Were you ever taught logic?

PhantomLlama

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Captain Jackson said:
Were logic and/or logic fallacies ever formally taught to you? I'm a college sophomore, and the only logic I've learned I learned by myself.

I'm asking because this forum is packed thread to thread with logic fallacies.
I wasn't. A friend of mine takes philosophy A-level, and he is, but that's it.

Teaching logic is a good idea actually.
 
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revolutio

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Logic is logic. My personality type (INTP) makes me an innately logic-oriented person. I have an easy time finding logical flaws and a tough time ignoring them; yes that does make watching Hollywood movies rather annoying. These forums were the first place that I heard of named and standardized logical fallacies. I found upon reading through them that alot I had already noticed as recurring themes wherever I found logical flaws. Though in a formal debate they are handy so you don't have to type out why something doesn't work, they are somewhat rude in an informal setting to my reckoning.
 
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ObbiQuiet

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I was never taught it... I do not remember how I started to get it. Logic seems almost natural to me.


It is interesting, though, because I never thought of logic as being something you could teach. I suppose my logical reasoning came from the gifted education programs I was put into as a child. We did a lot of 'matrix logics', which are basically puzzles you have to solve given very few clues.
 
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Svt4Him

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Captain Jackson said:
Were logic and/or logic fallacies ever formally taught to you? I'm a college sophomore, and the only logic I've learned I learned by myself.

I'm asking because this forum is packed thread to thread with logic fallacies.
I agree. But I've found most forums are, and it comes pretty much from everyone. Christians are accused of it most often, but I don't believe that is true. I've been accused, just recently, of lacking any training in this area since I point out in threads the logical flaws. Those I point out are usually non-Christians.

For instance, your tag:

If God loved the world, then he would allow many into his paradise.

That is a fallacy.

You can call it bifurcation or black and white, you can call it Dicto simpliciter or sweeping generalization or an irrelevant conclusion. But when done by those not Christian, it seems to be overlooked.
 
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ObbiQuiet

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Svt4Him said:
I agree. But I've found most forums are, and it comes pretty much from everyone. Christians are accused of it most often, but I don't believe that is true. I've been accused, just recently, of lacking any training in this area since I point out in threads the logical flaws. Those I point out are usually non-Christians.

For instance, your tag:

If God loved the world, then he would allow many into his paradise.

That is a fallacy.
Explain. It seems to me a logical conclusion you could reach by the assumption that God is a good God.
 
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sioleabha

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Logic is a sadly neglected subject today. As part of our homeschooling, my children will be taught Logic as a subject starting at the age of 13. If you don't know, ages 13-15 (approximately) are considered to be a time when children are more capable of learning logic than at any other time in life.

Since I was never taught Logic, I will have to use a self-teaching curriculum. (Many exist.) I hope to fill in many gaps in my own education through homeschooling my children.
 
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Svt4Him

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ObbiQuiet said:
Explain. It seems to me a logical conclusion you could reach by the assumption that God is a good God.
What exactly is the question being asked? If it's why a good God would send people to hell, or is it what is required to get into heaven, or is it what keeps people out of heaven, or is it does love overlook sin?

But I'll try. The statement says if God is love. Well, let me say then, God is love. So it then says love will overlook sin, but if it doesn't, it's not love, I'm assuming by inference. Love never overlooks sin. If I was a judge, and my son was brought before me, having committed horrific crimes, when I sentence him, is it a reflection of my love? They are in no way related. It's called a non sequitur argument.


 
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ObbiQuiet

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Svt4Him said:
What exactly is the question being asked? If it's why a good God would send people to hell, or is it what is required to get into heaven, or is it what keeps people out of heaven, or is it does love overlook sin?

But I'll try. The statement says if God is love. Well, let me say then, God is love. So it then says love will overlook sin, but if it doesn't, it's not love, I'm assuming by inference. Love never overlooks sin. If I was a judge, and my son was brought before me, having committed horrific crimes, when I sentence him, is it a reflection of my love? They are in no way related. It's called a non sequitur argument.


I don't agree, mainly with your conclusion. Is it love that you would sentence your son to eternal torture? That would be called abuse. Loving parents punish their children so they'll get better, and abusive parents just let them suffer with no productive means.

Though his sig is an emotional argument (and emotions rarely follow logic). It would seem absurd for a good God to send things he loved to eternal damnnation - unless he didn't love them, which would seem to contradict the statement that God loves the world.
 
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seebs

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Captain Jackson said:
Were logic and/or logic fallacies ever formally taught to you? I'm a college sophomore, and the only logic I've learned I learned by myself.

I'm asking because this forum is packed thread to thread with logic fallacies.

I've never seen a proper course in formal logic, but I have studied it at some length.
 
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Captain Jackson said:
Were logic and/or logic fallacies ever formally taught to you? I'm a college sophomore, and the only logic I've learned I learned by myself.

I'm asking because this forum is packed thread to thread with logic fallacies.
I didn't study logic until college, and that was only because I was a philosophy major. No one in my circle of friends, no one with whom I work or go to church has studied logic formally. That doesn't mean they aren't intelligent; many of them are. They merely haven't been trained in the art and science of thinking and reasoning.

Your going to find fallacies on message boards, because the majority of people aren't trained to reason. And even those of us who are trained in logic aren't perfect - we're going to make mistakes too!

I wish logic were taught in high schools as a staple subject, like English and mathematics (Math is a form of logic, but that's another matter.).

Of course, I wish some high schools would just make sure all their graduates can read (but that too is another matter.).


- Bud
 
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Captain Jackson said:
Who am I kidding? Once a thread is derailed, it's gone.



How is it illogical? You've already mentioned that you agree with it, so what's wrong with it?
If I may contribute to the derailment, I'd like to throw in a restatement of your signature...

If I loved my child, then I would allow my child into my house. My child will not enter my house, however (The Book of Hypotheticals 7:14). Therefore I do not love my child.

You're welcome to comment on this, or even ask what my point is. :)
 
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Chobo Char

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BudJohnson said:
If I may contribute to the derailment, I'd like to throw in a restatement of your signature...

If I loved my child, then I would allow my child into my house. My child will not enter my house, however (The Book of Hypotheticals 7:14). Therefore I do not love my child.

You're welcome to comment on this, or even ask what my point is. :)
Hmm, almost. Add "The child cannot even be sure said house exists." and it would be accurate.
 
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J

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BudJohnson said:
If I may contribute to the derailment, I'd like to throw in a restatement of your signature...

If I loved my child, then I would allow my child into my house. My child will not enter my house, however (The Book of Hypotheticals 7:14). Therefore I do not love my child.

You're welcome to comment on this, or even ask what my point is. :)
of course the whole problem here is the "My child will not enter my house" bit. You have swapped the choice element from you to the child. As has already been pointed out, the child cannot be certain the house even exists, more to the point, the child cannot be certain that you exist either. The child also has many other people inviting him into their houses too (though we cannot be sure if these people or their houses exist either), and according to many of them, all the other houses are actually torture chambers, and only their house is the correct one.
 
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