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Dear Pete Hegseth, I’m Grateful the Japanese Navy Spared My Grandfather’s Life

Say it aint so

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My grandfather Frank Gustaferro got the word at his uncle Carlo’s Bakery in Hoboken, New Jersey. His orders said that he was to report to the SS John Barry departing in a few days. The ship, secretly carrying millions of silver coins to support wartime operations in Saudi Arabia, was torpedoed by the German submarine U-859 on August 28, 1944. Two crewmen died in the blast. The rest, including my grandfather, ended up in the water — temporarily blinded from oil, injured, terrified, clinging to whatever wreckage they could find. They heard Japanese aircraft overhead as they floated in the Indian Ocean. My grandfather braced for the strafing run he assumed was coming. It never came. Even in the brutal logic of total war, there were limits. A line existed — a line older than the Geneva Conventions, older than the United Nations, older even than the modern idea of “war crimes” itself. You did not kill shipwrecked men in the water. You did not kill survivors who were out of the fight. You did not shoot the wounded clinging to debris. My grandfather survived because even America’s enemies in 1944 understood that basic rule of humanity.....
...The Imperial Japanese military, for all its many and well-documented atrocities, still had pilots and sailors who chose not to fire on American sailors who posed no threat. There are cases of American Navy sailors being spared by Japanese pilots and ship crews, as documented in James D. Hornfischer’s The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors.
The international conflict law prohibiting such attacks, known as hors de combat, doesn’t care whether the people in the water were alleged drug smugglers, enemy fighters, or simply unlucky. America is built on the premise that “all men are created equal” — even those we fight. Humanity is the line that prevents war from collapsing into a massacre.....ROLLING STONE

We as the United States of America can do better. We need to do better.
 

durangodawood

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In WWII my grandfather served in the Royal Navy when his ship was sunk in the English channel. There he bobbed around for a day more or less. I dont know if the Germans were in a position to come back around to kill the shipwrecked. But at least for my sake its a good thing they didnt.

I look at this current incident and get the sense theres a line thats been crossed, and we're now on the side of barbarism if we go on this way. And I get that heat-of-battle and fog-of-war can confound morality such that we should generally be slow to judge. But neither of those really seem to apply here.
 
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Oompa Loompa

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My grandfather Frank Gustaferro got the word at his uncle Carlo’s Bakery in Hoboken, New Jersey. His orders said that he was to report to the SS John Barry departing in a few days. The ship, secretly carrying millions of silver coins to support wartime operations in Saudi Arabia, was torpedoed by the German submarine U-859 on August 28, 1944. Two crewmen died in the blast. The rest, including my grandfather, ended up in the water — temporarily blinded from oil, injured, terrified, clinging to whatever wreckage they could find. They heard Japanese aircraft overhead as they floated in the Indian Ocean. My grandfather braced for the strafing run he assumed was coming. It never came. Even in the brutal logic of total war, there were limits. A line existed — a line older than the Geneva Conventions, older than the United Nations, older even than the modern idea of “war crimes” itself. You did not kill shipwrecked men in the water. You did not kill survivors who were out of the fight. You did not shoot the wounded clinging to debris. My grandfather survived because even America’s enemies in 1944 understood that basic rule of humanity.....
...The Imperial Japanese military, for all its many and well-documented atrocities, still had pilots and sailors who chose not to fire on American sailors who posed no threat. There are cases of American Navy sailors being spared by Japanese pilots and ship crews, as documented in James D. Hornfischer’s The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors.
The international conflict law prohibiting such attacks, known as hors de combat, doesn’t care whether the people in the water were alleged drug smugglers, enemy fighters, or simply unlucky. America is built on the premise that “all men are created equal” — even those we fight. Humanity is the line that prevents war from collapsing into a massacre.....ROLLING STONE

We as the United States of America can do better. We need to do better.
Poor poor narco terrorists drug smugglers. If only they had the same level of outrage for the kids they kill every year with their cargo.
 
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iluvatar5150

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Poor poor narco terrorists drug smugglers. If only they had the same level of outrage for the kids they kill every year with their cargo.
Oh hey, look, another conservative Christian pooh-poohing the concept of doing the right thing just because it’s the right thing to do.

This must be the doctrine of 2nd Machiavellians 45:47.
 
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Oompa Loompa

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Oh hey, look, another conservative Christian pooh-poohing the concept of doing the right thing just because it’s the right thing to do.

This must be the doctrine of 2nd Machiavellians 45:47.
Cartel drug smugglers are not uniformed combatants deserving of special rights and privileges. Especially after they rape the illegal immigrants the left loves so much before making them sex slaves to pay off their debts. Comparing these monsters to Japanese pilots is an insult to Imperial Japan. Pirates can be shot on sight, so why not drug smugglers?
 
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Belk

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Cartel drug smugglers are not uniformed combatants deserving of special rights and privileges. Especially after they rape the illegal immigrants the left loves so much before making them sex slaves to pay off their debts. Comparing these monsters to Japanese pilots is an insult to Imperial Japan. Pirates can be shot on sight, so why not drug smugglers?
Tell us again how you are pro life.
 
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Oompa Loompa

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Tell us again how you are pro life.
All innocent life should be protected, especially while in the womb. But I dont see how that is relevant. How pro life are those who allow people to bring poison into a country that kills thousands every year? If someone is in favor of killing one to save a thousand, I would call them pro life.
 
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Belk

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All innocent life should be protected, especially while in the womb. But I dont see how that is relevant. How pro life are those who allow people to bring poison into a country that kills thousands every year? If someone is in favor of killing one to save a thousand, I would call them pro life.
No true Scotsman pro life it would seem.
 
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Oompa Loompa

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No true Scotsman pro life it would seem.
I wish liberals would show the same level of empathy and compassion for an unborn child that they do for murdering rapist drug smugglers. If so, abortion would be completely banned. But here is an interesting question, if you had the chance to kill the 9/11 hijackers before they boarded the planes that killed 2,977 people, would you? But every year, 72, 776 people in the US die from fentanyl, and 29,449 with cocaine. That is over 34 9/11 attacks in the United States every year! So yes! I celebrate the deaths of every single one of these monsters so that innocent people can live.
So who is more "pro-life?"
 
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Belk

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I wish liberals would show the same level of empathy and compassion for an unborn child that they do for murdering rapist drug smugglers.
I wish conservatives would stop equating an embryo with a person. Guess we will both be disappointed.

If so, abortion would be completely banned. But here is an interesting question, if you had the chance to kill the 9/11 hijackers before they boarded the planes that killed 2,977 people, would you?
If I had true knowledge of their later actions? Yes. But since that is only possible for a god that is not relevant in this case.

But every year, 72, 776 people in the US die from fentanyl, and 29,449 with cocaine. That is over 34 9/11 attacks in the United States every year!
No. People dying from drug overdose is not the same as a targeted attack. The comparison is bizzare. Unless you think we should be shooting doctors because they might over prescribe?

So yes! I celebrate the deaths of every single one of these monsters so that innocent people can live.
So who is more "pro-life?"
Not the guy celebrating people being killed by selectively applying a weasel word like "innocent ".
 
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durangodawood

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Poor poor narco terrorists drug smugglers. If only they had the same level of outrage for the kids they kill every year with their cargo.
Suspected.

If found guilty, then they should be punished as the law prescribes. But just killing suspects rendered harmless and not fighting back, no trial. This is barbaric.
 
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Servus

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500,000 drug related deaths since 2020:

Apathetic.png


2 drug smugglers killed:

Outraged.png
 
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durangodawood

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Nithavela

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In WWII my grandfather served in the Royal Navy when his ship was sunk in the English channel. There he bobbed around for a day more or less. I dont know if the Germans were in a position to come back around to kill the shipwrecked. But at least for my sake its a good thing they didnt.
Depending on the time that happened, they probably had standing orders not to help shipwrecked people because the allies kept attacking them during their rescue attempts. The german navy never had a habit of killing shipwrecked people.

 
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Nithavela

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Cartel drug smugglers are not uniformed combatants deserving of special rights and privileges. Especially after they rape the illegal immigrants the left loves so much before making them sex slaves to pay off their debts. Comparing these monsters to Japanese pilots is an insult to Imperial Japan.
Lol


An insult because they don't rape enough people I assume.
 
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durangodawood

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Depending on the time that happened, they probably had standing orders not to help shipwrecked people because the allies kept attacking them during their rescue attempts. The german navy never had a habit of killing shipwrecked people.

I would not have assumed killing the shipwrecked was either German habit or policy back then.
 
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Nithavela

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I would not have assumed killing the shipwrecked was either German habit or policy back then.
Yeah, that was more an allied thing.

In a sense, not much has changed, hmm?
 
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durangodawood

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It adresses all of the feigned moral outrage taking place.
Wow. Instead of examining the morality of the topic at hand, you have finger wagged at an anonymous "they", accusing "them" of a character deficiency, This is just pot stirring that adds zero to our understanding of the event we're here to discuss.
 
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