Was Jesus A Politician?

[Religiot]

Hell you, and welcome.

Have you ever considered that Christianity and it’s appeals to our flesh should dominate in Politics?

Do you believe this would make the American Government work even better?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

What do you believe will happen on day upon Yeshuas return, will be dominate and reign for 1000 years?

The thing is Jesus Christ was never political, he even paid taxes to Cesar.

Jesus Christ that his kingdom was not of this earth and that his kingdom was heavenly.

What does this mean for you? If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ a little piece of heaven resides in you know as the kingdom of God - The Holy Spirit (spirit of truth), and the spirit of Christ reigns with-in your body.

It has nothing to do with political agendas.

What would you say? Is this a wrong take?

Was Jesus Christ really involved with politics in his day?

Well, maybe: He is the King of the Jews, after all.

 

[GDL]

Is it though? Especially in the absence of a working and agreed upon meaning of the word “political” and “politics”?

It is plausible to accept everything you’ve said as true and still arrive to the conclusion Jesus wasn’t political or engaged in politics by relying upon a sensible but particular meaning for both “political” and “politics”

Fair enough. I normally am not the one to argue against definition in order to know we're all thinking the same about a word we're using.

Suggestions?

 

[GDL]

Hell you

Aubrey: Would you edit this please? It keeps throwing me every time I see it quoted and how we're all reading past it! Hell you too...

 

[AubreyM]

Hello @expos4ever

Jesus did say don’t believe them when they say there it is, or here it is, for behold the kingdom of God is in you. In luke some where

 

[DamianWarS]

Hello you, and welcome.

Have you ever considered that Christianity and it’s appeals to our flesh should dominate in Politics?

Do you believe this would make the American Government work even better?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

What do you believe will happen on day upon Yeshuas return, will be dominate and reign for 1000 years?

The thing is Jesus Christ was never political, he even paid taxes to Cesar.

Jesus Christ that his kingdom was not of this earth and that his kingdom was heavenly.

What does this mean for you? If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ a little piece of heaven resides in you know as the kingdom of God - The Holy Spirit (spirit of truth), and the spirit of Christ reigns with-in your body.

It has nothing to do with political agendas.

What would you say? Is this a wrong take?

Was Jesus Christ really involved with politics in his day?

Politics are shaped by popular demand. They create leadership at the top but influenced by a bottom up model. So if you want a create a Christian government then you need to change popular demand with regards to social issues and morality, ethics, etc... to be Christian driven. And if you want that on a wide scale you need to start with a few people and help start a discipleship making movent where new believers come to faith exponentially. However forcing a Christian government is no different than a dictatorship. If the people want it, politictians will rise up to meet the demand the people want and if they hold a majority position they will be elected. Even if you target the absolute top and they become a sold out believer they are still responsible to the conditions they were voted in for. This idea of starting a top down model is not sustainable and it needs to be a bottom up approach, this is exactly what Christ did.

 

[AubreyM]

Hello Damian,

That would have to be the way to do it, thinking about all of this, in the bible in 1 John somewhere it makes a distinction about the world and it's ways:

So by the fleshly sense ; one would have their mind, will, and emotions set towards a specific goal in besetting the world with an ideaology - in this case Christianity the forerunner - and bestowing up the idea of a fleshly manner.

With consideration of this Jesus Christ has already set the standard though He was a man, and God was with us through Him by the spirit.

Jesus Christ sets the standards by living by the spirit which God works on the heart of people as they follow Him, and the spirit inside of them grows from a mustard seed into that of even more - like that of a bush or tree growing and becoming deeply rooted in Christ, and living by faith and love in what standards He set and spoken about.

So there is no way that Christianity and it's ideals will ever be able to reach that of a political standpoint because they truly are not of earth, they are from heaven above when you think about it. - Christianity is really looked down upon by the world - (Hopefully you understand the figure of speech).​

Thank you for your comment, and time.

 

[Tom 1]

Hello you, and welcome.

Have you ever considered that Christianity and it’s appeals to our flesh should dominate in Politics?

Do you believe this would make the American Government work even better?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

What do you believe will happen on day upon Yeshuas return, will be dominate and reign for 1000 years?

The thing is Jesus Christ was never political, he even paid taxes to Cesar.

Jesus Christ that his kingdom was not of this earth and that his kingdom was heavenly.

What does this mean for you? If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ a little piece of heaven resides in you know as the kingdom of God - The Holy Spirit (spirit of truth), and the spirit of Christ reigns with-in your body.

It has nothing to do with political agendas.

What would you say? Is this a wrong take?

Was Jesus Christ really involved with politics in his day?

Being a Christian involves agreeing to follow certain standards of personal behaviour, or at least to acknowledge those standards as aspirational. People sign up for a certain lifestyle like that through choice, for whatever reason, or just go along with it because they are used to it etc, but imposing those standards by law or policy is a different story.

Religious principles might be one of the things that influence policy makers in a very general sense but attempting to apply religion by law, to make the teachings of one religion the basis for how everyone should live within the law, has a pretty bad history.

Most of us agree to a social contract that isn’t too burdensome and allows us to be ourselves with the trade off that there is punishment for breaking the rules. Those rules need to be accepted by the majority though, and differ from one country to another, so it’s hard to say where the line should be drawn. Most of us want to be protected from harm and to refrain from harming others, but even on that basic level there is disagreement about what harm means. A number of Christian teachings go beyond what most people would be willing to accept as law.

To me any attempt to override personal freedom beyond what the majority is willing to accept, through government policy, in some attempt to convert at least the behaviour if not the minds of citizens is fundamentally wrong. It’s bad for everyone, as far as I’m concerned, but in any case one of the most consistent teachings throughout the bible is the idea of God’s people as separate from ‘the world’. It’s not our business to make the world more like the church by the direct means of religious government over any group that hasn’t voluntarily signed up for such. As far as I can see from the gospels, Jesus was entirely indifferent to the political circumstances of his time. There were any number of political issues he could have commented on or taken up, but he ignored all of them.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Hello you, and welcome.

You may see ; Damians post is around 46 or 48: With His inclusion that was met ; responded about the Lord Jesus Christ if you like to read it it.








Have you ever considered that Christianity and it’s appeals to our flesh should dominate in Politics?

Do you believe this would make the American Government work even better?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

What do you believe will happen on day upon Yeshuas return, will be dominate and reign for 1000 years?

The thing is Jesus Christ was never political, he even paid taxes to Cesar.

Jesus Christ that his kingdom was not of this earth and that his kingdom was heavenly.

What does this mean for you? If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ a little piece of heaven resides in you know as the kingdom of God - The Holy Spirit (spirit of truth), and the spirit of Christ reigns with-in your body.

It has nothing to do with political agendas.

What would you say? Is this a wrong take?

Was Jesus Christ really involved with politics in his day?

A Theocratic government never worked for the Jews. They were constantly rebelling against God. To the very end, ignoring and killing His Prophets, to putting to death the very Messiah Jesus Christ of Nazareth prophesied in scripture, this earthly kingdom failed. This is why Jesus Christ of Nazareth taught that His Kingdom aka the New Jerusalem will come from heaven. Any attempt to dominate a flesh driven government, known today as Dominionism, will meet with disaster. Blessings.

 

[DamianWarS]

A Theocratic government never worked for the Jews. They were constantly rebelling against God. To the very end, ignoring and killing His Prophets, to putting to death the very Messiah Jesus Christ of Nazareth prophesied in scripture, this earthly kingdom failed. This is why Jesus Christ of Nazareth taught that His Kingdom aka the New Jerusalem will come from heaven. Any attempt to dominate a flesh driven government, known today as Dominionism, will meet with disaster. Blessings.

government influence may be a product of exponential Christian growth much like we see in the 4th century, however, it's not the goal. the goal is to spread the message of Christ to as many people as possible and if that should result in a government widely influenced by Christians mores then so be it. If it should result in your imprisonment, torture and ultimate death, then so be it, the goal remains the same.

 

[GDL]

A Theocratic government never worked for the Jews. They were constantly rebelling against God. To the very end, ignoring and killing His Prophets, to putting to death the very Messiah Jesus Christ of Nazareth prophesied in scripture, this earthly kingdom failed. This is why Jesus Christ of Nazareth taught that His Kingdom aka the New Jerusalem will come from heaven. Any attempt to dominate a flesh driven government, known today as Dominionism, will meet with disaster. Blessings.

Some good points. But, someone will be in dominion and the discussion within Dominionism is based in "By What Standard?" (Theonomy - God's Law) and this discussion is one of interpreting and applying God's Law correctly, which I'm not sure anyone really knows how to do.

In the end of all this, it is Christ on the throne as "the only absolute ruler" (1 Timothy 6:15). Until then it's one theory after another and God allowing generations to prove the theory doesn't work.

 

[AubreyM]

Interesting point Gdl it would be by Jesus Christ standard, love God and love others which means living by the spirit.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

Hello you, and welcome.

You may see ; Damians post is around 46 or 48: With His inclusion that was met ; responded about the Lord Jesus Christ if you like to read it it.

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?
NO, this is exactly what He was up against...His own...the Jews...believing the Messiah would restore and earthly kingdom for them and rule as an earthly king. They wanted to make Him king by force, but Jesus escaped the crowd and retreated to the mountain. (John 6:15)






Have you ever considered that Christianity and it’s appeals to our flesh should dominate in Politics?

Do you believe this would make the American Government work even better?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

What do you believe will happen on day upon Yeshuas return, will be dominate and reign for 1000 years?

The thing is Jesus Christ was never political, he even paid taxes to Cesar.

Jesus Christ that his kingdom was not of this earth and that his kingdom was heavenly.

What does this mean for you? If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ a little piece of heaven resides in you know as the kingdom of God - The Holy Spirit (spirit of truth), and the spirit of Christ reigns with-in your body.

It has nothing to do with political agendas.

What would you say? Is this a wrong take?

Was Jesus Christ really involved with politics in his day?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

NO, this is exactly what He was up against...His own...the Jews...believing the Messiah would restore an earthly kingdom for them and rule as an earthly king. They wanted to make Him king by force, but Jesus escaped the crowd and retreated to the mountain. (John 6:15)

 

[NotreDame]

Fair enough. I normally am not the one to argue against definition in order to know we're all thinking the same about a word we're using.

Suggestions?

Politics: the activities involved in acquiring,
using, power in an institution that influence or are able to influence decisions that affect a country or a society.

Now, I could be mistaken, I’m not omniscient, my memory can and does fade, but I cannot recall anything Jesus is reported in the Gospels to have said or did that qualifies Jesus as being political or engaged in politics.

Furthermore, Jesus’ teachings, which arguably, if followed by everyone, has political implications, isn’t the same as Jesus being political or engaged in politics. Just as Aristotle’s thoughts of a First Cause, an Unmoved Mover as the cause for everything may have implications of a religious kind, doesn’t render Aristotle engaged in theology.

 

[NotreDame]

Politics are shaped by popular demand. They create leadership at the top but influenced by a bottom up model. So if you want a create a Christian government then you need to change popular demand with regards to social issues and morality, ethics, etc... to be Christian driven. And if you want that on a wide scale you need to start with a few people and help start a discipleship making movent where new believers come to faith exponentially. However forcing a Christian government is no different than a dictatorship. If the people want it, politictians will rise up to meet the demand the people want and if they hold a majority position they will be elected. Even if you target the absolute top and they become a sold out believer they are still responsible to the conditions they were voted in for. This idea of starting a top down model is not sustainable and it needs to be a bottom up approach, this is exactly what Christ did.

I concur. I have disputed the efficacy of laws passed reflecting Christian beliefs.

Let’s make abortion illegal. Marriage is legally to be between a man and a woman. Yet, laws do not please God. The Jews were given the Law, were the recipients of the Law, and have historically demonstrated a near unrivaled talent for provoking God’s anger and judgment subsequent to receiving the Law.

Of course, one possibility is the existence of these laws point to living a life pleasing to God. Maybe, but I’m not convinced these laws persuade or induce anyone to live a life pleasing to God.

 

[throughfiierytrial]

I concur. I have disputed the efficacy of laws passed reflecting Christian beliefs.

Let’s make abortion illegal. Marriage is legally to be between a man and a woman. Yet, laws do not please God. The Jews were given the Law, were the recipients of the Law, and have historically demonstrated a near unrivaled talent for provoking God’s anger and judgment subsequent to receiving the Law.

Of course, one possibility is the existence of these laws point to living a life pleasing to God. Maybe, but I’m not convinced these laws persuade or induce anyone to live a life pleasing to God.

I do not agree that laws are created and passed from a bottom up mode in recent years or at least that this "bottom" or rather that the populous is not a fair model of the entire population. Whether or not laws of the land instill in one the desire to please God is not the Christian issue in my view. We are to pray for leaders and all in positions of authority to govern and rule wisely so that we may live in peace. It is only righteous laws which lead to peace for Christian living. When we are coerced to pay for protective rights and acts through our tax dollars which do not please God or are sin in God's eyes we as Christians do not live in peace. We are torn when determining to obey God or the government. Should we choose God over government we are faced with penalty of legal charges or fines and this is not peace...this is rather a mode of persecution in my view.
It is also very detrimental to Christian children to be raised in this Godless environment. Isaiah preaches...by God's commands...against perverting justice. And true justice is not what we see coming from the modern ways of achieving it. Here is what God first taught the Israelites about justice:
Leviticus 19:15:
15 “‘Do not pervert justice; do not show partiality to the poor or favoritism to the great, but judge your neighbor fairly.
Deuteronomy 16:18-20:
18 Appoint judges and officials for each of your tribes in every town the Lord your God is giving you, and they shall judge the people fairly. 19 Do not pervert justice or show partiality. Do not accept a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the wise and twists the words of the innocent. 20 Follow justice and justice alone, so that you may live and possess the land the Lord your God is giving you.

 

[DamianWarS]

I concur. I have disputed the efficacy of laws passed reflecting Christian beliefs.

Let’s make abortion illegal. Marriage is legally to be between a man and a woman. Yet, laws do not please God. The Jews were given the Law, were the recipients of the Law, and have historically demonstrated a near unrivaled talent for provoking God’s anger and judgment subsequent to receiving the Law.

Of course, one possibility is the existence of these laws point to living a life pleasing to God. Maybe, but I’m not convinced these laws persuade or induce anyone to live a life pleasing to God.

laws mirror the will of the people not the will of God. Because they reflect the values of the people not God then in order to reform the laws we need to reform the people.

 

[DamianWarS]

Well, maybe: He is the King of the Jews, after all.

he's also the king of kings.

 

[GDL]

Politics: the activities involved in acquiring,
using, power in an institution that influence or are able to influence decisions that affect a country or a society.

Now, I could be mistaken, I’m not omniscient, my memory can and does fade, but I cannot recall anything Jesus is reported in the Gospels to have said or did that qualifies Jesus as being political or engaged in politics.

Furthermore, Jesus’ teachings, which arguably, if followed by everyone, has political implications, isn’t the same as Jesus being political or engaged in politics. Just as Aristotle’s thoughts of a First Cause, an Unmoved Mover as the cause for everything may have implications of a religious kind, doesn’t render Aristotle engaged in theology.

OK, even using the definition you have selected:

Israel's politics and religion were inseparable. All that Jesus dealt with among the Jews thus involved both. Jesus was sent to deal with Israel, not Rome. Now He is King of Kings and all the earth is His inheritance. What is He not Lord over?

Our Faith, even though most would like to separate it from politics for obvious reasons, cannot really be separated from the activities or effects of human government. Our Scriptures instruct us on our morality, our ethics, and much more. Human Government has been identified as a Divine Institution from Genesis. Paul's instruction in Romans 13 re: submitting to authorities is stated in the context of the authorities being God's servants to reward good and punish bad. How do we separate ourselves from living under governing authorities, which "influence or are able to influence decisions that affect a country or a society" especially in a nation where we have the rights we have to voice and vote godly morality and ethics and legislation? Buying a party-line and quite possibly shirking our responsibilities in Christ does not mean that party-line is correct.

John dealt with the issue of the Logos. Apparently he viewed it as theologically relevant and thus the philosophers engaging themselves in theology, whether intentional or not. Since this is God's creation, what is not theological?

I just answered in another thread a misrepresentation of Jesus re: the "Golden Rule." I don't think the poster wanted to argue theology, nor, given how he identifies himself, do I think he even thinks theology is a real topic. He's just arguing to keep Christian thinking out of "secular" government.

Since every major human institution, including human government, and thus politics, is based in Scripture, at this point I don't see these clear and customary demarcations anymore. I'm not alone in this.

Since the OP is asking if Jesus is a politician, maybe we should be defining "politician." One definition I looked at quickly said something about politicians being involved in legislating. I wonder if God is a Legislator and whether or not Jesus was involved in debating Law when here, or whether He still is involved in Law and will be when personally here again.

 

[Thomas White]

Hello you, and welcome.

You may see ; Damians post is around 46 or 48: With His inclusion that was met ; responded about the Lord Jesus Christ if you like to read it it.








Have you ever considered that Christianity and it’s appeals to our flesh should dominate in Politics?

Do you believe this would make the American Government work even better?

What do your thoughts pertaining to Yeshua being a political leader?

What do you believe will happen on day upon Yeshuas return, will be dominate and reign for 1000 years?

The thing is Jesus Christ was never political, he even paid taxes to Cesar.

Jesus Christ that his kingdom was not of this earth and that his kingdom was heavenly.

What does this mean for you? If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ a little piece of heaven resides in you know as the kingdom of God - The Holy Spirit (spirit of truth), and the spirit of Christ reigns with-in your body.

It has nothing to do with political agendas.

What would you say? Is this a wrong take?

Was Jesus Christ really involved with politics in his day?

Politics affects everything. As such, anyone who has an opinion on anything is a politician. Jesus was a leader. He definitely had opinions. He was a politician.

 

[AubreyM]

How are the words politician and opinion the same? Thomas White?

Am getting tired - Thank you for your comment.