Does the Bible condone slavery?

[AV1611VET]

And pretty sure government issued is rarely, if ever, utilized for people versus inanimate resources like bonds or such.

Ever heard of G.I. Joe?

 

[muichimotsu]

Ever heard of G.I. Joe?

I said rarely with the expectation you'd have an example, I wasn't saying it was never used; reading comprehension, do you have it?

 

[AV1611VET]

I said rarely with the expectation you'd have an example, I wasn't saying it was never used; reading comprehension, do you have it?

You said 'rarely, if ever'.

 

[cvanwey]

Oh yeah, according to the 13th Amendment I have been and actually am right now, a slave.

*I've got an electric ball n chain on my ankle right now...

**I've fought wildland fires for $1 an hour, which involved near death experiences, more than once.

May I ask what law you broke to now be in such a predicament?

 

[Tone]

May I ask what law you broke to now be in such a predicament?

All kinds.

 

[Tone]

All kinds.

*Mostly involving property
**No one was ever hurt in any of my crimes...except I broke my collar bone in a stolen car once.

 

[Tone]

*Mostly involving property
**No one was ever hurt in any of my crimes...except I broke my collar bone in a stolen car once.

11 years of my life was paid, and I'm still connected to this machine...paying I guess.

And not one drop of blood spilled.

 

[cvanwey]

Okay gentleman...ladies.


I challenge all here to give this approximately quarter hour long video a gander.


Anybody who says they can't spare that much time to address this topic must not really be serious about it, but only desiring to go round and round, which I am not apt to do.

Note the point about slavery being a capital offense, in Torah. The scripture reference is given within the first several minutes of the video.

Thank you for your attention, interest, and effort!

If I take the time to address this video, are you actually going to engage accordingly?

 

[Tone]

If I take the time to address this video, are you actually going to engage accordingly?

That's all I do here at the CF. I give what I can.

* In the way I can.

 

[muichimotsu]

You said 'rarely, if ever'.

If ever is not the same as saying never, you're being pedantic now

 

[Par5]

*Mostly involving property
**No one was ever hurt in any of my crimes...except I broke my collar bone in a stolen car once.

Crimes have victims, and although you didn't use violence victims can suffer emotional trauma as the result of a crime.
Anyway, you did the crime and have done the time and I am sure that you are glad that your past is just that, the past.
Courageous of you to volunteer such information on a public platform.

 

[Par5]

*Mostly involving property
**No one was ever hurt in any of my crimes...except I broke my collar bone in a stolen car once.

Crimes have victims, and although you didn't use violence victims can suffer emotional trauma as the result of a crime.
Anyway, you did the crime and have done the time and I am sure that you are glad that your past is just that, the past.
Courageous of you to volunteer such information on a public platform.

 

[BNR32FAN]

I'm not attacking the fictional character. I am being critical of a belief system that has the arrogance to condemn people who don't follow that belief system to an eternity of pain and suffering and to keep on topic, a belief system that also condones slavery.
What, attack the easter bunny and the tooth fairy? After getting those lovey easter eggs and finding all that money under my pillow? No way!

It doesn’t matter I’ve provided ample evidence for those who have “ears to hear”. For those who don’t, that’s their choice.

 

[Tone]

Crimes have victims, and although you didn't use violence victims can suffer emotional trauma as the result of a crime.
Anyway, you did the crime and have done the time and I am sure that you are glad that your past is just that, the past.
Courageous of you to volunteer such information on a public platform.

I'll tell you what, I would rather have paid them seven fold for losses and damages, than to do all that time.

I was getting doubled up due to some laws that were meant for really serious stuff (like actually physically harming someone). There have been some recent changes to rectify this though.

Sure, no problem.

I'm very transparent...maybe even unnecessarily so, but here I am, nonetheless.

 

[cvanwey]

Okay gentleman...ladies.


I challenge all here to give this approximately quarter hour long video a gander.


Anybody who says they can't spare that much time to address this topic must not really be serious about it, but only desiring to go round and round, which I am not apt to do.

Note the point about slavery being a capital offense, in Torah. The scripture reference is given within the first several minutes of the video.

Thank you for your attention, interest, and effort!

I'll start here:

0:33 "slavery has been used completely out of context"

The Bible does not distinguish or specify any/all 'forms' or 'kinds' of allowable 'slavery'. A matter of fact, the topic of 'slavery', in the Bible, is left virtually ambiguous, servant or slave. -- Paving the way for many to use any/all forms, as it suits the individual.

1:46 - Starting here, he mentions Exodus 21. Exodus 21 must be relevant for discussion then??? But when going over Exodus 21, he skips quite a lot.

2- 6 --- These Verses specify if the 'servant' is a Hebrew ONLY. Furthermore, the Verses mention how to trick a Hebrew 'servant' into lifetime 'servitude'.

7 - 11 These Verses tell the reader that the man can sell his daughter into lifetime servitude. And yet, I see no mention here if the woman has a choice in the matter?

12 -14 Don't intentionally kill, or the deemed killer is to be killed.

16 The Verse does not state 'anyone'. The Verses instead mentions 'someone.' But does the Verse mean 'anyone' and 'everyone', or, only the deemed free people??? See Verses 20-21 below. Please keep in mind, if one wants to squabble over terms, then you must squabble them all, and not just the ones convenient for you

17 The Verse then quickly switches back to 'anyone', when referencing their parents.

20-21 Regardless of if the Bible mentions the term 'slave' or 'servant', the Bible condones the beating of such, as long as they recover. Furthermore, the Verses do not mention any limitation to the frequency or reason(s) for such condoned beatings. The Verses also associates the 'slave' as property, not a fellow human. Thus, an excellent case can be made that Verse 16 is only speaking about the 'unslaved'. You know, people not deemed instead as property or the master's money. Furthermore, who would volunteer for such an arrangement?

26 - 27 If the master knocks out their eye or their teeth, the slave is to go free. That's it. I guess a blind slave is a worthless slave? The master can just go buy a new one without 'capital punishment'. I guess this is why many masters later decided to whip their slaves on the back side?.?.?.?

And please also remember, all of the above has no expiration date. These ambiguous rules look to be binding always.

I'll stop here for now.....

 

[muichimotsu]

You said 'rarely, if ever'.

That's not absolutely precluding things, this pedantic response doesn't show much real discussion, just you dodging criticism by red herrings

 

[Par5]

It doesn’t matter I’ve provided ample evidence for those who have “ears to hear”. For those who don’t, that’s their choice.

You have provided ample evidence? Such as?

It doesn’t matter I’ve provided ample evidence for those who have “ears to hear”. For those who don’t, that’s their choice.

You have provided ample evidence? Such as?

 

[AV1611VET]

That's not absolutely precluding things, this pedantic response doesn't show much real discussion, just you dodging criticism by red herrings

I heard you the first time.

 

[hedrick]

I haven't read the whole thread, just about half of it. But in that half none of the Christian participants has been willing to admit the obvious: yes, the Bible condones and in some cases mandates slavery. I believe they aren't willing to admit that because most Christians are unwilling to acknowledge the obvious: the Bible is not God's unchanging instructions to us, but (with some exceptions) a record of how Israel and the first Christians responded to God.

Jesus did not dictate answers to every ethical question we would ever have. He gave principles and examples. Paul and the other NT writers show how the first Christians put those into practice. They were working within the 1st Cent culture. There were certain shared assumptions that they didn't question.

We may wish they had reconsidered slavery. I think when you do that and try to apply basic Christian principles, you realize that in the real world it's not allowed. Perhaps in an abstract sense you can justify it as an economic relationship. But it is so conducive to abuse that almost no modern Christians consider it acceptable. And the few who do seem to be doing it just as a defense of fundamentalism. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't actually want to recreate slavery in the US.

Christ gave the power of the keys to the Church. We have the responsibility to do this kind of reexamination. Unfortunately the Church too often refuses to do so until pushed by those around them.

 

[AV1611VET]

But in that half none of the Christian participants has been willing to admit the obvious: yes, the Bible condones and in some cases mandates slavery.

Changing "servant" to "slave" is like changing "soldier" to "murderer," then claiming the U.C.M.J. condones murder.