Politics and religion - a whirlwind

[Ohorseman]

The rules of this site allow for a YouTube video. Here is the rule: Youtube videos, blogs, and offsite materials written by members may be posted to further conversation and provide relevant topics.

This is not my video, and so I am not just driving traffic to something of mine. Here is a video of a brave Catholic Priest talking about the topic. He says it better than I ever could. If you are Protestant, it is different from what you may be used to and you can skip the 1st part of you must. But hang in there and listen. It is worth it. He talks about mixing politics and religion. He talks about not siding with those that have Godless and sinful policies. The part about the 60 million babies at the gate of heaven... wow. How do Christians justify siding with those that tolerate or support abortion? I don't understand.

 

[Gifts From Above]

Yeah I don’t really see how you can claim to be Catholic and vote Democrat.

 

[BobRyan]

The part about the 60 million babies at the gate of heaven... wow. How do Christians justify siding with those that tolerate or support abortion? I don't understand.

in the Bible there were cases of child sacrifice - offering sacrifices to Moloch Lev 18 sorts of things.

 

[Fantine]

He was censored by the diocese of LaCrosse, Wisconsin. He was wrong, and you are wrong to support him.
Diocese of La Crosse releases statement over priest condemning Democrats

The bishop's letter in its entirety is here:
https://quincy-network.s3.ca-centra...0/09/Statement-Father-James-Altman-090920.pdf

As Pope Francis says, the church should inform consciences, not replace them.

 

[parousia70]

Yeah I don’t really see how you can claim to be Catholic and vote Democrat.

Or Republican.

 

[Gifts From Above]

Or Republican.

Republicans are prolife so I don’t really see how that applies.

 

[parousia70]

Republicans are prolife so I don’t really see how that applies.

And it's been Nothing but Lipservice for 50 years. Watch what they DO not what they SAY.

Republican Politicians have absolutely ZERO interest or desire in doing anything to stop legal abortion.

Its Been 47 years since Roe became the law of the Land.
Republican presidents have been in power 28 of those 47 years.

Under GW Bush, They Had the Whitehouse, Both Houses of Congress and the SCOTUS Majority for YEARS and did NOTHING to end Legal abortion. NOTHING!

Its too big a cash cow for their campaign coffers, so why would they?
Get rid of Legal abortion and you immediately dry up the MILLION$ in campaign contributions republicans get to "fight" legal abortion... they're too drunk on making money off abortion being Legal and pretending to fight against it to ever do anything of substance to stop it..
,
The Republican Party has used abortion as a political tool to raise money and rally millions of average men and women to vote against their own economic interests. The abortion issue has been the reason Catholic and Protestant church leaders have put aside their stated social justice goals to support Republican candidates who pledge opposition to abortion but never seem to accomplish anything toward reducing, much less outlawing, abortion.

The Republican Party has played a clever and cynical sleight of hand on millions of religious Catholics and Protestants from the hierarchy to the simplest believer.

At Least the Democrats are Honest about their position on the topic... The Dishonesty of the Republican's position is far worse.

 

[WonbyOneanddone]

He was censored by the diocese of LaCrosse, Wisconsin. He was wrong, and you are wrong to support him.
Diocese of La Crosse releases statement over priest condemning Democrats

The bishop's letter in its entirety is here:
https://quincy-network.s3.ca-centra...0/09/Statement-Father-James-Altman-090920.pdf

As Pope Francis says, the church should inform consciences, not replace them.

Pope Francis? He gives sermons on the evils of building walls (somebody better tell Nehemiah wall building is evil) while remaining silent about the world genocide of the unborn, that is, according to their official doctrine.

But as far as the Catholic church remaining silent about genocide, they should have not been as silent about the Holocaust as they are today about abortion. They did it to save their Papal treasures and their own skin, but unfortunately it pretty much destroyed the notion that they can be reputable on the issue. I think they are doing as they did in the 1940's, just going with the political tides to be PC and not stir the pot.

I reckon some things never change.

Brood of vipers! That's Jesus talk about apostate religious leaders.

Heck, I would be happy if the Catholic church would deal adequately about child abuse within the church.

 

[Gifts From Above]

And it's been Nothing but Lipservice for 50 years. Watch what they DO not what they SAY.

Republican Politicians have absolutely ZERO interest or desire in doing anything to stop legal abortion.

Its Been 47 years since Roe became the law of the Land.
Republican presidents have been in power 28 of those 47 years.

Under GW Bush, They Had the Whitehouse, Both Houses of Congress and the SCOTUS Majority for YEARS and did NOTHING to end Legal abortion. NOTHING!

Its too big a cash cow for their campaign coffers, so why would they?
Get rid of Legal abortion and you immediately dry up the MILLION$ in campaign contributions republicans get to "fight" legal abortion... they're too drunk on making money off abortion being Legal and pretending to fight against it to ever do anything of substance to stop it..
,
The Republican Party has used abortion as a political tool to raise money and rally millions of average men and women to vote against their own economic interests. The abortion issue has been the reason Catholic and Protestant church leaders have put aside their stated social justice goals to support Republican candidates who pledge opposition to abortion but never seem to accomplish anything toward reducing, much less outlawing, abortion.

The Republican Party has played a clever and cynical sleight of hand on millions of religious Catholics and Protestants from the hierarchy to the simplest believer.

At Least the Democrats are Honest about their position on the topic... The Dishonesty of the Republican's position is far worse.

Yeah I doubt what you are saying is factual. It’s actually more complicated and has to do with the courts.

 

[Fantine]

I don't think so. Without abortion, how the Republicans attract anyone other than the 1%? What are the advantages? Trump is trying to destroy Social Security by eliminating the payroll tax. The government is suing to end the Affordable Care Act. Trump has said that Americans get paid too much. I guess that's why he hires so many foreigners on temporary visas to work in his hotels. What planet does he live on? Poisoning the air and water is not a winning issue.
So what is their campaign strategy? We want to make your life harder, and when your unborn children are born we will make their lives harder too? No thanks

 

[tulc]

Honestly, what Party would WANT to get rid of something that
A) fills party coffers
B) puts boots in the street
C) makes a large group simply stop thinking when the subject is brought up to the point that people will vote for someone they wouldn't even want as dog-catcher if they weren't conditioned to always do as they're told when the "abortion bell" is rung.
Seriously, they know the day abortion stops being an issue the Republican Party ceases to be a major Party in America the very next election.
tulc(realized this over 20 years ago)

 

[Fantine]

Tulc, I am kind of torn between wanting abortion to just go away in order for pro-life voters to stop holding every single social justice initiative--almost all of which are very "pro-life"--hostage while they resolutely continue single issue voting for people whose support of "life" only extends to the pre-born.

But as they started experiencing success, drunk with power, they decided to go after birth control, too. It started by their redefining the pill and the IUD as 'abortifacient.' Then they launched all of these lawsuits to destroy the Affordable Care Act. I met one of the plaintiff auditors once, and he spoke, oh so proudly, about how the plaintiff group looked into the background of every district court in the country and picked the one where they had the best chance of winning and found an order of nuns willing to act as lead plaintiffs.

I used to think Roe v. Wade could be overturned, and the pro-lifers would come up to me and say, "Thank God! It bothered my conscience so much to be voting for lawmakers who didn't care about the poor, the immigrants, the disabled, the elderly, and people of color. It bothered me to see how our profligate use of fossil fuels were causing hurricanes and floods and forest fires, even affecting some people we know and love. It bothered me to support a president whose character and integrity was so lacking." I could rest, happy that my fellow Christians were on the same page as me.

But no! It all became about birth control and guns, and in my heart of hearts I began to believe that it was really about undermining women's rights. And I realized, sadly, that overturning Roe wouldn't mean that most of them would start looking around and seeing everything that needed to be done in America that they had deprioritized for so long. I still hope a few might.

Roe v. Wade should defuse the militant pro-lifers. Instead, it will empower them to find new battles on the periphery. Sigh.

 

[Sparagmos]

Yeah I doubt what you are saying is factual. It’s actually more complicated and has to do with the courts.

How do you dispute the fact that Republicans have been in control so many times and failed to outlaw abortion? That is a cold hard fact.

 

[Gifts From Above]

How do you dispute the fact that Republicans have been in control so many times and failed to outlaw abortion? That is a cold hard fact.

As I stated the courts are in charge of this.

 

[parousia70]

As I stated the courts are in charge of this.

One Stroke of the President's Pen on a Bill that could have been passed when Republicans held majorities in both houses would reduce the million abortions each year in America to under 50,000!

But they Never did that nor would they ever do that for all the reasons that have been stated here.

No Honest Christian purporting to be "pro life" would continue to support a party that for so many years didn't lift a finger to end abortion while they lied through their teeth about it just to garner campaign $$ with phony promises they never intended to keep.

 

[Sparagmos]

As I stated the courts are in charge of this.

And the courts have not been inclined to overturn Roe v. Wade. So why do pro-lifers say they have to vote for Republicans in order to outlaw abortion? Why do Republicans campaign on that issue if in fact they can’t do anything about it? It’s deceptive.

 

[Gifts From Above]

And the courts have not been inclined to overturn Roe v. Wade. So why do pro-lifers say they have to vote for Republicans in order to outlaw abortion? Why do Republicans campaign on that issue if in fact they can’t do anything about it? It’s deceptive.

In the past they didn’t have the votes to overturn Roe v Wade. Now with Barrett on the courts they may have those votes. So we shall see what the future holds for this.

 

[Albion]

And the courts have not been inclined to overturn Roe v. Wade. So why do pro-lifers say they have to vote for Republicans in order to outlaw abortion? Why do Republicans campaign on that issue if in fact they can’t do anything about it? It’s deceptive.

There is no doubt that the Court can modify Roe v. Wade significantly. That's more likely than a flat reversal.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Pope Francis? He gives sermons on the evils of building walls (somebody better tell Nehemiah wall building is evil) while remaining silent about the world genocide of the unborn, that is, according to their official doctrine.

But as far as the Catholic church remaining silent about genocide, they should have not been as silent about the Holocaust as they are today about abortion. They did it to save their Papal treasures and their own skin, but unfortunately it pretty much destroyed the notion that they can be reputable on the issue. I think they are doing as they did in the 1940's, just going with the political tides to be PC and not stir the pot.

I reckon some things never change.

Brood of vipers! That's Jesus talk about apostate religious leaders.

Heck, I would be happy if the Catholic church would deal adequately about child abuse within the church.

You don't know what you're talking about

Pope Pius XII saved 250,000 Jews during WWII, hiding them in the Vatican and elsewhere.

Golda Myer, PM of Israel, thanked Pope Pius XII for his actions and the Israeli Congress made a donation to the Church in thanks for helping Jews during the Holocausts.

You are also using mainstream media for your info on sex abuse by priests, which has been flawed since day one.

Bring your anti-Catholic rhetoric some where's else, This is a Christian forum.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

In addition to what Fantine posted, another article concerning Fr Altman's Bishop

Bishop issues statement on 'fraternal correction' of Father James Altman - Deacon Greg Kandra