How the Law harms you.

[Studyman]

Excellent testimony of the beauty of instruction studyman


מ (Mem)
97 How I love your Torah!
I meditate on it all day.
98 I am wiser than my foes,
because your mitzvot are mine forever.
99 I have more understanding than all my teachers,
because I meditate on your instruction.
100 I understand more than my elders,
because I keep your precepts.
101 I keep my feet from every evil way,
in order to observe your word.
102 I don’t turn away from your rulings,
because you have instructed me.
103 How sweet to my tongue is your promise,
truly sweeter than honey in my mouth!
104 From your precepts I gain understanding;
this is why I hate every false way.

נ (Nun)
105 Your word is a lamp for my foot
and light on my path.

Is this not beautiful. The Spirit of the Christ Himself speaking through the heart of David.

Ps. 119:165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

166 LORD, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments.

167 My soul hath kept thy testimonies; and I love them exceedingly.

168 I have kept thy precepts and thy testimonies: for all my ways are before thee.

169 TAU. Let my cry come near before thee, O LORD: give me understanding according to thy word.

170 Let my supplication come before thee: deliver me according to thy word.

171 My lips shall utter praise, when thou hast taught me thy statutes.

172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

173 Let thine hand help me; for I have chosen thy precepts.

174 I have longed for thy salvation, O LORD; and thy law is my delight.

175 Let my soul live, and it shall praise thee; and let thy judgments help me.

176 I have gone astray like a lost sheep; seek thy servant; for I do not forget thy commandments.

It is no wonder that Paul, filled with the wisdom of Christ Himself, told us these Word's, written by the Great and Awesome Creator God of the Universe, were specifically written for our own admonition.

What Love HE must have, to visit with HIS Grace, an insignificant creature such as myself.

I am forever in awe of HIS Perfection.

Thank you kind sir for your encouraging words

With His Love,

SM

 

[pinacled]

Is this not beautiful. The Spirit of the Christ Himself speaking through the heart of David.

Ps. 119:165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

166 LORD, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments.

167 My soul hath kept thy testimonies; and I love them exceedingly.

168 I have kept thy precepts and thy testimonies: for all my ways are before thee.

169 TAU. Let my cry come near before thee, O LORD: give me understanding according to thy word.

170 Let my supplication come before thee: deliver me according to thy word.

171 My lips shall utter praise, when thou hast taught me thy statutes.

172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

173 Let thine hand help me; for I have chosen thy precepts.

174 I have longed for thy salvation, O LORD; and thy law is my delight.

175 Let my soul live, and it shall praise thee; and let thy judgments help me.

176 I have gone astray like a lost sheep; seek thy servant; for I do not forget thy commandments.

It is no wonder that Paul, filled with the wisdom of Christ Himself, told us these Word's, written by the Great and Awesome Creator God of the Universe, were specifically written for our own admonition.

What Love HE must have, to visit with HIS Grace, an insignificant creature such as myself.

I am forever in awe of HIS Perfection.

Thank you kind sir for your encouraging words

With His Love,

SM

"Blessed are the peacemakers......"

The beauty of The Lords instruction is a washing of His Word in starlight.

Blessed be The Holy One.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The Word of God is Holy.
The misuse of the Word of God, to try to deny the Blood Atonement, by replacing it with the Torah, is unholy.


"penance" is a Catholic misunderstanding of the word "Repent", that was caus.

Is not the blood atonement part of Torah and all the covenants??? Here you try and separate them and the plan of God!

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

You dont see anything, yet.
Your pride does not allow it.

But just remember, im here to help you.
The rest is just you realizing you need it.

And like i told you a week ago when you started chasing me around on the forum, falsely claiming im changing verses, yet you never quoted me, and you can't even remember the verse...
So, as i told you, when you are ready to behave as if you understand the word "mature", then let me know and we can discuss things that you don't understand yet, Theologically.
Im here for you.....

Oh I see everything! You continue to refuse (pride and narcissis) to admit (where everyone clearly saw it) that you changed scripture. You can make all the excuses in the world but that does not change the truth. Admitting to it would be the "mature" thing to do.

 

[ralliann]

Is not the blood atonement part of Torah and all the covenants??? Here you try and separate them and the plan of God!

Sure
But I think the poster is speaking along the lines of this
Heb 13:10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.

Heb 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

 

[Studyman]

Sure
But I think the poster is speaking along the lines of this
Heb 13:10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.

Heb 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

What Law required sacrifices in order for the "comer" to be made perfect?

Was it "Thou shall Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart", or "Thou shall Love they Neighbor as thyself" and the Law and Prophets which hang on these?

Or was it the "law of Sacrifices" God specifically gave the Levites, which foreshadowed the Sacrifice Jesus would make for His People?

Heb. 8:4 For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law:

5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

It was the Levitical Priesthood that was changed, not God's definition of sin. At least according to the Christ of the Bible.

 

[ralliann]

What Law required sacrifices in order for the "comer" to be made perfect?

The law of faith

Was it "Thou shall Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart", or "Thou shall Love they Neighbor as thyself" and the Law and Prophets which hang on these?

Or was it the "law of Sacrifices" God specifically gave the Levites, which foreshadowed the Sacrifice Jesus would make for His People?

The law of faith

Heb. 8:4 For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law:

5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

It was the Levitical Priesthood that was changed, not God's definition of sin. At least according to the Christ of the Bible.

The law of faith has not changed.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

 

[Soyeong]

Saying that God's law harms us amount to saying that God can't be trusted to give laws that are for our own good.

 

[Studyman]

The law of faith

The law of faith

The law of faith has not changed.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

again you deflect. Was the Levitical Priesthood the Law of Faith or the Law of works?

 

[ralliann]

Saying that God's law harms us amount to saying that God can't be trusted to give laws that are for our own good.

The law of faith is Gods law. It runs through all the covenants.
It is not a law which is without works. See Noah Abraham had works of obedience to what God commanded them.
1.Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. {substance: or, ground, or, confidence }
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. {yet … : or, is yet spoken of }
5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith. {moved … : or, being wary }
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

Moses law was added by a covenant.

 

[ralliann]

oops double post

 

[Soyeong]

The law of faith is Gods law. It runs through all the covenants.

1.Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. {substance: or, ground, or, confidence }
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. {yet … : or, is yet spoken of }
5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith. {moved … : or, being wary }
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

Moses law was added by a covenant.

In Deuteronomy 5:31-33, Moses wrote down everything that God commanded him without turning from it, so all of the Mosaic Law is God's law. Likewise, the Law of Moses was refereed to as God's law in verses like Nehemiah 8:1-8, Nehemiah 10:29, Ezra 7:6-12, and Luke 2:21-22. Obedience to any set instructions that are for our own good is about putting our faith in the one who gave them, which is why Jesus said that faith is one of the weightier matters of the Mosaic Law (Matthew 23:23), so the Mosaic Law is the law of faith. God is trustworthy, so His law therefore is also trustworthy (Psalms 19:7, Nehemiah 9:13), and a law that isn't trustworthy can't come from a God who is trustworthy, so to deny that the Law of Mosaic is the law of faith is to deny that God is trustworthy.

 

[ralliann]

again you deflect.

No that's just you avoiding the law of faith taught in hebrews

Was the Levitical Priesthood the Law of Faith or the Law of works?

Yes, for the nation of Israel under the Sinai covenant. the law of faith is not nullified by the Mosaic covenant.

 

[ralliann]

In Deuteronomy 5:31-33, Moses wrote down everything that God commanded him without turning from it, so all of the Mosaic Law is God's law. Likewise, the Law of Moses was refereed to as God's law in verses like Nehemiah 8:1-8, Nehemiah 10:29, Ezra 7:6-12, and Luke 2:21-22. Obedience to any set instructions that are for our own good is about putting our faith in the one who gave them, which is why Jesus said that faith is one of the weightier matters of the Mosaic Law (Matthew 23:23), so the Mosaic Law is the law of faith. God is trustworthy, so His law therefore is also trustworthy (Psalms 19:7, Nehemiah 9:13), and a law that isn't trustworthy can't come from a God who is trustworthy, so to deny that the Law of Mosaic is the law of faith is to deny that God is trustworthy.

The law of faith was in effect long before Moses law.
Listen to Moses
deut 18:15 The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken;
16 According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not.
17 And the LORD said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken.
18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

Mt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

 

[pinacled]

No that's just you avoiding the law of faith taught in hebrews

Yes, for the nation of Israel under the Sinai covenant. the law of faith is not nullified by the Mosaic covenant.

The constant that has been avoided by the few that ignore both the full armor and fruits of the spirit is penance(repent and turn to walk with the Lord of Lights).
Hence the reference to psalms 119.

In faith a son or daughter turns from the enemy toward The Lord of Host and learns to place the shield upon their back.
Leaving behind the concerns of the world a person learns that repentance is the tithe that accepts what is Holy with a guarded heart.
Such a faith with works in an individual is known by their fruits after repentance.9:1

Where as the enemy will teach contrary in order to ensnare the weak in faith with lies about the beauty of instruction.
Holy Torah.

Blessings Always.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Sure
But I think the poster is speaking along the lines of this
Heb 13:10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.

Heb 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

Behold said: deny the Blood Atonement, by replacing it with the Torah, is unholy.
The plan was IN Torah, Yeshua was the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Avraham sacrificing his son Issac. It is not a replacement, it is a continuation, a fulfillment.

 

[ralliann]

Behold said: deny the Blood Atonement, by replacing it with the Torah, is unholy.

Not seeing the issue here.

The plan was IN Torah, Yeshua was the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Avraham sacrificing his son Issac. It is not a replacement, it is a continuation, a fulfillment.

Yeah, not seeing the issue here either. The Torah contains a record of more than one covenant.

 

[Soyeong]

The law of faith was in effect long before Moses law.
Listen to Moses
deut 18:15 The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken;
16 According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not.
17 And the LORD said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken.
18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

Mt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

The Bible often uses the same terms to describe the nature of the God of Israel as it does to describe the nature of the Mosaic Law, which is because it is God's instructions for how to act in accordance with His nature, such as with it being holy, righteous, and good (Romans 7:12), or with justice, mercy, and faithfulness being weightier matters of the law (Matthew 23:23). God's ways reveal His nature and there are many verses that describe the Mosaic Law as being instructions for how to walk in His ways, such as Deuteronomy 10:12-13, Isaiah 2:2-3, Joshua 22:5, Psalms 103:7, and many others. The way to act in accordance with God's nature as existed for as long as God's nature has been eternal and this way has been revealed through the Mosaic Law.

Jesus was sent by the same Father who gave the law to Moses, so there was not any disagreement in what they taught. Jesus set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law, so he would have still taught full obedience to it by example even if he had said nothing, and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22). Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent from our sins for the Kingdom of God is at hand (Matthew 4:17-23) and the Mosaic Law was how his audience knew what sin is, so repenting from our disobedience to it is an integral part of the Gospel, which Jesus prophesied would be proclaimed to the nations (Matthew 24:12-14).

 

[Studyman]

No that's just you avoiding the law of faith taught in hebrews

What is the "law of Faith" in your religion? Jesus said the Pharisees "omitted it". Paul said men who are "doers" of it shall be justified.

Rom. 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

Surely Paul is speaking to the Law of faith here. So if i am avoiding it, please show me what I am avoiding.

Yes, for the nation of Israel under the Sinai covenant. the law of faith is not nullified by the Mosaic covenant.

Paul speaks to "Justification" in his letters. Why do men need to be justified? What did they do?

The answer is obvious, they transgressed God's Commandments, AKA, they Sinned?

I have asked this question before, but "many" religious men on this forum deflect and refuse to answer. I'll ask it again.

On Mt. Sinai, what Covenant was given exclusively for the remission and atonement of sins, that is, how were the transgressions of God's Commandments forgiven before the "SEED" came?

If a man sinned in Moses time, that is, if a man broke a Commandment of God, how was his sin atoned for?

Did God tell Moses "If a man sins, he shall keep my Sabbath Holy, and his sins will be atoned for? Did God tell Moses, "if a man sins, he shall love his neighbor as himself, and his sin is forgiven". Did God tell Moses, "If a man transgresses my Commandments, he shall not steal and this man shall be justified"?

No! At least according to the God of the Bible. And yet this is the implication of your preaching.

According to the actual Word of God which became Flesh, God made a Covenant with Levi on Israel's behalf on Mt. Sinai. In this covenant God created "works" which was specifically made to atone for the sins of men, until the Seed should come, thus justifying them.

So then in this Sinai Covenant, God told Moses, "if a man sins" he shall take a sin offering, a goat or bull, the best of your flock, and take this offering specifically and exclusively to a Levite Priest would would perform sacrificial, ceremonial "works" and when this "work" was complete, this man's sins are forgiven.

Hebrews 7-10 goes into great detail about this Covenant with Levi. The Hebrews Author called it the "Levitical Priesthood" and the "First Covenant". And goes into why it was changed. But the Christ already told us by His Spirit in Malachi.

Mal. 2:4 And ye shall know that I have sent this commandment unto you, that my covenant might be with Levi, saith the LORD of hosts. 5 My covenant was with him of life and peace; and I gave them to him for the fear wherewith he feared me, and was afraid before my name. (EX. 32)

8 But ye are departed out of the way; ye have caused many to stumble at the law; ye have corrupted the covenant of Levi, saith the LORD of hosts.

So what did the Word of God which became Flesh do?

Heb. 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8 For finding fault with them, ( Levites who corrupted the Priesthood Covenant) he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

No more Levitical Priesthood sacrificial "works" for the justification of men who sinned.

The Priesthood was changed, not God's definition of sin.

 

[pinacled]

Not seeing the issue here.

Yeah, not seeing the issue here either. The Torah contains a record of more than one covenant.

The Torah contains a record of The Lords promises which is His covenant fulfilled by Yeshua the lamb.
The covenants of oaths sworn by men in the past were not kept.
Which is an example the Lord taught about.
Matthew 5:34
James 5:12