Shiavo as a human being at this point.

To those who support her husband (and I include myself in this category), she's a legal conundrum -- a future footnote in the law histories, and an endorsement for living wills.

To those who support her family, she's a cause to fight for -- A martyr in the making, and a political goldmine of soundbytes and photo-ops.

And it's pretty clear that both sides have their share of zealots tossing the rule book out the window...

The difference? One side's claiming legal superiority, the other claims moral superiority.

And I'm fed up with the whole sordid thing.

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You know, even though I stand on the other side (I want her to stay alive).........I agree with you. This whole thing has shown a really nasty side of human nature that I'd have preferred to pretend didn't exist. At least not in such huge numbers. I'm nearly at the point that I don't know which is worse, her starving to death, or her being used and exploited by everyone who wants either airtime or votes. The whole thing is tragic for a myriad of reasons.

Christi said:

You know, even though I stand on the other side (I want her to stay alive).........I agree with you. This whole thing has shown a really nasty side of human nature that I'd have preferred to pretend didn't exist. At least not in such huge numbers. I'm nearly at the point that I don't know which is worse, her starving to death, or her being used and exploited by everyone who wants either airtime or votes. The whole thing is tragic for a myriad of reasons.

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And the worst is yet to come.

Round II will be Terri's burial. Michael wants her cremated; the parents want a more traditional burial.

Of course, the law is (and has always been) perfectly clear: As the legal guardian, Michael is next-of-kin. He has the final say.

But the family will not give up without a fight, and I predict a debacle only slightly less sickening than this one.

Shorter, perhaps: Michael will have a trunkload of court victories already on his side confirming his status as legal guardian.

But when THAT legal circus begins, the same people will be fighting the same battles... with the predictably same results.

Nathan Poe said:

And the worst is yet to come.

Round II will be Terri's burial. Michael wants her cremated; the parents want a more traditional burial.

Of course, the law is (and has always been) perfectly clear: As the legal guardian, Michael is next-of-kin. He has the final say.

But the family will not give up without a fight, and I predict a debacle only slightly less sickening than this one.

Shorter, perhaps: Michael will have a trunkload of court victories already on his side confirming his status as legal guardian.

But when THAT legal circus begins, the same people will be fighting the same battles... with the predictably same results.

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At least an autopsy will be performed, As stated by Atty Folos, to see the extent of the "Brain damage".
Maybe at the same time, The past injuries and stuff will be investigated that were shown in the bone scans years ago. One was performed 53 weeks after she went into the hospice and many old injuries were seen in it.

Nathan Poe said:

And the worst is yet to come.

Round II will be Terri's burial. Michael wants her cremated; the parents want a more traditional burial.

Of course, the law is (and has always been) perfectly clear: As the legal guardian, Michael is next-of-kin. He has the final say.

But the family will not give up without a fight, and I predict a debacle only slightly less sickening than this one.

Shorter, perhaps: Michael will have a trunkload of court victories already on his side confirming his status as legal guardian.

But when THAT legal circus begins, the same people will be fighting the same battles... with the predictably same results.

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If we disregard all the media coverage and the political attempts, and assume the best from all the people involved, and we should, since none of us even KNOW them) it's easy to understand how they all feel the way they do. It's even easy to see why they've done what they've done, assuming pure motives to all parties. What's weird is how we've all decided it's our business!
There are so many different issues involved with this case, it's like a free-for-all for everyone. There's "right to life", "activist judges", "rights for the disabled", etc. etc. The real thing is about parents who love their daughter and don't want to let her go, and a husband who doesn't believe she's really still "here" and believes she wouldn't want to live this way. Meanwhile, a woman is laying in a hospice dying of starvation, while a circus is going on outside the building. And another thing, why are these lawyers still giving press conferences about how Terri looks? The legal battle is over. Are we so morbid as a society that we really need the details on how someone looks who has been without food and water for 12 days?

Christi said:

If we disregard all the media coverage and the political attempts, and assume the best from all the people involved, and we should, since none of us even KNOW them) it's easy to understand how they all feel the way they do. It's even easy to see why they've done what they've done, assuming pure motives to all parties. What's weird is how we've all decided it's our business!
There are so many different issues involved with this case, it's like a free-for-all for everyone. There's "right to life", "activist judges", "rights for the disabled", etc. etc. The real thing is about parents who love their daughter and don't want to let her go, and a husband who doesn't believe she's really still "here" and believes she wouldn't want to live this way. Meanwhile, a woman is laying in a hospice dying of starvation, while a circus is going on outside the building. And another thing, why are these lawyers still giving press conferences about how Terri looks? The legal battle is over. Are we so morbid as a society that we really need the details on how someone looks who has been without food and water for 12 days?

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Good points Christi. Maybe those who support her death so strongly, Should see what she looks like and what she has suffered to this point.
I have a better idea, Let's do this to the death row inmates and really cause a media circus. Watch the court cases come flooding in for cruel and unusual punishment. I do have a question tho, If Terri doesn't feel any pain, WHY is she getting morphine for pain ?? That is a true head scratcher.

I'ddie4him said:

Good points Christi. Maybe those who support her death so strongly, Should see what she looks like and what she has suffered to this point.
I have a better idea, Let's do this to the death row inmates and really cause a media circus. Watch the court cases come flooding in for cruel and unusual punishment. I do have a question tho, If Terri doesn't feel any pain, WHY is she getting morphine for pain ?? That is a true head scratcher.

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She most probably does feel pain, and I imagine she looks horrible. I can't imagine the horror of it. My point is that I'm just so tired of seeing what this human, personal struggle turned into a bandwagon for everyone who feels they have something to gain. Even Jesse Jackson's in on it now, although he's taken a different position than I would have thought. I'm disappointed in the governor and the president for not having the courage of their own convictions for the long term. I've also found myself thinking alot about the millions of mothers in poverty-stricken countries holding their children in their arms and watch them starve to death. I never see that on the news. I'm sick of the media too. So that brings my list of what I'm sick of up to: Judges, lawyers, politicians, media.