SoldierOfTheKing

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You say that like immigration is a bad thing.

It certainly can be, and today most of it is.

Where'd you get that idea?

George W. Bush. John McCain. Romney was somewhat better on immigration but still not very good.

Yes, it is rather ironic how "I voted for a President, not a pastor!" has altogether disappeared among Trump supporters since Biden was elected. But it's too late for these conservatives to start acting like the personal character of the president is an important moral issue for them again. No one, outside of the Trump echo chamber, is taking their public display of moral indignation towards Biden seriously.

Biden’s inability to put two coherent sentences together when off the teleprompter isn’t a moral failing, and I haven’t heard of anyone claiming it was.
 
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Pommer

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A year or two ago, I made the same observation. Because conservative Christians latched themselves so prominently to a man that did not espouse the beliefs they claimed to champion, it completely undermined them. In the future, any time they speak of morals, they can now be completely ignored because it's obvious this is not about morals, it's about power.

It's the same thing with immigration, they are simply against immigration because they see it as a the dilution of the white vote. Fox News has been pushing this hysteria over the past decade with repeated articles about white people losing majority status by 2050. It's what fueled their opposition to immigration. All immigration is their target; that's why they have rejected more refugees, cut the number of applications, increased processing time for green cards, and have in general, made the process of immigrating and becoming a US citizen harder. However, running on that shows too much of their hand, so they argue as if they are only concerned about illegal immigration. They don't want any immigrants because an immigrant is less likely to come from Europe, which they believe means they do not support the current extremist form of the Republican Party.

This is also what fuels their overdriven effort to limit voting; reminiscent of the literacy tests and poll taxes of the past, they want make it harder to vote because they believe only the "right kind of people" should be voting.
Such a pity!
The very same people who reject the SOCIALISM of Europe (thereby making European emigration much less likely) are also against Central American people immigrating who see the USA as a bastion of freedom and flock to us.
Such a pity!

We’re going to have to give on one or t’other, keeping the status quo is no longer going to be tenable.
 
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Pommer

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Biden’s inability to put two coherent sentences together when off the teleprompter isn’t a moral failing, and I haven’t heard of anyone claiming it was.
The marketplace of ideas is where we used to be able to stop believing our own rhetoric, now that each side has their own marketplace of ideas, this simply is not the case anymore.
 
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SoldierOfTheKing

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If we're just making moral arguments....

For liberals, everything is moral issue. Nothing is ever a practical issue on which we can make our own personal judgement. Observe that on this very thread we have a poster lumping welfare policy in with abortion and homosexuality.

Of course, if we look at immigration as a practical question of US interest, the case for tighter borders becomes clear. Once we stop thinking in terms of what we owe immigrants - because we don’t owe them anything - and start thinking in terms of whether we need them, it’s not nearly as difficult a question.
 
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Pommer

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For liberals, everything is moral issue. Nothing is ever a practical issue on which we can make our own personal judgement. Observe that on this very thread we have a poster lumping welfare policy in with abortion and homosexuality.

Of course, if we look at immigration as a practical question of US interest, the case for tighter borders becomes clear. Once we stop thinking in terms of what we owe immigrants - because we don’t owe them anything - and start thinking in terms of whether we need them, it’s not nearly as difficult a question.
The three great bugaboos of American politics has always revolved around immigration, education and race. Always.
 
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SoldierOfTheKing

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It's the same thing with immigration, they are simply against immigration because they see it as a the dilution of the white vote.

Is this not a good enough reason to oppose immigration?
 
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Guinan

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A year or two ago, I made the same observation. Because conservative Christians latched themselves so prominently to a man that did not espouse the beliefs they claimed to champion, it completely undermined them. In the future, any time they speak of morals, they can now be completely ignored because it's obvious this is not about morals, it's about power.

It's the same thing with immigration, they are simply against immigration because they see it as a the dilution of the white vote. Fox News has been pushing this hysteria over the past decade with repeated articles about white people losing majority status by 2050. It's what fueled their opposition to immigration. All immigration is their target; that's why they have rejected more refugees, cut the number of applications, increased processing time for green cards, and have in general, made the process of immigrating and becoming a US citizen harder. However, running on that shows too much of their hand, so they argue as if they are only concerned about illegal immigration. They don't want any immigrants because an immigrant is less likely to come from Europe, which they believe means they do not support the current extremist form of the Republican Party.

This is also what fuels their overdriven effort to limit voting; reminiscent of the literacy tests and poll taxes of the past, they want make it harder to vote because they believe only the "right kind of people" should be voting.

Apparently many white Americans really fear becoming the minority in this country.

Some White Trump Supporters Fear Becoming Minority

Thinking About a Majority-Minority Shift Leads to More Conservative Views

Fears of White People Losing Out Permeate Capitol Rioters’ Towns, Study Finds

46% of whites worry becoming a majority-minority nation will 'weaken American culture,' survey says
 
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Ana the Ist

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Ana the Ist

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"The inhumane way smugglers abuse children while profiting off parents' desperation is criminal and morally reprehensible. Just this month, a young girl died by drowning, a six-month-old was thrown into the river, and two young children were dropped from a wall and left in the desert alone. There can be no doubt that children are exceptionally vulnerable when placed in the hands of smugglers. There is grave risk they will be exploited and harmed. I applaud our heroic Border Patrol agents who have saved lives this week and every week, while putting their own lives at risk for the greater good of the country," he said."

So....that's the same article. Dead children. Your policies kill children.

Can we drop the moral posturing and discuss reasonable policy?

Or do you want to see more horrors against humanity that you support?
 
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Ana the Ist

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If you're answer is to fight the Mexican smugglers....you're almost too stupid to join the conversation.

Mexican police officers arrested over migrant killings

Mexican police work as enforcers for the smugglers. They murdered a whole group of migrants who didn't pay the smugglers.

Mexico is too corrupt to stop the problem.
 
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SummerMadness

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Is this not a good enough reason to oppose immigration?
If a person supports support this idea, then why huff and puff about it being called white supremacy? It is white supremacy. This is in line with people that want to treat being called a racist as a slur, while espousing all the beliefs that a racist holds.
 
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Ana the Ist

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So a vast criminal network exploits, murders, and abuses children and adults as long as we allow them in illegally.

That's a fact.

Let's discuss how to stop illegal immigration so they cannot continue to profit this way.
 
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George W. Bush. John McCain. Romney was somewhat better on immigration but still not very good.

Trump has employed illegal workers, for years. How do you get a pre-Trump GOP worse than that? Or are you equating immigration with illegal immigration? The majority of illegal immigrants in the US didn’t come there overland.
 
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Ana the Ist

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If a person supports support this idea, then why huff and puff about it being called white supremacy? It is white supremacy. This is in line with people that want to treat being called a racist as a slur, while espousing all the beliefs that a racist holds.

I thought you were in favor of proportional racial representation in government?

If you are....why should any race seek to reduce their proportional representation?

We can apply this to black people as well....or asians....or any racial group.
 
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Ana the Ist

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If a person supports support this idea, then why huff and puff about it being called white supremacy? It is white supremacy.

Is a black person voting for a black candidate because they are black....black supremacy?
 
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Why is it that the Democratic Party is so pro-immigration? Immigrants can’t even vote...
The thinking is that, in time, Congress will give all of them citizenship and, therefore, the right to vote. Or the current president might try to do it with one of his edicts. Also, making part of one city (Washington, DC) into a state (!) and making Puerto Rico a state as well will increase the Democratic Party's representation in both Houses of Congress. Anyone who opposes this will be accused of "voter suppression," or "Jim Crow" or "White Supremacy" and so on.
 
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Ana the Ist

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Let's be honest....

The people arguing against "white supremacy" have been arguing in favor of its principles for years now.

They totally support racial groups promoting their own race and it's political concerns....valid or not. They argue that those outside of the racial group cannot understand the views of the racial group and therefore outside races should be ignored.
 
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