What is this necessary “Wedding Garment”?

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Mr. M

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Hebrews 12:3 is not suggesting that we will always struggle or strive against sin in this life.
Okay, I disagree here. I know for a fact that I will be striving against sin as long as I am in skin.
It has become less difficult in maturity, but what you are describing is called "settling on the lees".
When did you retire from the effort?
 
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I most certainly believe in this scripture. I also know by experience the battle involved and how
corrupt our flesh nature is in hostility to the Lord's efforts. At 65, I know how far He has brought me,
and in my lowest state, I never felt that I had been cut off from being a son. I am not arguing your position on sin, but your willingness to declare other Christians as not true children, when you don't
really know what they are striving with. There is definitely an easy gospel that accommodates a casual
lifestyle that tolerates many things that aren't even recognized as sins, and could be overcome with
faithfulness to the Lord's working in us. Yes, I believe in striving against sin. If this is your concern,
which I believe it is, we are called to encourage and exhort to continue to press into righteousness.
I am not ready to be the one who cuts anyone off without a serious and honest reckoning. I just think
it helps to acknowledge how filthy you truly are before you start throwing 2 Corinthians 7:1 around.
I can say in full sincerity, as Paul, "Jesus Christ came to save sinners, among whom I am chief".
Amen and Hebrews 12 makes it clear the Father chastises His sons/children for sin yet they remain His children/sons.
 
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I most certainly believe in this scripture. I also know by experience the battle involved and how
corrupt our flesh nature is in hostility to the Lord's efforts. At 65, I know how far He has brought me,
and in my lowest state, I never felt that I had been cut off from being a son. I am not arguing your position on sin, but your willingness to declare other Christians as not true children, when you don't
really know what they are striving with. There is definitely an easy gospel that accommodates a casual
lifestyle that tolerates many things that aren't even recognized as sins, and could be overcome with
faithfulness to the Lord's working in us. Yes, I believe in striving against sin. If this is your concern,
which I believe it is, we are called to encourage and exhort to continue to press into righteousness.
I am not ready to be the one who cuts anyone off without a serious and honest reckoning. I just think
it helps to acknowledge how filthy you truly are before you start throwing 2 Corinthians 7:1 around.
I can say in full sincerity, as Paul, "Jesus Christ came to save sinners, among whom I am chief".

Now I know what you really believe. You just assumed I was filthy without even knowing anything about my life and my heart with the Lord. This means that you really do not believe 2 Corinthians 7:1. It says let us cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God. You cannot believe this verse because you just outright accused me of being filthy that you have no way of truly knowing unless you were the Lord.
 
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Okay, I disagree here. I know for a fact that I will be striving against sin as long as I am in skin.
It has become less difficult in maturity, but what you are describing is called "settling on the lees".
When did you retire from the effort?

No. Then you have to ignore verses like Galatians 5:24, 1 Peter 4:1-2, and 2 Corinthians 7:1 in order to make your slanted view on the Scriptures come true.
 
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Mr. M

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Now I know what you really believe. You just assumed I was filthy without even knowing anything about my life and my heart with the Lord. This means that you really do not believe 2 Corinthians 7:1. It says let us cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God. You cannot believe this verse because you just outright accused me of being filthy that you have no way of truly knowing unless you were the Lord.
Wow! You are really freaking out. I said nothing about you personally. I never at any time made this
personal as to "what kind of Christian" you are, when I don't know you. I took a side against your
very aggressive position to declare a lot of Christians that YOU DON'T KNOW, as not being true
children of God because they have more sin in their life than you are willing to tolerate. I know what
2 Corinthians 7:1 says, I have known for decades, and I don't need your help in pointing it out,
or interpreting it for me. I am still working on it, and God is on my side, so you can be against me if
you prefer, I will not be concerned over that at all. If I can't offer an opposing opinion to yours,
I would suggest you stay off threads that I originate. You have had your say, and I actually appreciate
your point of view, but it is not one that I can share with you, as I just don't see myself so perfected
as you seem to see yourself.
 
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Mr. M

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No. Then you have to ignore verses like Galatians 5:24, 1 Peter 4:1-2, and 2 Corinthians 7:1 in order to make your slanted view on the Scriptures come true.
I never speak from a "slanted view on the scriptures" but an honest assessment of my own testimony.
Are you sharing yours, or just an opinion? I already asked you when you retired from striving against
sin. That was actually a question I hoped to have answered. How did you know? I always thought that
"well done, good and faithful servant, enter into the joy of your Lord" came at the end of the age.
 
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I never speak from a "slanted view on the scriptures" but an honest assessment of my own testimony.
Are you sharing yours, or just an opinion? I already asked you when you retired from striving against
sin. That was actually a question I hoped to have answered. How did you know? I always thought that
"well done, good and faithful servant, enter into the joy of your Lord" came at the end of the age.
some believe they can reach a sinless state of perfection here and there is no need for Jesus to say well done since they have already become perfected by the flesh and have become sinless in their own eyes.
 
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Mr. M

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some believe they can reach a sinless state of perfection here and there is no need for Jesus to say well done since they have already become perfected by the flesh and have become sinless in their own eyes.
Wow! So do they think that they have attained to this in this life?
1 Corinthians 15:
53
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality,
then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”
55 “O Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

Are there immortals among us? Superhero Christians? LOL
 
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Wow! So do they think that they have attained to this in this life?
1 Corinthians 15:
53
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality,
then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”
55 “O Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

Are there immortals among us? Superhero Christians? LOL
As we know it reality this can only happen in the Resurrection. Great passage !
 
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Valletta

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some believe they can reach a sinless state of perfection here and there is no need for Jesus to say well done since they have already become perfected by the flesh and have become sinless in their own eyes.

Philippians 2:12-13 "So then, my beloved, obedient as you have always been, not only when I am present but all the more now when I am absent, work out your salvation with fear and trembling.
For God is the one who, for his good purpose, works in you both to desire and to work."
 
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Jamdoc

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That is what you falsely assume of me. You know nothing about me. You just are throwing false accusations at me with no real evidence. I told you I only confide in those I trust. You are not somebody I trust because you are hell bent on justifying that believers can sin and still be saved. But God's grace is not a license for immorality (Jude 1:4).



This is a common tactic in your camp. You do not understand that even when we speak today, we use slang or metaphor mingled in with literal communication. Just because one part is metaphor, does not mean the whole entire thing is metaphor. Besides, Jesus warned elsewhere of sins' destruction to our souls if we do not repent (confess and forsake sin). In Matthew 6:15, Jesus says that if we do not forgive, the Father will not forgive us. This is a condition we have to meet in order to receive forgiveness and or salvation. Just as we have to not look at women in lust (in regards to adultery and fornication), otherwise our whole body can be cast into hellfire.



A believer should not be hypocritical. If they are being a hypocrite, and it is in regards to them doing mortal sin, then they will be condemned by God. But if OSAS is true, it doesn't matter how you live and you can be a hypocrite and still be saved by having a belief on Jesus. For if a believer tells people to follow the Bible that has righteous instruction and yet they turn around and do not follow those instructions, they are only bring damnation upon themselves.

As for 1 John 1:9:

You still are not reading this verse and believing it at face value.

“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:9).​

It says IF we confess our sins.
IF is a conditional statement. IF I take out the garbage, I will not have a smelly garage.
IF I stay away from foods that will make me fat, I will be in better shape physically.

IF we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins.
You want to be forgiven before even confessing of sin.
Forgiveness in the Bible deals with salvation.
A person cannot be unforgiven and still be saved.



But you propogate a gospel that is no gospel at all. People can be misled to think they can sin and still be saved by your belief. There is no real change. For God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness, and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12). The purpose Christ died for us was to sanctify us with the washing of the water of the Word so that Christ can present to Himself a church that is holy and without spot and blemish (See: Ephesians 5:25-27). You just assumed I sin because you believe everyone sins. So you believe that salvation is not in living holy for the Lord, but it is by sinning with you being saved because you have a belief alone on Jesus. But even the demons believe and tremble.

You still got my interpretation of 1 John 1:9 wrong.
in the old testament, they had to confess their sins, and then do a sacrifice to atone for it.
in Christ, we confess our sins, but do not do an atonement, because Jesus already provided the atonement.
That was all I meant on that. That we're not performing sacrifices, because the sufficient sacrifice had already been performed on the cross.

in another post you talk about chastisement.
I ALMOST think we're on the same page just not quite.
You believe that if you sin after being saved, you become unsaved.
I believe that if you sin after being saved, you'll confess, repent, and be chastened for it, but you remain God's child. He's just dealing with a disobedient child. You don't "get away with it", and if you try to "get away with it" you REALLY don't get away with it.
Psalm 89:30-34
30 If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments;
31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;
32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.
33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.
34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.

So it is kind of a OSAS, but not the way people think of it, as a license to sin.
A person who is saved, when they sin, they'll be convicted by the holy spirit, they'll confess, they'll repent, they'll be chastened, and they'll be forgiven.
They don't lose salvation when they sin.
But, if they go into this supposed relationship they think they have that it's okay to sin, they don't confess, they justify their sin they dont' get chastened? Well. Hebrews 12 tells us that they're not really a child of God, they never really made a relationship with God.. and they're going to be judged by their sin.
 
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That is what you falsely assume of me. You know nothing about me. You just are throwing false accusations at me with no real evidence. I told you I only confide in those I trust. You are not somebody I trust because you are hell bent on justifying that believers can sin and still be saved.
.
And ad hominem attacks upon a persons character and assonating them publicly is not a sin ?

Making false accusations about someone is not a sin ?
 
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You still got my interpretation of 1 John 1:9 wrong.
in the old testament, they had to confess their sins, and then do a sacrifice to atone for it.
in Christ, we confess our sins, but do not do an atonement, because Jesus already provided the atonement.
That was all I meant on that. That we're not performing sacrifices, because the sufficient sacrifice had already been performed on the cross.

So you believe in Univeralism? That everyone will be saved because Christ provided the Atonement for all? I did not get that impression that you believe in Univeralism. So just because Christ provided a Provistional Atonement for us, does not mean that there are not conditions for us to apply that atonement to our lives (Unless you believe everyone who existed will be saved).

As for the OT sacrifices and confession:

Yes, I believe they had to confess and forsake their sins and offer animal sacrifices in order to be forgiven or saved.

But under the New Covenant, there is no more sacrifices that need to be offered accept our own life (Romans 12:1). This naturally will happen after a person is truly broken of their sin and they seek forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ and believe in the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.

As for 1 John 1:9:

I do not think I misunderstood your view on 1 John 1:9.
You are still not reading and believing 1 John 1:9.
I want you stop and just read the verse really slowly.
It says IF we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
You are saying you are already forgiven or saved before confessing of your sins and that is not what the verse says. We know that when we talk about forgiveness in the Bible involving God, it deals with salvation. In fact, the context of 1 John 1:9 is salvation for we read in 1 John 1:7 that it talks about the blood of Jesus Christ cleansing us of all sin if we walk in the light.

You said:
in another post you talk about chastisement.
I ALMOST think we're on the same page just not quite.
You believe that if you sin after being saved, you become unsaved.
I believe that if you sin after being saved, you'll confess, repent, and be chastened for it, but you remain God's child. He's just dealing with a disobedient child. You don't "get away with it", and if you try to "get away with it" you REALLY don't get away with it.
Psalm 89:30-34

Believers who are faithful to the Lord can be persecuted and bad things can happen to them. So any trouble that happens to a believer like chastisement really is not much different than what unbelievers can also go through. Believers and unbelievers can go through the same bad challenges in life. So chastisement is not really an effective deterrent for the believer who thinks they can sin and still go to Heaven. The real motivation behind REAL chastisment in the Bible is to let the person know that they are not saved and they are headed in the wrong direction and they need to repent and to return to the Lord their God.

You said:
So it is kind of a OSAS, but not the way people think of it, as a license to sin.

What you just described as OSAS is a license to sin because they can sin and still be saved in the few moments of their life before chastisement that they may not even care about or even recognize. For to abide in an idea that one can sin and still be saved for even five minutes is turning God's grace into a license for immorality. There is no time limit on how long one can sin and still be saved. Adam broke God's one commandment, and the fall of mankind was the result. Adam died spiritually that day he broke God's command. Of course, Adam could repent and return to the Lord His God. Why you think things have changed is beyond me. The devil wanted to sell Eve on the lie that she could break God's command, and not die. Yet, this same lie of the devil is being sold in churches, hook, line, and sinker.

You said:
A person who is saved, when they sin, they'll be convicted by the holy spirit, they'll confess, they'll repent, they'll be chastened, and they'll be forgiven.
They don't lose salvation when they sin.
But, if they go into this supposed relationship they think they have that it's okay to sin, they don't confess, they justify their sin they dont' get chastened? Well. Hebrews 12 tells us that they're not really a child of God, they never really made a relationship with God.. and they're going to be judged by their sin.

While believers are born again, and changed, their free will is not eliminated.

We are told:

“...We are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end.” (Hebrews 3:13-14).

"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." (Jude 1:21).

"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." (Revelation 2:10).​


We are told to:

  1. Continue in the grace of God (Acts of the Apostles 13:43).

  2. Continue in the faith (Acts of the Apostles 14:22) (Colossians 1:23).

  3. Continue in his goodness, otherwise we can be cut off (just like the Jews were cut off) (Romans 11:21-22).

But of course you cannot accept these verses in what they plainly say. Most in your camp just ignore them, and they just want to keep believing what their Pastor and or church has fed them. Why? Because it is easier to just sin and still be saved. Even a little bit of disobedience before chastisement is still disobedience to God (Especially if they keep repeating the cycle over and over and over again). In fact, most who believe as you do have told me that no believer can stop sinning this side of Heaven. So if this is the case, then what is the point of chastisement? It would be like a master who kicks his dog across the room like a football because it poops on the carpet (with the master knowing that the dog has an uncontrollable pooping problem because it is sick). The master could take the dog to the vet, but he does not care. He will just keep kicking the dog. This is why Belief Alone-ism is simply dumb, and highly illogical, and it does not line up with the Scriptures in any way.
 
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BTW, I say with certainty that people sin because nobody is perfect, and that is the standard at which sin is defined.

Then chastisement serves no purpose. For the goal of chastisement is to get the soul to stop sinning. For as I said before, if what you believe is true, then it would be like a master who kicks his dog across the room like a football on the account that dog poops on the carpet (with the master knowing the dog has an uncontrollable pooping problem because it is sick). But the master could take the animal to the vet and help it. But the master does not care. The master is just gonna keep kicking the dog even though the dog cannot really help itself. So that is why your whole chastisement excuse is just mirage or an illusion. No real change exists.
 
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So you believe in Univeralism? That everyone will be saved because Christ provided the Atonement for all? I did not get that impression that you believe in Univeralism. So just because Christ provided a Provistional Atonement for us, does not mean that there are not conditions for us to apply that atonement to our lives (Unless you believe everyone who existed will be saved).
How would you get universalism from that? Now I think you're just being willfully contrarian.
When you sin, having been saved, do you believe that you have to make atonement for it? or just confess and ask forgiveness? If you believe the former, then you don't believe that Jesus was sufficient atonement and that'd make you not saved. If the latter, well, that's how I view 1 John 1:9.

I do not think I misunderstood your view on 1 John 1:9.
You are still not reading and believing 1 John 1:9.
I want you stop and just read the verse really slowly.
It says IF we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
You are saying you are already forgiven or saved before confessing of your sins and that is not what the verse says. We know that when we talk about forgiveness in the Bible involving God, it deals with salvation. In fact, the context of 1 John 1:9 is salvation for we read in 1 John 1:7 that it talks about the blood of Jesus Christ cleansing us of all sin if we walk in the light.

Believers who are faithful to the Lord can be persecuted and bad things can happen to them. So any trouble that happens to a believer like chastisement really is not much different than what unbelievers can also go through. Believers and unbelievers can go through the same bad challenges in life. So chastisement is not really an effective deterrent for the believer who thinks they can sin and still go to Heaven. The real motivation behind REAL chastisment in the Bible is to let the person know that they are not saved and they are headed in the wrong direction and they need to repent and to return to the Lord their God.
John was writing to believers, people who already were saved as far as he knew. So what you said, makes no sense.

What you just described as OSAS is a license to sin because they can sin and still be saved in the few moments of their life before chastisement that they may not even care about or even recognize. For to abide in an idea that one can sin and still be saved for even five minutes is turning God's grace into a license for immorality. There is no time limit on how long one can sin and still be saved. Adam broke God's one commandment, and the fall of mankind was the result. Adam died spiritually that day he broke God's command. Of course, Adam could repent and return to the Lord His God. Why you think things have changed is beyond me. The devil wanted to sell Eve on the lie that she could break God's command, and not die. Yet, this same lie of the devil is being sold in churches, hook, line, and sinker.
Adam didn't have the atonement of Jesus Christ

While believers are born again, and changed, their free will is not eliminated.

We are told:

“...We are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end.” (Hebrews 3:13-14).

"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." (Jude 1:21).

"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." (Revelation 2:10).​


We are told to:

  1. Continue in the grace of God (Acts of the Apostles 13:43).

  2. Continue in the faith (Acts of the Apostles 14:22) (Colossians 1:23).

  3. Continue in his goodness, otherwise we can be cut off (just like the Jews were cut off) (Romans 11:21-22).

But of course you cannot accept these verses in what they plainly say. Most in your camp just ignore them, and they just want to keep believing what their Pastor and or church has fed them. Why? Because it is easier to just sin and still be saved. Even a little bit of disobedience before chastisement is still disobedience to God (Especially if they keep repeating the cycle over and over and over again). In fact, most who believe as you do have told me that no believer can stop sinning this side of Heaven. So if this is the case, then what is the point of chastisement? It would be like a master who kicks his dog across the room like a football because it poops on the carpet (with the master knowing that the dog has an uncontrollable pooping problem because it is sick). The master could take the dog to the vet, but he does not care. He will just keep kicking the dog. This is why Belief Alone-ism is simply dumb, and highly illogical, and it does not line up with the Scriptures in any way.

We are also told
John 5:24
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Your belief breaks that promise, a promise that Jesus emphasizes is true, believing that someone who believes on the Father that sent Jesus, and believes on Jesus, CAN come into condemnation in the future.
Psalm 89:31-34
31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;
32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.
33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.
34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.
Your beliefs have a faithless God who breaks promises.

as far as the verses you quoted, all of that says keep in the faith, keep in the grace, keep in the confidence..
it never says "sin once and you lose your salvation" They don't really defend your belief in a covenant breaking God.
 
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How would you get universalism from that? Now I think you're just being willfully contrarian.
When you sin, having been saved, do you believe that you have to make atonement for it? or just confess and ask forgiveness? If you believe the former, then you don't believe that Jesus was sufficient atonement and that'd make you not saved.

I am not saying you believe in Universalism, but you act like there are no conditions involving salvation like the Universalist who believes all will be saved because there are no conditions for salvation.

You said:
If the latter, well, that's how I view 1 John 1:9. John was writing to believers, people who already were saved as far as he knew. So what you said, makes no sense.

Then you are faced with a contradiction because 1 John 1:9 says that IF we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. YOU believe that you are already forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness without any confession of sin. But 1 John 1:9 tells us the exact opposite of that because it tells us to confess sin in order to be forgiven of it, and to be cleansed of all unrighteousness.

See, you falsely think that all you have to do is believe in Jesus in order to have faith. But faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). This means we have to believe in all of God's Word. This means we have to believe the words of Jesus and not just believe in the person of Christ for salvation alone. How so? Matthew 7:26-27 basicaly says everyone who does not do what Jesus says is like a fool who built his house upon the sand, and when a storm came, great was the fall of that house.

You said:
Adam didn't have the atonement of Jesus Christ

Not true. Adam would have the redemption of Christ when Jesus died and was risen again.

Hebrews 9:15 KJB says,
“And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

You said:
We are also told
John 5:24

Ironic that you quote a verse that refutes your belief.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that hears my word, and believes on him that sent me, has everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." (John 5:24).​

(Note on John 5:24: The EXB Translation explains that the word "hear" is to: "obey."; Meaning, we have to believe in Jesus and obey Him to not perish. Acts of the Apostles 3:23 confirms this. It says that if anyone does not hear that prophet (JESUS), they shall be destroyed).

Your belief breaks that promise, a promise that Jesus emphasizes is true, believing that someone who believes on the Father that sent Jesus, and believes on Jesus, CAN come into condemnation in the future.
Psalm 89:31-34

This passage in Psalms 89 is referring to the Davidic Covenant promise that says that certain of his sons will live physically to carry out his genealogical line forever. David's line was preserved and it would be the line by which the Messiah would come through. It does not mean that the entire line of David was saved. That would mean that his wicked sons who did evil were saved. But to think that a person can sin and still be saved means that a person does not know anything (if that is what you are suggesting). For Paul says if any man does not agree with the words of Jesus Christ and the doctrine according to godliness, he is pround and he knows nothing (1 Timothy 6:3-4). James 4:6 says that God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble.

Your beliefs have a faithless God who breaks promises.

Only in your own mind does this accusation exist. Covenant promises come with conditions according to the Bible. I believe the Bible plainly teaches that God does not agree with our sin. You want God to be faithful despite if we rebel or sin against the Lord. But that is not how salvation works. Again, try reading Matthew 13:41-42. Those who are in Christ's kingdom are cast out by Christ's angels because they worked iniquity or sin and they were thrown into the furnace of fire (i.e. the Lake of Fire).

You said:
as far as the verses you quoted, all of that says keep in the faith, keep in the grace, keep in the confidence..
it never says "sin once and you lose your salvation" They don't really defend your belief in a covenant breaking God.

#1. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer; And Leviticus 20:10 says it only takes one act of adultery to be an adulterer.

#2. Jesus Himself regarded just looking at a woman once as an act of adultery (Matthew 5:28).

#3. John says, "No murderer has eternal life abiding in them." (1 John 3:15).

#4. Proverbs 6:32 says "Whosoever commits adultery with a woman lacks understanding: he that does it destroys his own soul."

#5. Jesus Himself says that just looking at a woman in lust (Which is adultery) is potential for a person to be cast bodily in hell fire (See Matthew 5:28-30).

#6. David needed to confess of his sin in order to be forgiven (See Psalms 51).

#7. 1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

#8. Revelation 21:8 says, "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Murderers and whoremongers will be cast into the lake of fire. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire. ALL liars, and not just some. NO murderer has eternal life abiding in them (1 John 3:15).
 
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Jamdoc

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I am not saying you believe in Universalism, but you act like there are no conditions involving salvation like the Universalist who believes all will be saved because there are no conditions for salvation.



Then you are faced with a contradiction because 1 John 1:9 says that IF we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. YOU believe that you are already forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness without any confession of sin. But 1 John 1:9 tells us the exact opposite of that because it tells us to confess sin in order to be forgiven of it, and to be cleansed of all unrighteousness.
You're being willfully ignorant.
I've said multiple times that yes, you actually confess your sins and ask for forgiveness.
It's just that AFTER confessing, you do not perform an act to atone for your sin. You cannot "make it up" to God. Through your own action.
the ATONEMENT for sin was already done, but you still have to confess and ask for forgiveness when you mess up and fall short.

#1. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer; And Leviticus 20:10 says it only takes one act of adultery to be an adulterer.

#2. Jesus Himself regarded just looking at a woman once as an act of adultery (Matthew 5:28).

#3. John says, "No murderer has eternal life abiding in them." (1 John 3:15).

#4. Proverbs 6:32 says "Whosoever commits adultery with a woman lacks understanding: he that does it destroys his own soul."

#5. Jesus Himself says that just looking at a woman in lust (Which is adultery) is potential for a person to be cast bodily in hell fire (See Matthew 5:28-30).

#6. David needed to confess of his sin in order to be forgiven (See Psalms 51).

#7. 1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

#8. Revelation 21:8 says, "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Murderers and whoremongers will be cast into the lake of fire. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire. ALL liars, and not just some. NO murderer has eternal life abiding in them (1 John 3:15).

Then nobody is saved unless they get saved on their death bed. Because nobody stops sinning even after being saved, and since you believe you lose salvation the moment a person does a single sin, and there's no way to gain it back because you believe that it's a one time forgiveness of only past sins, virtually everyone goes to hell, cept those lucky few who are totally ignorant of the gospel their whole lives and only hear it on their death bed.
You must have the most narrow view of sin possible in order to think you never sin.
The standard we're held against is perfection, and the more knowledge of God we have, the tighter the standard becomes.
There is not a great multitude beyond counting of people who never sin a single time after salvation, not a single person aside from Christ never stumbled along the way.
 
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sparow

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Monardo, hey nice scripture here cause I never figured out why the man was tossed outside.

The story begins in verse 8 and understanding can be enhanced from Isaiah:

Isaiah 3:24-26, 4:1 (NKJV)
24 And so it shall be: Instead of a sweet smell there will be a stench; Instead of a sash, a rope; Instead of well-set hair, baldness; Instead of a rich robe, a girding of sackcloth; And branding instead of beauty.
25 Your men shall fall by the sword, And your mighty in the war.
26 Her gates shall lament and mourn, And she being desolate shall sit on the ground.
1 And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, "We will eat our own food and wear our own apparel; Only let us be called by your name, To take away our reproach."
 
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You're being willfully ignorant.
I've said multiple times that yes, you actually confess your sins and ask for forgiveness.
It's just that AFTER confessing, you do not perform an act to atone for your sin. You cannot "make it up" to God. Through your own action.
the ATONEMENT for sin was already done, but you still have to confess and ask for forgiveness when you mess up and fall short.

What if a person does not get a chance to confess of their sin before they die? Are they still saved?
Do you see confession as something as ongoing that maintains salvation as a part of the condition of Christ's atonement being applied?

You said:
Then nobody is saved unless they get saved on their death bed. Because nobody stops sinning even after being saved, and since you believe you lose salvation the moment a person does a single sin, and there's no way to gain it back because you believe that it's a one time forgiveness of only past sins, virtually everyone goes to hell, cept those lucky few who are totally ignorant of the gospel their whole lives and only hear it on their death bed.
You must have the most narrow view of sin possible in order to think you never sin.
The standard we're held against is perfection, and the more knowledge of God we have, the tighter the standard becomes.
There is not a great multitude beyond counting of people who never sin a single time after salvation, not a single person aside from Christ never stumbled along the way.

You need to prove your case with the Bible that believers are slaves to mortal sin in this life. However, when I read the Scriptures plainly, I read the exact opposite of that. For you have to ignore or twist the following verses below to make this false belief in popular Christianity so; For it is written...

Romans 6:1-7 KJB
[1] “What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? [2] God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? [3] Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? [4] Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. [5] For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: [6] Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. [7] For he that is dead is freed from sin.”

Romans 6:12-13 KJB
[12] “Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. [13] Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.”

Romans 8:1 KJB
“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”

Romans 8:13 KJB
“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”

James 1:12 KJB
“Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.”

2 Corinthians 7:1 KJB
“Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.”

1 Peter 4:1-4 KJB
[1] “Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin; [2] That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God. [3] For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries: [4] Wherein they think it strange that ye run not with them to the same excess of riot, speaking evil of you:”

Galatians 5:24 KJB
“And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.”

1 Corinthians 10:13 KJB
“There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.”

Psalms 119:11 KJB
“Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.”

2 Peter 2:1, & 2 Peter 2:14 KJB
“...there are false prophets... who cannot cease from sin.”

This is similar to those who are lovers of pleasure more than they are lovers of GOD (1 Timothy 3:1-9). For he that says he knows him and does not keep his commandments is a liar and the truth is not in Him (1 John 2:4).​

1 Corinthians 15:34 KJB
“Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.” (1 Corinthians 15:34).
 
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