End Times Question

Hi christianbeginning,

Here are veses that talk of the end time or last days.

Acts 2
17" 'In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.

Hebrews 1
but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe.

Hebrews 9
26Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself

The first verse was spoken in the upper room before Jesus ascended to Heaven, but was a prophecy of Joel.

The rest are self explanatory.

So the biblical end times didn't start with creation.

Justme

I think He's just getting started.

H

Isnt there a verse somewhere that shows the last days are after Jesus was raised?

christianbeginning said:

It seems that a significant portion of Christians believe that "we are in the End Times".

My question is: why now?

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The return of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is the key to bible prophecy. For 2000 years the Jews were scattered without their nation but in May, 1948 that all changed. Israel once again is established in the land and thus begins the beginning of the end to this world system.

Deuteronomy 4:27-28,30-31 27The LORD will scatter you among the peoples, and only a few of you will survive and the nations to which God will drive you. 28But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find him if you search for him with all your heart and all your soul. 30When you are in distress and all these things have happened to you, then in latter days you will return to the LORD your God and obey him. 31For the LORD your God is a merciful God; he will not abandon or destroy you or forget the covenant (the land of Israel) with your forefathers, which he confirmed to them all.

The prophecies of Moses told that they would be scattered throughout the world and that God would restore them to their land once again.

Jeremiah 30:3 'For behold, days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will restore the fortunes of My people Israel and Judah.' The LORD says, 'I will also bring them back to the land that I gave to their forefathers and they shall possess it."

Isaiah 11:11 Then it will happen on that day that the Lord will again recover the second time with His hand The remnant of His people, who will remain, From Assyria, Egypt, Pathros, Cush, Elam, Shinar, Hamath, And from the islands of the sea.

Joel 3:1-2 1"For behold, in those days and at that time, When I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem, 2I will gather all the nations And bring them down to the valley of Jehoshaphat. Then I will enter into judgment with them there On behalf of My people and My inheritance, Israel,

Amos 9:11 "In that day I will raise up the fallen booth of David, And wall up its breaches; I will also raise up its ruins And rebuild it as in the days of old;

Ezekiel 36:24,33-35 24"For I will take you from the nations, gather you from all the lands and bring you into your own land. 33"Thus says the Lord GOD, "On the day that I cleanse you from all your iniquities, I will cause the cities to be inhabited, and the waste places will be rebuilt. 34"The desolate land will be cultivated instead of being a desolation in the sight of everyone who passes by. 35"They will say, 'This desolate land has become like the garden of Eden; and the waste, desolate and ruined cities are fortified and inhabited.'

Once Israel was restored we have seen the land prosper and this was prophesied as well.

Hosea 9:10 I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your forefathers as the earliest fruit on the fig tree in its first season. But they came to Baal-peor and devoted themselves to shame, And they became as detestable as that which they loved.

Jeremiah 24:2-4 2One basket had very good figs, like first-ripe figs, and the other basket had very bad figs which could not be eaten due to rottenness. 3Then the LORD said to me, "What do you see, Jeremiah?" And I said, "Figs, the good figs, very good; and the bad figs, very bad, which cannot be eaten due to rottenness." 4Then the word of the LORD came to me, saying, 5"Thus says the LORD God of Israel, "Like these good figs, so I will regard as good the captives of Judah, whom I have sent out of this place into the land of the Chaldeans.

A fig tree is used by Hosea and Jeremiah to refer to Jewish people.

Matthew 24:32-33 32Now learn the parable from the fig tree: when its branch has already become tender, and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near; 33even so you too, when you see all these things, recognize that he is near, right at the door.


In 1967 Israel fulfilled this prophecy after the six-day war when they took back their land including Jerusalem.

Luke 21:24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword and will be led captive into all the nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled under foot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Yes, we are in the last days.

Luke 21:29-33 29And he told them a parable: "Look at the fig tree, and all the trees; 30as soon as they come out in leaf, you see for yourselves and know that the summer is already near. 31So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that the kingdom of God is near. 32Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all has taken place. 33Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away.


So yes, by all my studies in these matters I've concluded that we are of the last generation as spoken of in bible prophecy. Beyond this I also believe that Christ shall physically rule on earth for 1000 years after the tribulation (judgment) on earth.

So yes, by all my studies in these matters I've concluded that we are of the last generation as spoken of in bible prophecy. Beyond this I also believe that Christ shall physically rule on earth for 1000 years after the tribulation (judgment) on earth.

Cute. LaHaye said that about the generation that lived through WWI. Would you be kind enough to put a top and bottom on this generatoin you speak of, wrt when it began and how long a generation is?

I remember Lindsey saying the same thing but he used the 1948 war,,,untill the forty years ran out, then he adopted the 1967 benchmark.

take care

Hitch

The return of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is the key to bible prophecy. For 2000 years the Jews were scattered without their nation but in May, 1948 that all changed. Israel once again is established in the land and thus begins the beginning of the end to this world system.

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This is a misunderstood prophecy. It is false to think that Israel is going tp become a player in the events of prophecy at the end of time.

Galatians 3:28,29

"There isneitherJewnorGreek, there isneitherbondnorfree, there isneithermalenorfemale:foryearealloneinChristJesus.Andifye be Christ's,then are yeAbraham'sseed,andheirsaccording to the promise." No Greeks, no Jews, no Israel. But if you belong to Christ then you become a spiritual Jew. That is what we are today. We then receive the promises that were given to Abraham.

When did the time of the end start?


It roughly began around the late 1700's and early 1800's.


It began as Daniel was unsealed.


Verse 4


"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

Daniel was sealed until then and is now open.

Hitch said:

Cute. LaHaye said that about the generation that lived through WWI. Would you be kind enough to put a top and bottom on this generatoin you speak of, wrt when it began and how long a generation is?

I remember Lindsey saying the same thing but he used the 1948 war,,,untill the forty years ran out, then he adopted the 1967 benchmark.

take care

Hitch

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Cute? Sorry, but I fail to see what is cute. This is from a dispensationalist viewpoint of eschatology and I am guessing that you have a different view of biblical prophecy.

40 years - Numbers 32:13 "So the LORD'S anger burned against Israel, and He made them wander in the wilderness forty years, until the entire generation of those who had done evil in the sight of the LORD was destroyed.

70 years - Psalm 90:10 As for the days of our life, they contain seventy years, or if due to strength, eighty years, yet their pride is but labor and sorrow; for soon it is gone and we fly away.

120 years - Genesis 6:3 Then the Lord said, "My spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he is also flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.

A generation can be 40, 70 or 120 years. I don't really hold to a 120 year theory with modern generations. Whether it started in 48 or 67 is less important for me at least. Things are clearly not the same as it was in WWI as you are pointing out. As I pointed out using scripture, Israel is the key to Eschatology. Maybe you will share your studies on eschatology with us in addition to disputing my views?

take care

Symes said:

When did the time of the end start?


It roughly began around the late 1700's and early 1800's.


It began as Daniel was unsealed.


Verse 4


"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased."

Daniel was sealed until then and is now open.

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Hi symes

Does that mean worldly knowledge or Biblical knowledge? in my Bible (the message) It quotes 4""This is a confidential report, Daniel, for your eyes and ears only. Keep it secret. Put the book under lock and key until the end. In the interim there is going to be a lot of frantic running around, trying to figure out what's going on.' And says nothing about increase in knowledge and travel while Bibles do. Which one is right?

Sorry double post.

joyinchrist said:

Isnt there a verse somewhere that shows the last days are after Jesus was raised?

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Actually, the Bible testifies that the "last days", at the "end of the ages" were already underway BEFORE the Cross, during Christ's earthly ministry:

Hebrews 1:1-2
God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Hebrews 9:26
He then would have had to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.

Durelen said:

Cute? Sorry, but I fail to see what is cute. This is from a dispensationalist viewpoint of eschatology and I am guessing that you have a different view of biblical prophecy.

40 years - Numbers 32:13 "So the LORD'S anger burned against Israel, and He made them wander in the wilderness forty years, until the entire generation of those who had done evil in the sight of the LORD was destroyed.

70 years - Psalm 90:10 As for the days of our life, they contain seventy years, or if due to strength, eighty years, yet their pride is but labor and sorrow; for soon it is gone and we fly away.

120 years - Genesis 6:3 Then the Lord said, "My spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he is also flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.

A generation can be 40, 70 or 120 years. I don't really hold to a 120 year theory with modern generations. Whether it started in 48 or 67 is less important for me at least. Things are clearly not the same as it was in WWI as you are pointing out. As I pointed out using scripture, Israel is the key to Eschatology. Maybe you will share your studies on eschatology with us in addition to disputing my views?

take care

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In your examples, I only see 40 years as being called a "generation". The others (70 &120) are called "the days of ones life".

Now, since I can't find anywhere in scripture that calles "the days of ones life" a "generation", I'm not sure where you get that relation from.

Where does the Bible teach that the "days of ones life" = "a generation"?

parousia70 said:

In your examples, I only see 40 years as being called a "generation". The others (70 &120) are called "the days of ones life".

Now, since I can't find anywhere in scripture that calles "the days of ones life" a "generation", I'm not sure where you get that relation from.

Where does the Bible teach that the "days of ones life" = "a generation"?

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As for the length of a generation I have always fallen into the 40 year range but I don’t see the others not being entirely acceptable and would not rebuke someone for holding them as true. They are far less probable in my opinion but worth heed in light of life spans in any case.

I’m not even sure I would clock the start of the tribulation from exactly 40 years from the very moment in time that either two events took place. It all depends on how long the Lord tarries. The actual emphasis of these scriptures is that this generation will no pass away or die off before these things take place. I’m not dead of old age yet nor are my parents. Of course what he was speaking of is the rebirth of the Jewish nation as we have all just witnessed so yes this is the last generation he refered to. Can't tell you the day though but sure is the season.

Hi Durelen,

Sorry...double post

Justme

We are "IN THE LAST DAYS" because those christians want to be.

Don't worry about the end of this world, just love what you've got.

Hi Durelen,

You wrote:
I’m not even sure I would clock the start of the tribulation from exactly 40 years from the very moment in time that either two events took place. It all depends on how long the Lord tarries. The actual emphasis of these scriptures is that this generation will no pass away or die off before these things take place. I’m not dead of old age yet nor are my parents.
***********************

I hope both you and your parents both die of old age and enjoy every minute getting there, but I will tell you this. You(at 34) hopefully will live long enough to KNOW that this stuff about Israel ,1948 or 1967 is incorrect.

!967 was 36 years ago. Those who talk of this date also speak of a 7 year tribulation which makes 43 years and the scripture says those who SEE it. To SEE it it seems to me you should also be aware of what you SEE. How old would you have to be to understand...5-10 years old? So we're up to 53 years already. Hopefully your parents are stilll alive to see the passing of the 70 year mark. BUT I wonder??? Will you see thru this false religious doctrine even then or will you just accept the next bag of garbage they throw at you?

You may recall the WatchTower taught that Jesus came in 1914 and the generation would see the end of the 'system of things' in 1975. The statement was on the cover of their magazine until in the 90's and they just quit printing it there. Now the followers just blissfully adopt the next line of _'wisdom'___that the Wt feeds them and all carries on as usual.

Sad really, the key is to not get wrapped up in this stuff in the first place...and I won't.

Justme

Justme said:

...snip... BUT I wonder??? Will you see thru this false religious doctrine even then or will you just accept the next bag of garbage they throw at you?



You may recall the WatchTower taught ...snip...snip...snip...

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LOL well thanks a lot for that interesting comment. Actually this view goes back to Darby as well as Scofield to just name two. This is a widely popular view in the United States by actual bible believing Christians who hold the truth of the apostles creed. So I guess when the next religious doctrinal garbage comes along I’ll just need to hop right on :/
Wow this forum just radiates with brotherly love…

And no, I do hope with all my heart the Lord comes back right now and takes us away.
Maranatha!

1967 was a very significant date for end times recognition as it marked the end of the "time of the Gentiles" when the Six Day War marked the end of Gentile rule over Jerusalem.

Revelation 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

This treading under foot by Gentiles ended in 1967 - the Six Day War, and the Muslims that intended to build over the Holy of Holies missed the mark and built over the area know as the court of the Gentiles which John prophecied in Rev. 11:2 by the Spirit.
Here is a calculation based on this time of 42 months of Rev.11:2.
688AD is the date the building of the Dome of the Rock started and spans 42 months = 1278.34 days. A day is as a year in Biblical prophetic calculations (Num. 14:34), so 1967AD - 1278.34 days = 688.66AD.
1967AD is the time of the fullness of Gentiles or when the Six Day war resulted in the first time the Jews had control of Jerusalem in 2,573 yrs.

Luke 21:21-24 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Surely this is a significant event for the end times, and I have seen much change since 1967 in the powers of Israel's enemies getting ever stronger and more threatening to overrun the Holy Land again. These enemies have shown themselves to have inspiration that allows them to strap dynamite to their bodies and kill even their own innocent children in order to follow out the plans of some evil plan of seemedly pure hatred for the Jews and any that would protect them. Yes, there have been many ages that thought the Lord would return soon, but they did not have what we have today in Israel.


Here is the map of the temple grounds and the locations of the Dome of the Rock and how it is not built over the House of the Lord - the "sides of the north". Click on it:

Oh yes, the land has absolutely flourished! What was once swamp and desert is now an agricultural paradise as well as 220,000,000 trees planted. It’s like the land magically woke up and started to breath once it’s people returned home. God is definitely moving in the land and he is blessing his peoples and the land.