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ABC News Moderators Blasted For Extreme Bias, Fact Checking Trump But Not Harris

Aldebaran

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He's gone even further disavowing any knowledge of it.
For Trump, or anyone else, to say that is an abject lie. Period.

In April 2022, standing in front of the Heritage Foundation, the group who were creating Project 2025 at the time; Trump said, “This is a great group, and they’re going to lay the groundwork and detail plans for exactly what our movement will do, and what your movement will do when the American people give us a colossal mandate to save America,"

On this issue, she did not make a false statement.
She merely rephrased what Trump has said in his own words, If he's elected, that's exactly what he will do (his words, not mine, not Kamala's).
That is bolded in the quote above. Here's a link to the full speech. The quoted comment comes at (46:24 linked to transcript and video).

He either stood in front of the Heritage Foundation and lied to their faces, or he's lying now about not being aware of it.
There is no in-between.
The quote of Trump you posted was obviously from before the Heritage Foundation wrote up Project 2025, so how is it proof that he read it, or knows what it says?
 
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RDKirk

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The quote of Trump you posted was obviously from before the Heritage Foundation wrote up Project 2025, so how is it proof that he read it, or knows what it says?
I'm totally sure that Trump himself has not actually read the nearly thousand-page Project 2025.

That doesn't mean it doesn't contain much of what he wants to do (and actually tried to do during his administration), or doesn't agree with the 140 people he's ideologically associated with who wrote it.
 
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Aldebaran

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I'm totally sure that Trump himself has not actually read the nearly thousand-page Project 2025.

That doesn't mean it doesn't contain much of what he wants to do (and actually tried to do during his administration), or doesn't agree with the 140 people he's ideologically associated with who wrote it.
You're correct that it doesn't mean what you said, but that leaves out any specifics as to what parts of it he agrees with and will implement. But all I've heard from Harris and her followers is "Trump's Project 2025" and that it's supposedly so terrible, even though citations are lacking to support the claims.
 
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rjs330

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while speaking to the group that created it, is pure coincidence.
I don't.
Oh I don't think it's coincidence at all. I think he knew they were working on something and becauae they are a conservative group he would like most of it. But, it's pretty naive to think he had read it all and agreed with evverything that was in it. That just goes against human nature. We don't all.agree with what's in the Constitution for Pete's sake.
f you support the concept of raising taxes on the poorest in our communities while simultaneously reducing taxes on the very richest as an upright thing to do, then you and I have very different values concerning morality.
We probably do. I agree with God's morality who had a 10% tithe on everyone, rich or poor. I think it's fair that the poor pay their fair share as well as the rich. The question always is, what's their fair share. That's the debate and just becauae we don't agree doesn't make you or I more moral than the other.
 
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RDKirk

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You're correct that it doesn't mean what you said, but that leaves out any specifics as to what parts of it he agrees with and will implement. But all I've heard from Harris and her followers is "Trump's Project 2025" and that it's supposedly so terrible, even though citations are lacking to support the claims.
None of it needs to be implemented. Every part of it is a step toward creating an "Imperial Presidency" with no checks and balances.
 
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RDKirk

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Oh I don't think it's coincidence at all. I think he knew they were working on something and becauae they are a conservative group he would like most of it. But, it's pretty naive to think he had read it all and agreed with evverything that was in it. That just goes against human nature. We don't all.agree with what's in the Constitution for Pete's sake.

We probably do. I agree with God's morality who had a 10% tithe on everyone, rich or poor. I think it's fair that the poor pay their fair share as well as the rich. The question always is, what's their fair share. That's the debate and just becauae we don't agree doesn't make you or I more moral than the other.
The OT's "transfer of resources" from the wealthy to the poor was greater than just the tithe. As well, it also severely limited the ability of the wealthy to accumulate wealth at the expense of the poor for more than a generation. There could be no interest on a loan made to a fellow Israelite, and even that loan was cancelled in seven years or on the semi-centennial year of Jubilee. Any property gained by the wealthy had to be returned to its original family every Jubilee year. Preventing long-term debt and preventing permanent acquisition of land was intended to put limits on overall disparity of wealth...but clearly by the time of Jesus they had long since stopped obeying the Law.
 
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Bobber

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When I first heard his words, the Word of God rose up in my heart, whenever you saw me naked and clothed me whenever you saw me hungry and fed me, whatever you do to the least of my brethren you do unto me. Trump's sentiments were grieving The Spirit of Christ in me.
No, no, no I was reading your comments until you came out with this. You're using a God Told Me This approach to make your case. which is an I'm right and your wrong without question for after all how can anyone argue against God. If you're going to make your case then make your case but don't stack your arguments with a sense that you're infallible. All it does it lead to others saying God told me why no one should vote for the Dems.
 
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Aldebaran

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None of it needs to be implemented. Every part of it is a step toward creating an "Imperial Presidency" with no checks and balances.
How could it possibly be a step toward anything if it wasn't even implemented?
 
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RDKirk

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How could it possibly be a step toward anything if it wasn't even implemented?
What, do you think a operational plan is "implemented" instantaneously by waving a magic wand? "Presto!" and it's all done?
 
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childeye 2

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No, no, no I was reading your comments until you came out with this. You're using a God Told Me This approach to make your case. which is an I'm right and your wrong without question for after all how can anyone argue against God. If you're going to make your case then make your case but don't stack your arguments with a sense that you're infallible. All it does it lead to others saying God told me why no one should vote for the Dems.
First off, you truly did earn my sincere respect for having the love and courage to say this. I love it. But I'm just saying what happened to me. Of course, no one can argue against love others as you would want to be loved; It's the foundation of all moral/immoral reasoning. But if you think I'm claiming God is on my side, you've got me all wrong.
 
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rjs330

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I'm totally sure that Trump himself has not actually read the nearly thousand-page Project 2025.

That doesn't mean it doesn't contain much of what he wants to do (and actually tried to do during his administration), or doesn't agree with the 140 people he's ideologically associated with who wrote it.
I'm sure he hasn't. And he is probably in agreement with a lot of it. But no one really knows what he is in agreement with and what he isn't. I mean that large of a document is bound to have some things in it that most conservative would agree with and things that a lot of us wouldn't. Trump isn't a hard core conservative.
 
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rjs330

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The OT's "transfer of resources" from the wealthy to the poor was greater than just the tithe. As well, it also severely limited the ability of the wealthy to accumulate wealth at the expense of the poor for more than a generation. There could be no interest on a loan made to a fellow Israelite, and even that loan was cancelled in seven years or on the semi-centennial year of Jubilee. Any property gained by the wealthy had to be returned to its original family every Jubilee year. Preventing long-term debt and preventing permanent acquisition of land was intended to put limits on overall disparity of wealth...but clearly by the time of Jesus they had long since stopped obeying the Law.
I honestly like a lot of this stuff. But my point was rhe morality of taxes to say that it's immoral to tax the poor. It's obviously not since God had rhe poor tithe as well as the rich and it was the same percentage. So it's not immoral. Thats all my point was. It wasn't to get I to the weeds of the OT law. Which I can do since my degree is in all of that stuff.
 
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RDKirk

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I honestly like a lot of this stuff. But my point was rhe morality of taxes to say that it's immoral to tax the poor. It's obviously not since God had rhe poor tithe as well as the rich and it was the same percentage. So it's not immoral. Thats all my point was. It wasn't to get I to the weeds of the OT law. Which I can do since my degree is in all of that stuff.
If you look at the specific instructions for the tithe, you see first that the tithe was from the "increase" of the land. A poor man had no land... the poor did not tithe the grain they gleaned from the rich man's fields. When animals were to be tithed, the tithe was explicitly every tenth animal...not the first animal. So, a man with fewer than ten animals would not tithe any of them. Essentially, the truly poor did not give tithes, they received tithes.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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I think Harris had only one mission that night: To demonstrate that Trump can't keep his mind on task and can be led like a child merely by pushing his buttons. And I think she accomplished that mission.
It started when she went out to shake his hand while he seemingly resisted and had to treat him like a child right in the opening moments of the debate. That set the tone of who was gonna be in charge that evening.
 
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rjs330

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If you look at the specific instructions for the tithe, you see first that the tithe was from the "increase" of the land. A poor man had no land... the poor did not tithe the grain they gleaned from the rich man's fields. When animals were to be tithed, the tithe was explicitly every tenth animal...not the first animal. So, a man with fewer than ten animals would not tithe any of them. Essentially, the truly poor did not give tithes, they received tithes.
Do you want to get into the weeds on this because I can. Tithing was based upon what you had. It was a yearly tithe. Of course if you had nothing you had nothing to tithe on. But if you had something you tithed in what you had. Sure if you only had 6 sheep you wouldn't have paid a 10th on it. But you weren't wealthy if you had 10 sheep. Of course if you had zero income (crops, harvest or what have you) you wouldn't pay tithe. But you could be poor and pay a tithe of what you had.

I think you may have a certain definition of poor you are referring to that may be either too broad or too narrow, I'm not which as you haven't really described or defined it. But it certainly wasn't only the wealthy in Israel that paid tithes. In fact during the certain years when the tithes were gathered to feed the "poor" there were certain people that were listed and defined on who would get their fill every three years.

Leviticus deliniates what the tithe is and who pays it. This is in addition to the sacrifices required. God did not specify how large a field or crop you had to have. There was no deliniation between those who had 10 sheep.and those who had a 1000. Or those who had an orchard of 2 trees vs 100 trees. We could certainly say in our terminology some would be considered poor. They paid 10% of their harvest etc. If they had nothing then they paid nothing. It wasn't immoral for God to claim the tithe since it all belonged to him anyway. For him to.ask a small amount from those who had something was not immoral. No more thannit would be immoral for us to ask someone who made money to pay some taxes. Of course if you made nothing you would pay nothing.

My point stands that it's not immoral. And seeing God was involved with the tithe and people we would consider as poor paid it it can't be immoral.
 
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Aldebaran

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What, do you think a operational plan is "implemented" instantaneously by waving a magic wand? "Presto!" and it's all done?
From the way its detractors talk about it, and Trump, yes.
 
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Aldebaran

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It started when she went out to shake his hand while he seemingly resisted and had to treat him like a child right in the opening moments of the debate. That set the tone of who was gonna be in charge that evening.
Biden and Trump didn't meet each other and shake hands when they went onstage, so why would Trump expect that the protocol would be any different this time?
Can you imagine if Harris just went to her podium and Trump walked over to her instead? The Trump-haters would be screaming, "He invaded her space! It shows he doesn't respect women--especially women O' color!"
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Biden and Trump didn't meet each other and shake hands when they went onstage, so why would Trump expect that the protocol would be any different this time?
Can you imagine if Harris just went to her podium and Trump walked over to her instead? The Trump-haters would be screaming, "He invaded her space! It shows he doesn't respect women--especially women O' color!"
It’s called decorum. I know that’s a foreign concept on the right these days but it used to be a thing. Either way, she looked in control from the start. He did not.
 
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