Barr Tells Prosecutors to Consider Charging Violent Protesters With Sedition

[LostMarbels]

Attorney General William Barr told the nation’s federal prosecutors to be aggressive when charging violent demonstrators with crimes, including potentially prosecuting them for plotting to overthrow the U.S. government, people familiar with the conversation said.

In a conference call with U.S. attorneys across the country last week, Mr. Barr warned that sometimes violent demonstrations across the U.S. could worsen as the November presidential election approaches. He encouraged the prosecutors to seek a number of federal charges,...


Barr Tells Prosecutors to Consider Charging Violent Protesters With Sedition

This is all I was able to read thus far because I do not have a subscription to WSJ. I'm digging further.

 

[durangodawood]

I love it when "rule of law" people seek to mis-apply laws.

 

[LostMarbels]

I love it when "rule of law" people seek to mis-apply laws.

This would have to be a proven, coordinated act. That is in order to have 'conspired'. I do not have enough info to say Yea or Nay at this point.

My interest in the topic is, is there a declaration in the works? My thinking... they are working on declaring this as coordinated domestic terrorism. I'd be interested to see their argument/s.

 

[Hans Blaster]

This would have to be a proven, coordinated act. That is in order to have 'conspired'. I do not have enough info to say Yea or Nay at this point.

My interest in the topic is, is there a declaration in the works? My thinking... they are working on declaring this as coordinated domestic terrorism. I'd be interested to see their argument/s.

This could be a conspiracy.

This could be terrorism.

But, frankly, I don't see sedition, because I don't see a plot to "overthrow the government". Damaging, or even destroying, government buildings isn't necessarily a plot to overthrow. I don't think what Tim McVeigh and his small group of accomplices was an attempt to overthrow the government.

Does any one have an example of a recent, sucessfully prosecuted case of sedition against the US? None come to mind off hand.

 

[durangodawood]

This would have to be a proven, coordinated act. That is in order to have 'conspired'. I do not have enough info to say Yea or Nay at this point.

My interest in the topic is, is there a declaration in the works? My thinking... they are working on declaring this as coordinated domestic terrorism. I'd be interested to see their argument/s.

I hope they are careful.

The greater threat to the USA by far is that respect for the rule of law generally is hollowed out from the inside by bending prosecutions to suit political aims. This is vastly more consequential than the antics of a few dumb punks.

 

[LostMarbels]

Does any one have an example of a recent, sucessfully prosecuted case of sedition against the US? None come to mind off hand.

I think this could be the first. I say that in all honesty. A successful litigation would completely change the anti terrorism landscape in America. Including precedents of how counter terrorism laws could be utilized in the future. Kind of a big deal.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I think this could be the first. I say that in all honesty. A successful litigation would completely change the anti terrorism landscape in America. Including precedents of how counter terrorism laws could be utilized in the future. Kind of a big deal.

I suspect there are some in the distant past. Without checking, I suspect that the Booth conspiracy were all hung for sedition. I'm not sure if the main Confederate action would be called sedition or insurrection or rebellion. There were a few raids aimed at the US government during the war from the South (and I think one from Canada?) that might also qualify. Then there was that thing in the old southwest that (was it Burr) got involved with to betray the US to Spain (who then controlled Florida and may have wanted the Louisiana Terr. back).

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

View attachment 284744

Attorney General William Barr told the nation’s federal prosecutors to be aggressive when charging violent demonstrators with crimes, including potentially prosecuting them for plotting to overthrow the U.S. government, people familiar with the conversation said.

In a conference call with U.S. attorneys across the country last week, Mr. Barr warned that sometimes violent demonstrations across the U.S. could worsen as the November presidential election approaches. He encouraged the prosecutors to seek a number of federal charges,...


Barr Tells Prosecutors to Consider Charging Violent Protesters With Sedition

This is all I was able to read thus far because I do not have a subscription to WSJ. I'm digging further.

18 U.S. Code § 2384.Seditious conspiracy

If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

This would be hard to prove. Is protesting police even violently an act of overthrowing the government of the US? I say no. What does the US government have to do with the protests? It is about local governments not the US governments.

 

[LostMarbels]

I suspect there are some in the distant past. Without checking, I suspect that the Booth conspiracy were all hung for sedition. I'm not sure if the main Confederate action would be called sedition or insurrection or rebellion. There were a few raids aimed at the US government during the war from the South (and I think one from Canada?) that might also qualify. Then there was that thing in the old southwest that (was it Burr) got involved with to betray the US to Spain (who then controlled Florida and may have wanted the Louisiana Terr. back).

I don't think any of that is in the same light. It's not the same thing.

Im thinking Barr is talking about a coordinated effort with the rioters to defraud the nation. Even to the point of aiding/abetting overthrowing Trump.

 

[LostMarbels]

This would be hard to prove. Is protesting police even violently an act of overthrowing the government of the US? I say no. What does the US government have to do with the protests? It is about local governments not the US governments.

This is yet to be seen. I cannot say at this point, only voice suspicions. What Barr is attempting, is putting teeth on those suspicions. The Democratic Party is supporting these riots, even bailing out repeat offenders. Dropping charges. Defunding police. Refusing federal aid to quell the riots. Barr is officially linking 'to what end' are the Dems supporting these riots? And/or to what end are the rioters rioting with the backing of a political party?

The coup is already well known and documented. We will see prosecutions concerning that. The question remains, are these riots a part of that coup?

 

[Xenophon]

18 U.S. Code § 2384.Seditious conspiracy

If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

This would be hard to prove. Is protesting police even violently an act of overthrowing the government of the US? I say no. What does the US government have to do with the protests? It is about local governments not the US governments.

If you can get messages from protestors, say from social media, that they want to 'overthrow' the government or if they say the government is 'illegitimate' or any number of common hyperbolic statements you might find in an anarchist thread, you could probably get it done.

 

[iluvatar5150]

This is all I was able to read thus far because I do not have a subscription to WSJ. I'm digging further.

ProTip: Set up a dummy Twitter account. Post the link to that twitter page. Click the link in the tweet. That'll get you around their paywall.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I don't think any of that is in the same light. It's not the same thing.

Im thinking Barr is talking about a coordinated effort with the rioters to defraud the nation. Even to the point of aiding/abetting overthrowing Trump.

Many of us are plotting to overthrow Trump by voting him out. He is not the government of the US, just the temporary head of government.

 

[LostMarbels]

He is not the government of the US, just the temporary head of government.

That is a very telling comment, consider one talking about the deep state. There are individuals that view the president as only a figurehead to their own power. That is not how we are to be governed. That is exactly what we are fighting.

 

[Hans Blaster]

That is a very telling comment, consider one talking about the deep state. There are individuals that view the president as only a figurehead to their own power. That is not how we are to be governed. That is exactly what we are fighting.

I didn't say "figurehead", I said "temporary". No president can serve more than 8 years, that is by definition temporary. I've owned cars longer than 8 years. This is just the ordinary power of the citizens of this country.

 

[LostMarbels]

That is a very telling comment, consider one talking about the deep state. There are individuals that view the president as only a figurehead to their own power. That is not how we are to be governed. That is exactly what we are fighting.


Is that better? Is it easier to accentuate 'are' now?

 

[RushMAN]

View attachment 284744

Attorney General William Barr told the nation’s federal prosecutors to be aggressive when charging violent demonstrators with crimes, including potentially prosecuting them for plotting to overthrow the U.S. government, people familiar with the conversation said.

In a conference call with U.S. attorneys across the country last week, Mr. Barr warned that sometimes violent demonstrations across the U.S. could worsen as the November presidential election approaches. He encouraged the prosecutors to seek a number of federal charges,...


Barr Tells Prosecutors to Consider Charging Violent Protesters With Sedition

This is all I was able to read thus far because I do not have a subscription to WSJ. I'm digging further.

Good and throw on treason and terrorism too

 

[Belk]

That is a very telling comment, consider one talking about the deep state. There are individuals that view the president as only a figurehead to their own power. That is not how we are to be governed. That is exactly what we are fighting.

As someone who actually works in the government I find your claims hard to credit. I know of no one who views the president as a figurehead to their own power. What evidence do you have of these people?

 

[Hans Blaster]

As someone who actually works in the government I find your claims hard to credit. I know of no one who views the president as a figurehead to their own power. What evidence do you have of these people?

The OP is about an authoritarian move by the AG and yet we get pro-authoritarian (AFIAK) postings trying to put any resistance to Barr's power grab as some sort of deep state conspiracy or pro-insurrection position. I find it disturbing.

 

[Belk]

The OP is about an authoritarian move by the AG and yet we get pro-authoritarian (AFIAK) postings trying to put any resistance to Barr's power grab as some sort of deep state conspiracy or pro-insurrection position. I find it disturbing.

Of course you do. Anyone who has been bothering to pay attention finds the present age disturbing. We are cursed/blessed to live in interesting times.