Joel's End Time Prophesies

Marilyn C

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More context: What was John the Baptist's message? "Repent for the kingdom of God is near."
What was Jesus message? "Repent for the kingdom of God is near."
What is the kingdom of God? The church universal, in eschatological tension - the now reigning in Christ - but not yet fully reigning over the world - and sometimes even martyred. That church. That kingdom.
.

That is not correct eclipse. The kingdom/rule of God was known in the OT and given as a promise to Israel. Jesus came (among other things) to confirm the promises of God to Israel. (Rom. 15: 8)

So reading what Jesus said to the people of Israel you will see what the kingdom/rule of God is all about. The king had arrived and thus the rulership of God had come to Israel. And from there to the nations of the world. However as we know they rejected Jesus and His rulership.


And note that the revelation of the Body of Christ was NOT known in those days. Thus it is NOT referring to the Body of Christ.

God`s word is NOT all about us, but for us to read and learn of Christ, His character and His purposes.
 
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Marilyn C

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More context: What was John the Baptist's message? "Repent for the kingdom of God is near."
What was Jesus message? "Repent for the kingdom of God is near."
What is the kingdom of God? The church universal, in eschatological tension - the now reigning in Christ - but not yet fully reigning over the world - and sometimes even martyred. That church. That kingdom.
.

The church is not a kingdom. The ekklesia are the called out ones, called out from Israel and called out from the nations. They are the Body of Christ.

The kingdom refers to the rule of God through Jesus. God`s great kingdom involves three realms - the angelic, the universal heaven, and the earth with the atmospheric heaven.

`For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions, or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.` (Col. 1: 16)

Each realm in God`s great kingdom, has had or is in rebellion of rulership. Thus each realm will have their rulership restored under the Lord Jesus Christ.

When people talk of `kingdom,` they think in terms of area, but God made the earth and NEVER gave it away. (Ps. 24: 1) So to talk of the Body of Christ being a kingdom, is in error. We are the Body of Christ.

And the kingdom is God`s RULE over all of His creation in the 3 realms.
 
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Douggg

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You say the State of Israel is an undivided nation. What a joke! The Jews have more factions in their religious and social life than anybody.
Then there are the Bai-hai's, the Buddists, the Spiritualists, plus; and 20% of the population are Muslim.
Undivided as far as being one nation, and not two nations. There are maps on a Google search of the northern kingdom and the southern kingdom. And of course present Israel.
Which verifies that part of Ezekiel 37 has been fulfilled.
 
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eclipsenow

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70AD was the withering of the fig tree, not the fig tree bringing forth new leaves.
Umm... why are you dividing them up? The verse just doesn't allow it. The sprouting IS going to happen in THAT generation.
Luke
When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. 31 Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near. 32 “Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.
Matthew
As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

70AD ended with the destruction of the temple, not the restoration of all things.
So? It's what Jesus started this whole conversation with - and it happened.

70AD ended with the scattering of Israel, not the gathering of the elect.
So?

Matthew 24 could be about sending his angels ie: messengers to gather his elect. As we see in Acts. The gospel going forth.

Death & Resurrection & Ascension = Son of Man returning to the Ancient of Days in glory
Angels = messengers.

The Olivet discourse was not about 70AD.
Period.

Well, maybe there is some Last Days smuggled into Matthew 24, where one could possibly split the themes into 'these things' being temple destroyed and 'that day' being Judgement Day.

But Luke 21 seems more concerned with everything happening in that generation. So if you read Luke 21 as ALL happening that generation, then the prophecy failed and Luke isn't true. I'm not comfortable with that - are you? THAT Temple and THAT generation. Try again!
 
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eclipsenow

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The church is not a kingdom. The ekklesia are the called out ones, called out from Israel and called out from the nations.
All true enough - but kind of missing the point. There is the kingdom past, present and future. Click the link below to read past, but I think we are now more concerned about defining Present and Future.

The Kingdom of God, Present
In the New Testament, the promised Messiah comes as “Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham” (Matt. 1:1). Through his incarnation, sinless life, crucifixion, and resurrection, Jesus fulfills the messianic promises, accomplishes the messianic mission, and brings redemption to a lost world.

Jesus is the King whose words and deeds bring the spiritual kingdom of God. He proclaims the coming of the kingdom (Matt. 4:17; Mark 1:15; Luke 4:43), preaches the parables of the kingdom (Matt. 13:1–50), and declares the ethics and nature of the kingdom (Matt. 5–7). His deeds, especially his casting out demons by the Spirit, usher in the kingdom: “If I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you” (Matt. 12:28; cf. Luke 11:20). Christ’s mission always leads “up to Jerusalem” and his death and resurrection, where he brings salvation through his sacrifice.

In his ascension, Jesus moves from the limited earthly sphere to the transcendent heavenly one. He sits at God’s right hand “in the heavens—far above every ruler and authority, power and dominion” (Eph. 1:20–21) now and forever. When Jesus pours out the Spirit on the church at Pentecost, God’s kingdom expands mightily as thousands come to Christ (Acts 2:41, 47; 4:4). Peter explains: “God exalted this man to his right hand as ruler and Savior, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins” (Acts 5:31). God rescues sinners “from the domain of darkness” and transfers them “into the kingdom of the Son he loves” (Col. 1:13–14).

The “kingdom,” as God’s reign over his people, will finally and ultimately “come at the end of the age in a mighty irruption into history inaugurating the perfect order of the age to come.” And yet this kingdom “has already come into history in the person and mission of Jesus,” and thus the “presence of the future” is already evident (see George Eldon Ladd, The Presence of the Future, 144–49). So, God’s reign is present and future, already and not yet, his active invasion of history now and his final establishment of the age to come. It is a sovereign rule, a dynamic power, and a divine activity. As the bearer of this kingdom, Jesus requires repentance to enter his kingdom community, since the present way of the world must be rejected and the new age of God’s rule and its corresponding way of life embraced. As such, repentance is not only the way into the kingdom but also the way of the kingdom.

The New Testament also proclaims that Jesus will return to reign as king, bringing justice, peace, delight, and victory. We live, then, in the tension between the “already” and the “not yet.” The kingdom was established with Israel, inaugurated with Christ in his coming, and achieved in the events of Christ’s death and resurrection. Even though the kingdom effects have begun, their full results await Christ’s return.

The Kingdom of God, Future
Although Jesus in his earthly ministry brings the kingdom, which expands exponentially at Pentecost, the fullness of the kingdom awaits until “the Son of Man comes in his glory” and sits “on his glorious throne” (Matt. 25:31). Then the angels will proclaim, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever” (Rev. 11:15). Jesus will judge the world, inviting believers to “inherit the kingdom” while consigning the lost to eternal punishment (Matt. 25:31–46). At “the end,” Jesus will hand “over the kingdom to God the Father” (1 Cor. 15:24).

Thus the new heavens and new earth will be the final stage of the kingdom of God. The kingdom of God will be at peace only in the end. Though Jesus’s victory has been won, the battle rages until his second coming (1 Pet. 5:8). God’s people conquer through Christ, who loves them and has given himself for them (Gal. 2:20). “The Lion from the tribe of Judah” who “has conquered” is the slain Lamb (Rev. 5:5–6). When the final installment of the kingdom arrives, the struggles of the present life will be past. By God’s grace, believers will reign with Christ. Human life will flourish, and human culture will thrive in the city of God (Heb. 2:5–10; Rev. 21:24–26). Jesus will return, deliver his people, and bring the final installment of his kingdom (Rev. 11:15).

Heaven involves God’s people serving their great King as subjects of his kingdom now and forever: “They are before the throne of God, and they serve him day and night” (Rev. 7:15). The Evil One is a defeated foe who will one day be thrown into the lake of fire (Rev. 20:10). Through Christ, believers overcome death, so that at death they go to be with him (Phil. 1:23), and in the resurrection, death will be banished (1 Cor. 15:26; Rev. 21:4).

Conclusion
The kingdom of God is central to the biblical story of redemption. The story follows the narrative of the fall, the calling of the nation of Israel, and the coming of the promised Messiah, while prophesying his return one day in the culmination of all things, at which time he will set up the new Eden of God’s kingdom in the new heavens and new earth. In the meantime, we live in the already and not yet of the kingdom, serving our King and looking for his return.
The Kingdom of God - The Gospel Coalition
 
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Jamdoc

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Umm... why are you dividing them up? The verse just doesn't allow it. The sprouting IS going to happen in THAT generation.
Luke
When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. 31 Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near. 32 “Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.
Matthew
As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

The thing is, none of those people would see the Fig tree bring forth new leaves, because the Fig tree hadn't withered yet. It's only after the fig tree has seemed dead for a season, or almost 1900 years in this season, that new leaves would be a sign.
The people Jesus talked to then in the first century? They'd see the tree wither, as they literally saw Jesus wither a fig tree outside of Jerusalem.
They would not see it bring forth new leaves.

The question was about the end of the age.
we're not in the next age which is a new heaven and new earth, and sin and death are no more.
Those simple facts strike down any interpretation that the Olivet Discourse was about 70AD.
If you spiritualize away the meaning of all scripture in order to claim that it's all already happened, you deny the second coming, deny the bodily resurrection, and deny the new earth. You've invented an alternate reality where you just die and go to heaven forever as a spirit, which I know is a common (but mistaken) belief.
God has promised to bring heaven down to Earth and dwell among us, as the Lord Jesus Christ.
and has promised a bodily resurrection, as Jesus received a bodily resurrection.
 
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Marilyn C

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God has promised to bring heaven down to Earth and dwell among us, as the Lord Jesus Christ.
and has promised a bodily resurrection, as Jesus received a bodily resurrection.

Hi Jamdoc,

I do agree with a lot you are saying, however this part I don`t agree. Heaven does NOT come down to earth, or move anywhere. That is actually quite ridiculous. Perhaps you mean something else and it has come over wrong.

Care to explain?
 
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Marilyn C

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All true enough - but kind of missing the point. There is the kingdom past, present and future. Click the link below to read past, but I think we are now more concerned about defining Present and Future.

The Kingdom of God, Present
In the New Testament, the promised Messiah comes as “Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham” (Matt. 1:1). Through his incarnation, sinless life, crucifixion, and resurrection, Jesus fulfills the messianic promises, accomplishes the messianic mission, and brings redemption to a lost world.

Jesus is the King whose words and deeds bring the spiritual kingdom of God. He proclaims the coming of the kingdom (Matt. 4:17; Mark 1:15; Luke 4:43), preaches the parables of the kingdom (Matt. 13:1–50), and declares the ethics and nature of the kingdom (Matt. 5–7). His deeds, especially his casting out demons by the Spirit, usher in the kingdom: “If I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you” (Matt. 12:28; cf. Luke 11:20). Christ’s mission always leads “up to Jerusalem” and his death and resurrection, where he brings salvation through his sacrifice.

In his ascension, Jesus moves from the limited earthly sphere to the transcendent heavenly one. He sits at God’s right hand “in the heavens—far above every ruler and authority, power and dominion” (Eph. 1:20–21) now and forever. When Jesus pours out the Spirit on the church at Pentecost, God’s kingdom expands mightily as thousands come to Christ (Acts 2:41, 47; 4:4). Peter explains: “God exalted this man to his right hand as ruler and Savior, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins” (Acts 5:31). God rescues sinners “from the domain of darkness” and transfers them “into the kingdom of the Son he loves” (Col. 1:13–14).

The “kingdom,” as God’s reign over his people, will finally and ultimately “come at the end of the age in a mighty irruption into history inaugurating the perfect order of the age to come.” And yet this kingdom “has already come into history in the person and mission of Jesus,” and thus the “presence of the future” is already evident (see George Eldon Ladd, The Presence of the Future, 144–49). So, God’s reign is present and future, already and not yet, his active invasion of history now and his final establishment of the age to come. It is a sovereign rule, a dynamic power, and a divine activity. As the bearer of this kingdom, Jesus requires repentance to enter his kingdom community, since the present way of the world must be rejected and the new age of God’s rule and its corresponding way of life embraced. As such, repentance is not only the way into the kingdom but also the way of the kingdom.

The New Testament also proclaims that Jesus will return to reign as king, bringing justice, peace, delight, and victory. We live, then, in the tension between the “already” and the “not yet.” The kingdom was established with Israel, inaugurated with Christ in his coming, and achieved in the events of Christ’s death and resurrection. Even though the kingdom effects have begun, their full results await Christ’s return.

The Kingdom of God, Future
Although Jesus in his earthly ministry brings the kingdom, which expands exponentially at Pentecost, the fullness of the kingdom awaits until “the Son of Man comes in his glory” and sits “on his glorious throne” (Matt. 25:31). Then the angels will proclaim, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign forever and ever” (Rev. 11:15). Jesus will judge the world, inviting believers to “inherit the kingdom” while consigning the lost to eternal punishment (Matt. 25:31–46). At “the end,” Jesus will hand “over the kingdom to God the Father” (1 Cor. 15:24).

Thus the new heavens and new earth will be the final stage of the kingdom of God. The kingdom of God will be at peace only in the end. Though Jesus’s victory has been won, the battle rages until his second coming (1 Pet. 5:8). God’s people conquer through Christ, who loves them and has given himself for them (Gal. 2:20). “The Lion from the tribe of Judah” who “has conquered” is the slain Lamb (Rev. 5:5–6). When the final installment of the kingdom arrives, the struggles of the present life will be past. By God’s grace, believers will reign with Christ. Human life will flourish, and human culture will thrive in the city of God (Heb. 2:5–10; Rev. 21:24–26). Jesus will return, deliver his people, and bring the final installment of his kingdom (Rev. 11:15).

Heaven involves God’s people serving their great King as subjects of his kingdom now and forever: “They are before the throne of God, and they serve him day and night” (Rev. 7:15). The Evil One is a defeated foe who will one day be thrown into the lake of fire (Rev. 20:10). Through Christ, believers overcome death, so that at death they go to be with him (Phil. 1:23), and in the resurrection, death will be banished (1 Cor. 15:26; Rev. 21:4).

Conclusion
The kingdom of God is central to the biblical story of redemption. The story follows the narrative of the fall, the calling of the nation of Israel, and the coming of the promised Messiah, while prophesying his return one day in the culmination of all things, at which time he will set up the new Eden of God’s kingdom in the new heavens and new earth. In the meantime, we live in the already and not yet of the kingdom, serving our King and looking for his return.
The Kingdom of God - The Gospel Coalition

Hi eclipse,

You seem to confuse `kingdom/area with kingdom/rule. God created the earth and all its fullness, and its people.

`The earth is the Lord`s and all its fullness, the world and those who dwell therein..` (Ps. 24: 1)

Note you say - `God’s kingdom expands mightily as thousands come to Christ..`

Although Jesus in his earthly ministry brings the kingdom, which expands exponentially at Pentecost, the fullness of the kingdom awaits until “the Son of Man comes in his glory” and sits “on his glorious throne”

How does the earth and the people who are all in God`s great kingdom, for He made them all, how do they `expand? God rules over all, and no one or no demon has taken anything away from God.

However if we talk about kingdom, rulership then it all becomes clear.

God promised Israel that they would rule the nations of the world. They would have the rulership of heaven over them as a nation. (Dan. 7: 27)
When Jesus was manifest on earth He came to confirm the promises of God to Israel, (as well as other things.) (Rom. 15: 8)

`Now I say that Jesus Christ has become a servant to the circumcision for the truth of God, TO CONFIRM THE PROMISES MADE TO THE FATHERS.` (Rom. 15: 8)

You said - Jesus is the King whose words and deeds bring the spiritual kingdom of God.

However we see Jesus operating in His kingly rulership over demons, nature, healings, miracles etc. All of which are very clear in the natural world.

Christ promised His Body that they would sit with Him on His throne, which is in the highest. (Rev. 3: 21, Ps. 2: 6, Heb. 12: 22)

The New Heavens and New Earth will be much more than the setting `up the new Eden`as you say. It will be setting in the different realms, the rulership that God has planned under His Son.
 
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Jamdoc

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Hi Jamdoc,

I do agree with a lot you are saying, however this part I don`t agree. Heaven does NOT come down to earth, or move anywhere. That is actually quite ridiculous. Perhaps you mean something else and it has come over wrong.

Care to explain?

No, I mean what I said.

Revelation 21:1-3
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

It is one of the most profound truths in the entire bible. It has been the goal all along. Not to be a distant God reigning from above people with only a tenuous relationship through prayer. But to be a God with an intimate relationship with His people and He lives with them, on Earth, in fellowship with Him, as has always been the intent, a familial relationship.
It is the entire purpose of creation and redemptive history, for there to be a people who have freely chosen to love God and be His family. It was the plan even before the fall, for God to dwell with His creation in fellowship.
 
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Marilyn C

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No, I mean what I said.

Revelation 21:1-3


It is one of the most profound truths in the entire bible. It has been the goal all along. Not to be a distant God reigning from above people with only a tenuous relationship through prayer. But to be a God with an intimate relationship with His people and He lives with them, on Earth, in fellowship with Him, as has always been the intent, a familial relationship.
It is the entire purpose of creation and redemptive history, for there to be a people who have freely chosen to love God and be His family. It was the plan even before the fall, for God to dwell with His creation in fellowship.

Ok, let`s look closer. `Then I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem coming down OUT OF HEAVEN FROM GOD.` (Rev. 21: 2) So NO heaven does NOT come down. The city comes down out of heaven.

Now God is spirit and is everywhere. He is NOT sitting on a seat, or even able to be seen. However by His Holy Spirit he is and will be with His people all through out His great kingdom over all.

The most profound truth in the entire Bible is that Christ will be pre-eminent OVER ALL. In every realm that He created there will be those who serve and rule under Him -

- the angelic realm, the third heaven, the Body of Christ.
- the universal heavens, the city, with the OT saints & 12 apostles.
- the earth. Israel over the nations.
 
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Jamdoc

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Ok, let`s look closer. `Then I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem coming down OUT OF HEAVEN FROM GOD.` (Rev. 21: 2) So NO heaven does NOT come down. The city comes down out of heaven.

Now God is spirit and is everywhere. He is NOT sitting on a seat, or even able to be seen. However by His Holy Spirit he is and will be with His people all through out His great kingdom over all.

The most profound truth in the entire Bible is that Christ will be pre-eminent OVER ALL. In every realm that He created there will be those who serve and rule under Him -

- the angelic realm, the third heaven, the Body of Christ.
- the universal heavens, the city, with the OT saints & 12 apostles.
- the earth. Israel over the nations.

That's Greek thought talking.
Cryptoplatonism.
That is #1, a low view of physical creation, which is the Greek Thought, that you have to escape physical creation because physical bad, spirit good in their eyes. The Biblical teaching is that creation is inherently good, we just tainted it, but it will be restored to its intended goodness.
It is also #2, pride, seeing yourself above the 12 apostles and Israel, and other people, quite literally.
The opposite of what God actually does which is descend to dwell with Men.
I love Jesus, our God because He chooses to lower Himself to us. it is humbling in itself.
 
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keras

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Ok, let`s look closer. `Then I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem coming down OUT OF HEAVEN FROM GOD.` (Rev. 21: 2) So NO heaven does NOT come down. The city comes down out of heaven.
Revelation 21:3 Now; God has His dwelling with mankind......After the Millennium. Where God is, there is heaven.
Undivided as far as being one nation, and not two nations. There are maps on a Google search of the northern kingdom and the southern kingdom. And of course present Israel.
Which verifies that part of Ezekiel 37 has been fulfilled.
No part of Ezekiel 37 has been fulfilled. Currently; Jews live in Northern and Southern Israel. I can personally confirm this, as I have been to Tiberius, Capernaum, Tsafart, Haifa and Nazareth, etc. They are all Jewish towns.
The people Jesus talked to then in the first century? They'd see the tree wither, as they literally saw Jesus wither a fig tree outside of Jerusalem.
They would not see it bring forth new leaves.
Yes, the conquest of Judah by the Romans, was prophesied by Jesus, as the fig tree withering and dying. The budding if the fig tree was the establishment of the Jewish State of Israel and by that sign, we know that the end is near and the generation present at that time, those alive today; will see it all.
All, that is: of the end time events, leading up to the glorious Return of Jesus.
 
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jgr

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The thing is, none of those people would see the Fig tree bring forth new leaves, because the Fig tree hadn't withered yet. It's only after the fig tree has seemed dead for a season, or almost 1900 years in this season, that new leaves would be a sign.
The people Jesus talked to then in the first century? They'd see the tree wither, as they literally saw Jesus wither a fig tree outside of Jerusalem.
They would not see it bring forth new leaves.

The question was about the end of the age.
we're not in the next age which is a new heaven and new earth, and sin and death are no more.
Those simple facts strike down any interpretation that the Olivet Discourse was about 70AD.
If you spiritualize away the meaning of all scripture in order to claim that it's all already happened, you deny the second coming, deny the bodily resurrection, and deny the new earth. You've invented an alternate reality where you just die and go to heaven forever as a spirit, which I know is a common (but mistaken) belief.
God has promised to bring heaven down to Earth and dwell among us, as the Lord Jesus Christ.
and has promised a bodily resurrection, as Jesus received a bodily resurrection.

Luke 21
29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.

If the fig tree represents Israel, whom do all the trees represent?
 
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Jamdoc

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Luke 21
29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.

If the fig tree represents Israel, whom do all the trees represent?

Nations.
like Lebanon is often connected to Cedar Trees.


Joel 1 and 2, refer to Israel (and Judah?) as the vine and the fig tree, and it's just a common motif for those 2 crops in particular to get mentioned in combination. You can search "fig tree" in the old testament and it's always paired with the vine. I'm not sure if they are separate symbols for Israel and Judah, but they're almost always mentioned together. That's the one most related to this topic.

But the ones that spell the symbol out directly are Hosea 9:10, and Jeremiah 24 (the whole chapter)
10 I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: but they went to Baalpeor, and separated themselves unto that shame; and their abominations were according as they loved.
Jeremiah 24 refers to Israel as the figs themselves in the basket, both good and bad. God told Jeremiah that the good figs would be taken into captivity, but a remnant would survive and be delivered. But the bad figs would stay and eventually be wiped out.
 
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keras

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If the fig tree represents Israel, whom do all the trees represent?
The rest of the nations.
Over the last 70 years, the world has generally experienced prosperity; no big wars, better health, better wellbeing and the benefits of modern civilization.
Is all that a sign or what?
 
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Timtofly

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Hi Jamdoc,

I do agree with a lot you are saying, however this part I don`t agree. Heaven does NOT come down to earth, or move anywhere. That is actually quite ridiculous. Perhaps you mean something else and it has come over wrong.

Care to explain?
The church is in Paradise not heaven. Paradise is in heaven. Yes, being in Paradise is being in heaven, but not outside of Paradise. Saying heaven comes down should be Paradise comes down. Third heaven is not the highest heaven. Third heaven is Paradise which is separate from the atmosphere and heaven itself. The angels were placed in the firmament. The throne of God rest on the earth and extends into the firmament. There was at one time water above the firmament, even above the angels. That would make heaven a place of water. How literal do you want to take what Scriptures say?
 
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Douggg

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No part of Ezekiel 37 has been fulfilled. Currently; Jews live in Northern and Southern Israel. I can personally confirm this, as I have been to Tiberius, Capernaum, Tsafart, Haifa and Nazareth, etc. They are all Jewish towns.

Yes, the conquest of Judah by the Romans, was prophesied by Jesus, as the fig tree withering and dying. The budding if the fig tree was the establishment of the Jewish State of Israel and by that sign, we know that the end is near and the generation present at that time, those alive today; will see it all.
All, that is: of the end time events, leading up to the glorious Return of Jesus.
Keras, you are denying what the maps plainly show. One nation where two nations once were. That part of Ezekiel 37 has been fulfilled.

As well as, Isaiah 66:7-8, a nation born in a day. May 14, 1948. The name of that nation "Israel", not Judah.

That reality disproves your end time scenario of all the Christians of the world, the church, over a billion people, relocating into tiny Israel following a cataclysmic solar event - killing off much of the middle east population before the 7 years begin.

Parts of Ezekiel 38 have been fulfilled as well, the people coming back from the nations. And the time the latter days, latter years.
 
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jgr

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The rest of the nations.
Over the last 70 years, the world has generally experienced prosperity; no big wars, better health, better wellbeing and the benefits of modern civilization.
Is all that a sign or what?

Luke 21
29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.

The fig tree and all the trees shoot forth in the same season.

Dispens claim that the fig tree "shot forth" as Israel in 1948.

The rest of the trees did not shoot forth in 1948.
 
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