“We Can’t Say Black Lives Matter Until We Say Unborn Lives Mather.

[98cwitr]

I don't see the correlation.

More black babies are aborted in the state of New York than are born. That's alarming.

 

[98cwitr]

In America, This last year has proven even more. We don't care enough about the born. Why would we care for a clump of cells or fetus. Or any person ( white or any color).

Because Christ commanded us to.

 

[Tinker Grey]

More black babies are aborted in the state of New York than are born. That's alarming.

Cite?

(Make BC free. Problem goes away.)

 

[Tinker Grey]

Because Christ commanded us to.

Cite?

 

[98cwitr]

Cite?

For other people:

John 13:34
“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

John 15:12
My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.

For children:

Isaiah 44:2
This is what the Lord says— he who made you, who formed you in the womb, and who will help you: Do not be afraid, Jacob, my servant, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen.

Isaiah 44:24
“This is what the Lord says— your Redeemer, who formed you in the womb: I am the Lord, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens, who spreads out the earth by myself,

Jeremiah 1:5
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

Luke 1:44
As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy.

Thus;

Genesis 9:6

New International Version

6 “Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans shall their blood be shed;
for in the image of God
has God made mankind.



Clear 1st Century church teaching to abstain from abortion:

Didache 2:1-2

And the second commandment of the Teaching; You shall not commit murder, you shall not commit adultery, Exodus 20:13-14 you shall not commit pederasty, you shall not commit fornication, you shall not steal, Exodus 20:15 you shall not practice magic, you shall not practice witchcraft, you shall not murder a child by abortion nor kill that which is begotten

 

[98cwitr]

Cite?

(Make BC free. Problem goes away.)

Abstain from sexual immorality...problem goes away with zero costs to anyone.

 

[Speedwell]

Because Christ commanded us to.

Commanded us to what? To pass punitive and basically unenforceable laws against abortion in order to criminalize a Christian sin for non-Christian citizens of a secular republic? To reject programs which would actually reduce the number of abortions? To decline to evangelize non-Christians in order to help them become pro-life? OK, let's see those Bible verses.

 

[Speedwell]

Abstain from sexual immorality...problem goes away with zero costs to anyone.

Right. All pregnancies which are terminated resulted from sexual immorality.

 

[Tinker Grey]

Abstain from sexual immorality...problem goes away with zero costs to anyone.

So you just made up the bit about more abortions than live births for African Americans?

 

[Tinker Grey]

For other people:

John 13:34
“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

John 15:12
My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.

For children:

Isaiah 44:2
This is what the Lord says— he who made you, who formed you in the womb, and who will help you: Do not be afraid, Jacob, my servant, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen.

Isaiah 44:24
“This is what the Lord says— your Redeemer, who formed you in the womb: I am the Lord, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens, who spreads out the earth by myself,

Jeremiah 1:5
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

Luke 1:44
As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy.

Thus;

Genesis 9:6

New International Version

6 “Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans shall their blood be shed;
for in the image of God
has God made mankind.



Clear 1st Century church teaching to abstain from abortion:

Didache 2:1-2

And the second commandment of the Teaching; You shall not commit murder, you shall not commit adultery, Exodus 20:13-14 you shall not commit pederasty, you shall not commit fornication, you shall not steal, Exodus 20:15 you shall not practice magic, you shall not practice witchcraft, you shall not murder a child by abortion nor kill that which is begotten

Well, so Christ said nothing about fetuses? Thought so.

 

[98cwitr]

Right. All pregnancies which are terminated resulted from sexual immorality.

Not all, but many.

"Terminated pregnancy" = "dead baby"; lets at least have the decency to call it what it is.

I'm all for a national heartbeat bill, and thus giving the option of the morning-after pill to rape/incest victims. When did Americans somehow become okay with people not taking responsibility for their actions?

 

[98cwitr]

So you just made up the bit about more abortions than live births for African Americans?

No. Tragic report: More Black babies are aborted in New York City than are born

 

[98cwitr]

Well, so Christ said nothing about fetuses? Thought so.

A fetus is just an unborn human, still created in the image of God. Church fathers, seeing abortion in Rome and Greece during the first century, knew it was as wrong then as it is today. Using the term "fetus" in a dehumanizing context, as if it somehow justifies the killing of an innocent child, is nothing unlike pro-slavery advocates of the 1830s and 40s calling enslaved humans "property."

 

[Speedwell]

Not all, but many.

In your opinion of what sexual morality is. Why should that be normative in a secular republic?

"Terminated pregnancy" = "dead baby"; lets at least have the decency to call it what it is.

So how are you going to deal with it? I have yet to see any practical legislative proposals or any explanation of how cases will be proven in court, etc.

I'm all for a national heartbeat bill, and thus giving the option of the morning-after pill to rape/incest victims.

That's just you. We're talking about the pro-life movement as a whole--the death penalty for all abortions under any circumstance whatsoever. [/quote]When did Americans somehow become okay with people not taking responsibility for their actions?[/QUOTE]Is that what you think this is about? I thought you were actually concerned about the dead babies.

 

[Tinker Grey]

No. Tragic report: More Black babies are aborted in New York City than are born

I appreciate you suppling your source. Unfortunately for me, I couldn't parse out where they got that from in the CDC link/pdf. However, I found a WSJ link that agreed with that. Also politifact had an article: PolitiFact - Cynthia Meyer says more black babies are aborted in New York City than born

 

[Tinker Grey]

A fetus is just an unborn human, still created in the image of God. Church fathers, seeing abortion in Rome and Greece during the first century, knew it was as wrong then as it is today. Using the term "fetus" in a dehumanizing context, as if it somehow justifies the killing of an innocent child, is nothing unlike pro-slavery advocates of the 1830s and 40s calling enslaved humans "property."

*Edited* This is not an abortion debate. Suffice it to say that your religious opinions don't obligate me to agree. Nevertheless, I'd say Christ never addressed the issue and it is your interpretation that the supplied scriptures somehow obliquely relevant.

 

[98cwitr]

In your opinion of what sexual morality is. Why should that be normative in a secular republic?

Not mine. God's. This is a moral relativism vs moral objectivism argument. If one does not believe God is then moral relativism is an easy pill to swallow. If one does believe God is it becomes much more difficult.

So how are you going to deal with it? I have yet to see any practical legislative proposals or any explanation of how cases will be proven in court, etc.

Repeal Roe, constitutional amendment to protect a baby with a heart beat; emergency c-section in the event of threat of life or serious bodily harm to mother. MAP as a loophole solution for rape/incest/etc, criminalize abortion procedures as murder.

That's just you. We're talking about the pro-life movement as a whole--the death penalty for all abortions under any circumstance whatsoever.

The "movement" is nuanced and has a spectrum of opinions on the matter. You'd need to ask both the leaders of each org, and those involved.

Is that what you think this is about? I thought you were actually concerned about the dead babies.

It's interrelated. No need to pigeonhole the argument.

 

[Whyayeman]

A question for you. In the past the UK and Europe had a serious problem with soccer hooligans. Is that still a thing?

Not so much. There are occasional incidents, but match crowds are much better policed. CCTV has helped a great deal to identify perpetrators, who are generally banned. The English Premier League clubs have taken huge steps to make events family friendly. It is a while since I attended a match, but it was perfectly safe. Rival fans are always kept apart in the ground and on arrival and departure.

Once in a big pub in Birmingham city centre on a Saturday lunchtime the place went very quiet. A big group of burly fellows came in and police officers came in too. They were quiet and polite (and everybody was polite back), had a pint or two, then left. They were Arsenal away fans going to Aston Villa. I looked outside and the area was swamped by police. They and their escorts looked very relaxed. Some of the customers were less so until they left.

 

[Nithavela]

More black babies are aborted in the state of New York than are born. That's alarming.

Only if you're a black baby.

 

[98cwitr]

Only if you're a black baby.

Not true. I am appalled as well and fight for their lives to be spared as much as any other. We're all people. Who will advocate for those who are literally voiceless (instead of using the term "voiceless" as a misnomer to refer to people who actually have a literal voice)?