Why are highly educated and trained professionals refusing to vaccinate?

Status
Not open for further replies.

renniks

Well-Known Member
Jun 2, 2008
10,682
3,445
✟149,430.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Likewise, if Fauci came out tomorrow and said, "New evidence shows that the only way to protect yourself from COVID is by eating cat poop", there would be people who would do it.
Cat poop smeared inside the mask, gives total protection against the virus! Yep some people would do it.
 
Upvote 0

mala

fluffy lion
Dec 5, 2002
3,379
2,520
✟260,324.00
Faith
Muslim
Marital Status
Single
Cat poop smeared inside the mask, gives total protection against the virus! Yep some people would do it.
the fact that you're making up these sorts of scenarios in your head when people close to your mindset are taking horse medication and drinking clorox makes it funnier.
 
Upvote 0

Belk

Senior Member
Supporter
Dec 21, 2005
28,243
12,996
Seattle
✟895,313.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Thus far, I've seen little evidence of vaccine resistance mutations. So far, our vaccines have held up pretty well against any and all variants.

If there were clear evidence that a variant emerged that completely bypassed the protective aspect of the vaccines, then I'd revise my position on that.

Kind of to late at that point. While delta is not resistant the vaccine is less effective.
 
Upvote 0

renniks

Well-Known Member
Jun 2, 2008
10,682
3,445
✟149,430.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
the fact that you're making up these sorts of scenarios in your head when people close to your mindset are taking horse medication and drinking clorox makes it funnier.
I don't know about Clorox but ivermectin is approved for human use in some countries. Yes some people go overboard with it.
 
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
22,247
2,920
46
PA
Visit site
✟132,474.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
are taking horse medication

I have no idea why people refer to Ivermectin as "horse medication". Ivermectin is an anti-parasitic with approved uses in humans.

Based on the current very low- to low-certainty evidence, we are uncertain about the efficacy and safety of ivermectin used to treat or prevent COVID-19. The completed studies are small and few are considered high quality. Several studies are underway that may produce clearer answers in review updates. Overall, the reliable evidence available does not support the use ivermectin for treatment or prevention of COVID-19 outside of well-designed randomized trials.

Ivermectin for preventing and treating COVID-19 - PubMed

As the above study shows, evidence does not currently support the use of Ivermectin as a treatment for COVID-19, but it's incredibly misleading to call it "horse medication".
 
Upvote 0

pacomascarot

Active Member
Oct 9, 2021
242
161
58
Southern California
✟3,943.00
Country
United States
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Likewise, if Fauci came out tomorrow and said, "New evidence shows that the only way to protect yourself from COVID is by eating cat poop", there would be people who would do it.

If scientists change their suggestions it is because science learns.

Maybe you should take some science classes!
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Paulos23
Upvote 0

ThatRobGuy

Part of the IT crowd
Supporter
Sep 4, 2005
24,642
14,525
Here
✟1,196,039.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Kind of to late at that point. While delta is not resistant the vaccine is less effective.

it was less effective in terms of transmission, but pretty effective against hospitalization and death...which was the original goal of the vaccines.

If we're waiting for vaccines that mean that "nobody will get the sniffles or a low grade fever ever again", we'll be waiting a long time. If the we're looking for a vaccine that will turn what could be a life-threatening virus into "a mild encounter", then we already have that...we just need to convince people to to take it.
 
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
22,247
2,920
46
PA
Visit site
✟132,474.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I responded to your post. Did my response suit you?
Sure. You posted studies showing efficacy of masking.

I posted studies showing otherwise.

Perhaps the question of whether masks reduce the spread of the virus isn't quite as settled as we've been led to believe.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: rjs330
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
22,247
2,920
46
PA
Visit site
✟132,474.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
If scientists change their suggestions it is because science learns.

That's the way it should be. That's not the way it has been throughout this pandemic.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: rjs330
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
22,247
2,920
46
PA
Visit site
✟132,474.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
If the we're looking for a vaccine that will turn what could be a life-threatening virus into "a mild encounter", then we already have that...
Anecdote alert.

The day after Labor Day, I came down with a fever. Then I developed a cough and general weakness. This persisted on and off for about 10 days before I began to recover. During that time, I drank lots of water, ate lots of chicken noodle soup, and took much Tylenol. I had a confirmed COVID test the Monday after I became symptomatic.

Last week, a fully vaccinated woman at our church tested positive for COVID. Her symptoms? About the same as mine. Duration of symptoms? About 10 days, about the same as mine. Same age as me, give or take 8 years.

Lest you think my case of COVID is atypical and I just got lucky, the CDC reports a total of 20,860 deaths in my age group since the start of the pandemic. That's with roughly 5,015,543 confirmed cases of COVID in my age group in the US since the beginning of the pandemic, or roughly 0.4%. That means that from the CDC's own data, 99.6% of people in my age group who have contracted COVID have also recovered.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, risk profiles are not the same across the board. Most (and when I say most, I mean 99.5% or more) young, healthy adults will be perfectly fine if they contract COVID. That's not downplaying the disease. It's what the data shows.

We should focus vaccination efforts where they will be most beneficial and will reduce the most severe outcomes. Again, vaccine mandates for employers completely miss the mark. When you look at deaths and severe outcomes from COVID, they are many orders of magnitude higher for the elderly than they are for younger people. Yet the employer vaccine mandate will do NOTHING to encourage those people that are at most risk to get vaccinated.
 
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
22,247
2,920
46
PA
Visit site
✟132,474.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
in your opinion which is highly questionable at this point.
My opinion is highly questionable in your opinion, which is highly questionable in my opinion.

Duly noted.

If you think THE SCIENCE™ hasn't been hijacked by opportunistic politicians, you simply aren't paying attention. IMO.
 
Upvote 0

pacomascarot

Active Member
Oct 9, 2021
242
161
58
Southern California
✟3,943.00
Country
United States
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Sure. You posted studies showing efficacy of masking.

I posted studies showing otherwise.

Perhaps the question of whether masks reduce the spread of the virus isn't quite as settled as we've been led to believe.

I wish I knew why someone who is a Christian has SO MUCH TROUBLE doing something simple that is helpful to others.

I understand you have selective cherry picked your favorite studies but given that you probably aren't a medical health professional I'm not going to assume you know the first foreign thing about any of this sufficient to prefer to take the LESSER ACTION.

Guess you prefer the wider, easier path. No extra work for you. Sure you might be wrong but who cares about all those other people IF YOU ARE?

LOL.

Hope you don't have to justify this action to God some day. He might ask why wearing a little piece of cloth was too much to ask after He gave his only begotten son on your behalf, to suffer and die on the cross. But you couldn't be bothered to wear a mask.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Sparagmos

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2018
8,632
7,319
52
Portland, Oregon
✟278,062.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Medical Professionals - Medical Doctors - now Pilots.

It's not uneducated people not willing to vaccinate.

Why are highly educated, very well paid professionals refusing?

Thoughts?

97% of doctors are vaccinated. So you should prob just remove them from your OP, you’re spreading misinformation.

Pilots aren’t "highly educated." And having spent a lot of time around them when I worked at a hotel, I’m not surprised they’re less vaccinated.

How much money they make is relevant how? Do you really want to use that metric?
 
Upvote 0

KCfromNC

Regular Member
Apr 18, 2007
28,632
15,950
✟484,106.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Perhaps if the CDC would contact her, as she requested, they could discuss the cases in more detail, as she said.

Still no actual explanation for the vague wording in the letter, huh?

Nope. Simply pointing out that no one is immune to confirmation bias. Including you. And me. And everyone else on the planet.

Relevance?

Not sure why anyone should take your concerns seriously when you seem so dismissive of the ICU physician's concerns.
I get you don't understand my objection. That's fine. If you find this sort of vague anecdotal data more useful than actual research on the subject, I can't stop you. Just trying to explain why many others won't really pay much attention to it.
 
Upvote 0

KCfromNC

Regular Member
Apr 18, 2007
28,632
15,950
✟484,106.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
What's the worst part of mandates for vaccination? Is it that it might help other people who didn't earn your help? Or is it that it might stop more people from dying? I can see that both of those are pretty bad outcomes.
I think the real objection is that they work - people on the fence about vaccinations, or who just didn't get around it to it, will be motivated to act. That'll make the one people left unvaccinated the fringe true believers, which is good from a public health perspective plus it will make it less of a big deal for other businesses to refuse to serve the unvaccinated. Bad for those left on the outside because of their choices, though.
 
Upvote 0

KCfromNC

Regular Member
Apr 18, 2007
28,632
15,950
✟484,106.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
The CDC has warned that fully vaccinated people still get infected and still transmit the disease. That's not true of the sterilizing polio and smallpox vaccines.

That's false - Vaccine Basics | Smallpox | CDC
Historically, the vaccine has been effective in preventing smallpox infection in 95% of those vaccinated.

In fact, there doesn't even seem to be a correlation between vaccination rates and rate of spread, much less any evidence of causation.
Also not true - Here’s how the most- and least-vaccinated states fared against the Delta variant

Vaccine mandates, we're told, are necessary to protect others. But when I had COVID last month, do you know how many people I infected? 0.

You can't possibly know that.

On the contrary, vaccinated people can become infected and not even know it.

Just like the unvaccinated. The big difference being that the vaccinated are less likely to get infected in the first place.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rambot
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

KCfromNC

Regular Member
Apr 18, 2007
28,632
15,950
✟484,106.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Yes vaccines are beneficial to individuals who get the vaccine. It may either prevent them from getting COVID Or it may lessen the symptoms and prevent severity. That certainly is a GOOD reason in my opinion to get vaccinated. But it SHOULD be someone's choice. Not mandated by government. Because not everyone gets really I'll, ends up in ICU or dies from it.

Yes, restaurant worker washing their hands after using the restroom is benefical to the individuals who wash their hands. It may either prevent them from getting or spreading disease. Or it may lessen the symptoms and prevent severity. That certainly is a GOOD reason in my opinion to wash their hands after using the restroom before returning to the kitchen. But it SHOULD be someone's choice. Not mandated by government. Because not everyone gets really ill, ends up in ICU or dies from it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rambot
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.