With all your heart?

[Mark Quayle]

Do you believe that you can keep the first greatest commandment? Many have said... “no” within this thread, and yet they are not saying they are unsaved as a result of such.

Translation:

This means they do not really have to keep the first greatest commandment and they are okay (i.e. they have eternal life) with God.

Notice --that is YOUR translation.

You said: "Do you believe that you can keep the first greatest commandment? Many have said... “no” within this thread, and yet they are not saying they are unsaved as a result of such."

Now me: What they didn't add is the obvious --actually there are several different such things showing the grace of God toward his elect-- "If we confess our sin, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sin and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

I'm not sure if I should take you as believing the notion that if we fail to keep any commandment that we "are unsaved as a result of such" or not.

B.H., we Redeemed are replete with unknown sin. We have no clue how filthy we are apart from the washing of Christ. There is no way can know every sin to confess and abandon, not to mention the obvious ones we refuse to see. Those too are covered by the blood of Christ. Yes, as we are made aware of them we must repent of them and abandon them, but we have been confessing our sinfulness ever since we were regenerated. God does not treat us (the elect) as our deeds deserve. And "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves."

Maybe I should ask this: What makes you think ANY of us "are OK" with God? Because I can guarantee you, the ONLY thing that makes us ok with God is Christ's substitution, not our subsequent walk.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Notice --that is YOUR translation.

You said: "Do you believe that you can keep the first greatest commandment? Many have said... “no” within this thread, and yet they are not saying they are unsaved as a result of such."

Now me: What they didn't add is the obvious --actually there are several different such things showing the grace of God toward his elect-- "If we confess our sin, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sin and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

I'm not sure if I should take you as believing the notion that if we fail to keep any commandment that we "are unsaved as a result of such" or not.

B.H., we Redeemed are replete with unknown sin. We have no clue how filthy we are apart from the washing of Christ. There is no way can know every sin to confess and abandon, not to mention the obvious ones we refuse to see. Those too are covered by the blood of Christ. Yes, as we are made aware of them we must repent of them and abandon them, but we have been confessing our sinfulness ever since we were regenerated. God does not treat us (the elect) as our deeds deserve. And "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves."

Maybe I should ask this: What makes you think ANY of us "are OK" with God? Because I can guarantee you, the ONLY thing that makes us ok with God is Christ's substitution, not our subsequent walk.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that many Christians are saying they can disobey God's greatest commandment and yet they are still in God's good graces despite keeping such a command. We have seen this thought expressed several times in this thread.

Anyways, I believe there is mortal sin, and non-mortal sin (For examples of non-mortal sins: See: 1 John 5:17, Matthew 5:22, 1 Peter 3:21, etc.). Not loving God is a mortal sin (See: 1 Corinthians 16:22).

As for your use of 1 John 1:9: Well, what's the point of confessing sin if there is no reformation of that sin? For example: If a husband cheats on his wife, and all he does is say he is sorry to her, and yet he does not change and he continues to cheat on her, and she finds out, what do you think will happen? In most cases, she will divorce him because of his unfaithfulness. His paying of lip service that he is sorry does not really mean anything unless he stops his unfaithfulness. His pleas of saying he was sorry is just an empty paying of lip service.

 

[fhansen]

But the saying is still, from our heart, which is why I think it is something from us. But, “all of heart” is not necessary the same in all cases and it is probably as much as God would. I think it means that we do something as well as we can and that is enough. It is possible that we fail in many ways, but it does not matter, if the intention and will is good.

I think this could be compared to the story about poor widow.

Jesus sat down opposite the treasury, and saw how the multitude cast money into the treasury. Many who were rich cast in much. A poor widow came, and she cast in two small brass coins, which equal a quadrans coin. He called his disciples to himself, and said to them, "Most assuredly I tell you, this poor widow gave more than all those who are giving into the treasury, for they all gave out of their abundance, but she, out of her poverty, gave all that she had to live on."
Mark 12:41-44

The poor widow couldn’t give as much as the rich people. But, she gave all she had. Similarly, we can love as much as we can and that is enough and good.

I agree-in that God judges us on our capabilities-which can vary a lot between us. Intelligence, maturity, time, experience, revelation, grace, wealth, etc. I just think we're to "invest" the talents we have, and experience some kind of increase from it all. The good thief on the cross had much less opportunity than St John who apparently lived a long life, well past his peers, and yet the thief did the best he could with the little time he had. But I still believe that God has a kind of perfection in mind for each of us-and the more we love Him and neighbor the closer we are to that goal. And while that goal is His work in us, and a gift, it's also our work, since we must cooperate with Him in attaining it as we come to appreciate and value and want-and practice- it all the more.

 

[zoidar]

Jesus says if you love me, keep my commandments (John 14:15).
That is how we love Jesus according to Jesus.
Jesus says “If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.” (John 15:10).
Paul says, “If anyone does not love the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed. O Lord, come!” (1 Corinthians 16:22) (NKJV).

As for 1 John 1:8:

I have already given an explanation already on this verse. See my post #287.

I have to ask you BH, do you think we can always keep the commandments of Jesus, I mean like not once in a while fail to do so? I ask because I know I don't always keep Jesus' commandments, even I know I should.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Logically, then, since he says, "If you love me you will keep my commandments.", you keep his commandments completely, without sin.

So what do you do with, "If we say we are without sin, we deceive ourselves..."

I don’t know anyone who has kept Christ’s commandments without stumbling in sin. I don’t think stumbling in sin means that we didn’t love Jesus when we stumbled.

 

[zoidar]

I don’t know anyone who has kept Christ’s commandments without stumbling in sin. I don’t think stumbling in sin means that we didn’t love Jesus when we stumbled.

Is stumbling in sin the same as choosing to sin. If there is a difference, what would it be? This is a question I asked myself.

 

[grasping the after wind]

What about the martyrs though? No greater love than to give one's life. How can we say that they loved themselves more, when they gave up their very lives for our Lord?

They were expecting eternal life. They gave up a lesser life to assure themselves of it. It is not an entirely selfless act.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Is stumbling in sin the same as choosing to sin. If there is a difference, what would it be? This is a question I asked myself.

No stumbling in sin is not the same as willfully sinning. Stumbling in sin is accidental it’s not premeditated. It’s like hitting your thumb with a hammer and yelling a curse word because of the pain. You didn’t actually think I know this is wrong but I’m going to do it anyway. That kind of willful sin is a huge problem that people really need to get under control. If a person is willfully sinning they need to repent and put a stop to it.

 

[zoidar]

No stumbling in sin is not the same as willfully sinning. Stumbling in sin is accidental it’s not premeditated. It’s like hitting your thumb with a hammer and yelling a curse word because of the pain. You didn’t actually think I know this is wrong but I’m going to do it anyway. That kind of willful sin is a huge problem that people really need to get under control. If a person is willfully sinning they need to repent and put a stop to it.

Many Christians say they struggle with inappropriate contentographic material. But honestly, many Christians choose pleasure over righteousness. So this couldn't be in the category "struggle", can it? And what would be the end for these Christians?

 

[BNR32FAN]

They were expecting eternal life. They gave up a lesser life to assure themselves of it. It is not an entirely selfless act.

But Jesus said in a John 15:13

“Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:13‬ ‭NASB

Your saying this greatest love is a love of self? Jesus said there is no greater love than this which to me says that martyrs have proven that they love God with all their heart. I mean if no one can possibly love more than this then it’s pretty clear that’s all the heart a person can possibly love with.

 

[Mark Quayle]

As for your use of 1 John 1:9: Well, what's the point of confessing sin if there is no reformation of that sin? For example: If a husband cheats on his wife, and all he does is say he is sorry to her, and yet he does not change and he continues to cheat on her, and she finds out, what do you think will happen? In most cases, she will divorce him because of his unfaithfulness. His paying of lip service that he is sorry does not really mean anything unless he stops his unfaithfulness. His pleas of saying he was sorry is just an empty paying of lip service.

You are implying that I thought confession without repentance suffices? I know God is not mocked. I'm not that much of an idiot, not to mention that 1 John has a lot more to say than chapter 1 verse 9. Really??

Why do you continue to attempt to make me appear to say the most outrageous things I never said? Is this a habit with you?

 

[Mark Quayle]

Anyways, I believe there is mortal sin, and non-mortal sin (For examples of non-mortal sins: See: 1 John 5:17, Matthew 5:22, 1 Peter 3:21, etc.). Not loving God is a mortal sin (See: 1 Corinthians 16:22).

And you have the gall to tell me you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind?

 

[Mark Quayle]

No stumbling in sin is not the same as willfully sinning. Stumbling in sin is accidental it’s not premeditated. It’s like hitting your thumb with a hammer and yelling a curse word because of the pain. You didn’t actually think I know this is wrong but I’m going to do it anyway. That kind of willful sin is a huge problem that people really need to get under control. If a person is willfully sinning they need to repent and put a stop to it.

It is, nevertheless, sin. If someone is stumbling in sin they need to repent and put a stop to it too, as with willful sin.

You will have a hard time convincing me that stumbling in sin involved no rebellion on the part of the sinner.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Many Christians say they struggle with inappropriate contentographic material. But honestly, many Christians choose pleasure over righteousness. So this couldn't be in the category "struggle", can it? And what would be the end for these Christians?

I surely struggled with inappropriate contentography in the past when I first came to Christ. Then I fixed that problem by surrounding myself with pictures of Christ all over the house and on my phone & computer wallpaper. After that I couldn’t bring myself to watch that stuff with pictures of Christ looking at me. Lol I know they’re just pictures but it definitely worked for me because it kept my focus on Christ. Yeah He’s not watching me in the picture but He is still watching us always. The pictures were just a reminder.

 

[Mark Quayle]

I don’t know anyone who has kept Christ’s commandments without stumbling in sin. I don’t think stumbling in sin means that we didn’t love Jesus when we stumbled.

Whether one loves Jesus while stumbling isn't the question. It is whether one loves the Lord their God with all their heart, with all their soul, with all their strength, with all their mind.

 

[Mark Quayle]

But Jesus said in a John 15:13

“Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:13‬ ‭NASB

Your saying this greatest love is a love of self? Jesus said there is no greater love than this which to me says that martyrs have proven that they love God with all their heart. I mean if no one can possibly love more than this then it’s pretty clear that’s all the heart a person can possibly love with.

I should think that is for God to judge

 

[BNR32FAN]

It is, nevertheless, sin. If someone is stumbling in sin they need to repent and put a stop to it too, as with willful sin.

You will have a hard time convincing me that stumbling in sin involved no rebellion on the part of the sinner.

Umm...yeah that’s why I called it stumbling in sin. I thought it was obvious that it’s still considered a sin. As for repenting of it good luck. If you could do that then it wouldn’t be stumbling now would it? As for trying to convince you that stumbling in sin doesn’t involve rebellion on our part, I won’t try. If you think accidentally spilling a glass of milk is the same as intentionally poring it on the floor then I can only say I’d hate to be one of your kids.

 

[zoidar]

I surely struggled with inappropriate contentography in the past when I first came to Christ. Then I fixed that problem by surrounding myself with pictures of Christ all over the house and on my phone & computer wallpaper. After that I couldn’t bring myself to watch that stuff with pictures of Christ looking at me. Lol I know they’re just pictures but it definitely worked for me because it kept my focus on Christ. Yeah He’s not watching me in the picture but He is still watching us always. The pictures were just a reminder.

That was a very practical answer

I know it's OT, but ...
I had that problem too. Even I don't watch it now I kind of have a problem with looking at girls the wrong way, and I know it's a sin, and I choose it because I don't resist the temptation. I don't know if I'm choosing to live in sin or if I struggle/fall in sin.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Whether one loves Jesus while stumbling isn't the question. It is whether one loves the Lord their God with all their heart, with all their soul, with all their strength, with all their mind.

Do you have kids?

 

[grasping the after wind]

But Jesus said in a John 15:13

“Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:13‬ ‭NASB

Your saying this greatest love is a love of self? Jesus said there is no greater love than this which to me says that martyrs have proven that they love God with all their heart. I mean if no one can possibly love more than this then it’s pretty clear that’s all the heart a person can possibly love with.

I completely agree with what Jesus said. No one has greater love than that. I am not saying that greatest love is a love of self at all. I am saying that, for the martyrs, there was a part of their heart they reserved for themselves. That their motivation was not totally selfless. Unlike Jesus, they were not completely voluntarily giving up their lives only for their friends. They were in a position in which their hopes for eternal life rested upon not abandoning the faith. There was gain for them for not abandoning the faith and loss for them if they did. Jesus had no such motivation.