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power1

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What's with the presumption that wanting to actively end lives is included in saying human population is an issue?
This quote for example seems to show the heart state of some folks.

"
“Basically, then, there are only two kinds of solutions to the population problem. One is a ‘birth rate solution,’ in which we find ways to lower the birth rate. The other is a ‘death rate solution,’ in which ways to raise the death rate — war, famine, pestilence — find us.”

“Each person we add now disproportionately impacts on the environment and life-support systems of the planet.”
https://populationmatters.org/quotes
 
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power1

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That's the nature of totalitarianism. Control the masses while the leaders live the high life.

None of those captains of industry, the billionaires who tell us what we should do and who control our elections by their financial contributions, abide by their own rules.

One of them recently flew the meat for a wedding dinner coast to coast so that he'd have just the taste he wanted. So much for emissions or the rest of that stuff. Another well-known advocate for climate control flew hundreds of thousands of miles on speaking tours touting the idea of everyone else cutting back using their lawnmowers or whatever. At least he had a mission.

Others just fly all over the globe for enjoyment. Now we're also seeing rockets and a handful of thrill-seekers being shot into space for 10 minutes or so just for the fun of it, and with no concern for the atmosphere.

If you want a third child, NO! Yet the same people who make all the noise about overpopulation (and have done so for at least the last fifty years) are working to flood the country with immigrants from other countries...because they need more laborers!
They might do well to consider that they are part of the human population as well. Why would they ask others to die for them, rather than being more like Jesus, who died for others?
 
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Albion

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They might do well to consider that they are part of the human population as well. Why would they ask others to die for them, rather than being more like Jesus, who died for others?
The ability to exercise authority over other people is a powerful aphrodisiac.
 
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Desk trauma

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This quote for example seems to show the heart state of some folks.

"
“Basically, then, there are only two kinds of solutions to the population problem. One is a ‘birth rate solution,’ in which we find ways to lower the birth rate. The other is a ‘death rate solution,’ in which ways to raise the death rate — war, famine, pestilence — find us.”

“Each person we add now disproportionately impacts on the environment and life-support systems of the planet.”
https://populationmatters.org/quotes
Not seeing the advocation for killing people.
 
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Paulos23

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So how does that work, your life is fine and worthy and superior? The lives of (insert babies or whoever else might be on the hit list here) are unfit to be allowed life?
I would start with sex education and family planning. For most countries, this works well and the population curve drops to meet the death rate quickly after improved healthcare lowered the childhood death rate. Same with improved wealth and jobs, people who work for a good wage tend to have fewer kids.

This is not a problem that requires killing off mass amounts of people right now, but it is a concern and lowering the birth rate to a manageable amount is a start. And it is better to do that with birth control than abortions.

As it is, it might be solving itself as this video shows.

 
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power1

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Not seeing the advocation for killing people.
Let's be clear, abortion is murder. So is killing the sick or old etc. When that sort of crowd talks about things like other solutions as well, such as a death rate solution that is probably as close legally as they can get to sharing their true heart. The devil was a murderer from the beginning and a liar. His people today are a chip off the old block. Didn't Hitler have some sort of 'final solution' also?
 
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power1

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I would start with sex education and family planning.
Me too, except I would teach sex and babies are wonderful and from God. I would teach that if we believe Him, all babies and families are planned!

For most countries, this works well and the population curve drops to meet the death rate quickly after improved healthcare lowered the childhood death rate. Same with improved wealth and jobs, people who work for a good wage tend to have fewer kids.
So called healthcare these days is murder basically. Teach kids to murder babies without parental consent if needed and etc. Mass murder.

This is not a problem that requires killing off mass amounts of people right now,
Not 'right now'?
but it is a concern and lowering the birth rate to a manageable amount is a start. And it is better to do that with birth control than abortions.
Yet some might think bio weapons are a good way or etc.
 
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Paulos23

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Me too, except I would teach sex and babies are wonderful and from God. I would teach that if we believe Him, all babies and families are planned!

Umm, I can see why people think that but it should be an individual choice and they should have all the tools presented to them. And I would keep religion out of it, though I am sure whatever religion they are in will let them know what they think on the topic.

So called healthcare these days is murder basically. Teach kids to murder babies without parental consent if needed and etc. Mass murder.

What? I need more context here because you have gone out to the right field and I haven't popped a fly ball.

Not 'right now'?

I can see it happening in the future, via Soylent Green, but it would take the collapse of our support and supply network for this to be considered. We would have to be very desperate and have too many mouths to feed. We are not there yet.

Yet some might think bio weapons are a good way or etc.

That is not me, and not most people. We can address this now with gentler methods, rather than continuing down the path of outgrowing our planet's feeding capability.
 
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Desk trauma

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Let's be clear, abortion is murder. So is killing the sick or old etc. When that sort of crowd talks about things like other solutions as well, such as a death rate solution that is probably as close legally as they can get to sharing their true heart. The devil was a murderer from the beginning and a liar. His people today are a chip off the old block. Didn't Hitler have some sort of 'final solution' also?
And we have godwin, thanks for coming everyone, see you all again on another thread.
 
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power1

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Umm, I can see why people think that but it should be an individual choice and they should have all the tools presented to them. And I would keep religion out of it, though I am sure whatever religion they are in will let them know what they think on the topic.
Hitler did not give victims a choice when he was reducing the population. China either when they decided to murder all children save one per family some years ago.

"They now had the organized and unrelenting power of a totalitarian state to enforce their will, holding sway over not only a massive bureaucracy, but gigantic police and military forces, secret police, vast prison facilities, total media control, and tens of millions of informers. In The Population Bomb, Paul Ehrlich had called for state control of human reproduction, with “compulsory birth regulation.” Now, just twelve years later, Ehrlich’s utopian dream had become a nightmare reality for one-fifth of the human race.
..Women who defied these injunctions were taken and sterilized by force. Babies would be aborted right through the ninth month of pregnancy, with many crying as they were being stabbed to death at the moment of birth. Those women who fled to try to save their children were hunted, and if they could not be caught, their houses were torn down and their parents thrown in prison, there to linger until a ransom of 20,000 yuan — about three years’ income for a peasant — was paid for their release. Babies born to such fugitives were declared to be “black children,” illegal non-persons in the eyes of the state, without any right to employment, public schooling, health care, or reproduction."

The Population Control Holocaust
Some of the early proponents of this manifest demonism did things that resulted in many deaths.
"Ravenholt also had no compunction about buying up huge quantities of unproven, unapproved, defective, or banned contraceptive drugs and intrauterine devices (IUDs) and distributing them for use by his population control movement subcontractors on millions of unsuspecting Third World women, many of whom suffered or died in consequence. These included drugs and devices which had been declared unsafe by the FDA for use in America, and had faced successful lawsuits in the U.S. for their damaging results" same link


I can see it happening in the future, via Soylent Green, but it would take the collapse of our support and supply network for this to be considered. We would have to be very desperate and have too many mouths to feed. We are not there yet.
Thankfully I hope you are right. However there are things that go on under the radar that we do not know about.
 
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Paulos23

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Hitler did not give victims a choice when he was reducing the population. China either when they decided to murder all children save one per family some years ago.

And here we go to Godwining the thread.

I don't think anyone is suggesting anything Hitler did or said. China did what it did because it saw a problem, and did a heavy-handed policy that backfired on them. They still have a future problem feeding their population, but they are paying for their past mistake.
 
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power1

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And here we go to Godwining the thread.

I don't think anyone is suggesting anything Hitler did or said.
But they are. He wanted population to be controlled.
"Our object must be to bring our territory into harmony with the numbers of our population."

~ Adolf Hitler 125 Great Quotes About Overpopulation and Population Growth - Conserve Energy Future

China did what it did because it saw a problem, and did a heavy-handed policy that backfired on them. They still have a future problem feeding their population, but they are paying for their past mistake.
It shows the animalistic type of behaviour that comes with the territory of fanatical population control.
 
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Paulos23

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But they are. He wanted population to be controlled.
"Our object must be to bring our territory into harmony with the numbers of our population."

~ Adolf Hitler 125 Great Quotes About Overpopulation and Population Growth - Conserve Energy Future


It shows the animalistic type of behaviour that comes with the territory of fanatical population control.

So you are saying it should not be controlled at all? Just let the population grow until you can't feed them all?
 
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Tinker Grey

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Hitler never said that. The closest is:

We are obligated to depopulate as part of our mission of preserving the German population. We shall have to develop a technique of depopulation. If you ask me what I mean by depopulation, I mean the removal of entire racial units. And that is what I intend to carry out... Nature is cruel, therefore we, too, may be cruel.... I have the right to remove millions of an inferior race that breeds like vermin!​

Which wikiquote notes is from Hitler Speaks which they also note is disputed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermann_Rauschning#Authenticity_of_Hitler_Speaks
 
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power1

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So you are saying it should not be controlled at all? Just let the population grow until you can't feed them all?
If God sends babies, then how would it not be controlled? Do I want baby killers and those that want to rid us of sick or old controlling anything at all? No.
 
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power1

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Hitler never said that. The closest is:

We are obligated to depopulate as part of our mission of preserving the German population. We shall have to develop a technique of depopulation. If you ask me what I mean by depopulation, I mean the removal of entire racial units. And that is what I intend to carry out... Nature is cruel, therefore we, too, may be cruel.... I have the right to remove millions of an inferior race that breeds like vermin!​

Which wikiquote notes is from Hitler Speaks which they also note is disputed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermann_Rauschning#Authenticity_of_Hitler_Speaks
Well, he is known to have murdered a large part of his own population.

"
n Vienna alone, 1200 women and men were subjected to compulsory sterilization during the Nazi period; 6000 across the so called ‘Ostmark’ and at least 400 000 across the Third Reich in its entirety. The compulsory operations were legitimised by the 1933 National Socialist ‘Law for the Prevention of Hereditarily Diseased Offspring.’




The Law covered compulsory sterilization and abortions for women who were deemed ‘hereditarily defective’ – up to the end of the sixth month of pregnancy!"
https://muvs.org/en/topics/contrace...ruly-revolutionary-measure-adolf-hitler-1934/

Part of those he desired to kill was the sick apparently.
 
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Paulos23

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If God sends babies, then how would it not be controlled? Do I want baby killers and those that want to rid us of sick or old controlling anything at all? No.

But it is a biological process that is understood and can be controlled at the personal level. Why force them to have a baby or not use contraception? Let them make an informed choice, and the babies that are born will be wanted and be loved.
 
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Desk trauma

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If God sends babies, then how would it not be controlled? Do I want baby killers and those that want to rid us of sick or old controlling anything at all? No.
It would also seem you have no interest in discussing what people actually think but rather want to attempt to lump those who disagree with you in with the Nazis.
 
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power1

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But it is a biological process that is understood and can be controlled at the personal level. Why force them to have a baby or not use contraception? Let them make an informed choice, and the babies that are born will be wanted and be loved.
How is people having babies forced? Are you suggesting that if you do not offer to kill that baby, you are forcing them? How is it not informed to really know where babies come from? Did you think informing people how to murder was the quintessential definition of 'informed'?
 
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There are people and organizations that promote reducing the human population. If people suggest human lives be taken, either old or babies or any age or class, how is it they think they are exempt themselves. Should they not lead by example if they insist in this wrong philosophy?
Sometimes you will find a blog post.
 
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