Biblical sufficiency vs Modern Questions?

GaveMeJoy

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Marijuana has not been approved for any medical use by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration. Marijuana use contributes to the risk of lung cancer. New Zealand estimated 10% of their lung cancer was from marijuana use. Marijuana was shown to retard brain development in adolescents. People driving under the influence of marijuana were more likely to wreck. Colorado legalized marijuana and traffic accidents increased. Marijuana is a hallucinogenic waste of time. It is a waste of money. It should be illegal.
Edibles eliminate health considerations regarding smoking. Marijuana is more natural, less dangerous, less addictive, and less expensive than the majority of the higher level pain management opioids and narcotics, which conservative Christians gobble down when they have a slipped disk.

I find it hard to believe that God looks favorably on Vicodin and Percocet prescribed by a doctor and looks unfavorably on cannabis prescribed by a doctor. But it’s ok, most people with the old school mentality will die off in the next 20 years and the church will lose the stigma regarding medical weed. Unfortunately it will likely also go the same way regarding recreational use, which is a shame because I don’t believe that is supported by scripture in the slightest.
 
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dqhall

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Edibles eliminate health considerations regarding smoking. Marijuana is more natural, less dangerous, less addictive, and less expensive than the majority of the higher level pain management opioids and narcotics, which conservative Christians gobble down when they have a slipped disk.

I find it hard to believe that God looks favorably on Vicodin and Percocet prescribed by a doctor and looks unfavorably on cannabis prescribed by a doctor. But it’s ok, most people with the old school mentality will die off in the next 20 years and the church will lose the stigma regarding medical weed. Unfortunately it will likely also go the same way regarding recreational use, which is a shame because I don’t believe that is supported by scripture in the slightest.
I made it through a back injury without medications. The pain was there to let me know not to move my back for it to heal. I had oral surgery and had a prescription for an opioid. I used one, it made me sleepy. I threw the remainder in the garbage.
 
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Al Touthentop

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He said they were for food.
That verse talks about [green herbs to eat].
Where does it say [you can smoke weed?]
Smoking anything will damage the lungs.

Well that isn't really proven. Seems like when everyone ate their food around a smokey campfire the human race would have gone extinct if inhaling smoke was such a dangerous thing. You don't have to smoke herbs anyway. You can eat pot and other herbs and they still affect you if they have psychotropic qualities.

But where does it say you can't smoke weed?
 
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Swan7

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Does Paul not explain the convictions from the Holy Spirit? Does he also not explain how not to cause a brother to stumble?
Most of all, does Jesus Christ, the Word made manifest, not say “be sober of mind”?

I get that we all have questions and we should, so that we can understand. One will never understand if one does not ask God Himself, which is the very thing He wants us to do to know Him better. :yellowheart:
 
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GaveMeJoy

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I made it through a back injury without medications. The pain was there to let me know not to move my back for it to heal. I had oral surgery and had a prescription for an opioid. I used one, it made me sleepy. I threw the remainder in the garbage.
You were very fortunate your back injury was minor. Many folks have serious injuries and ailments that require pain medication.
 
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klutedavid

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A lot of pastors and Christians believe in the doctrine of biblical sufficiency, but often times they get asked questions that the bible just does not directly address and the best they can do is to go on a general principle.
One that comes up a lot is should a Christian use Medical Marijuana, or even should a Christian use Marijuana recreationally. While when the law in the US was that it was strictly illegal, that was an easy question to answer because Romans 13 teaches us to abide by the laws of the land, even the secular ones, because God put that authority in place. But now states and even some countries like Canada are legalizing it even for recreational use. Then it becomes more of a stretch and many cite scripture about sorcery and justify that the word for sorcery is the same as pharmacy, but isn't directly related, or scripture referring to alcohol and making a stretch to make it cover all intoxicants, or just the commands to be sober minded in general.
Now as far as recreational goes, they're probably right along the lines of needing to be sober minded. But when it comes to medical use it becomes murky, because a person might be using opioid pain relievers truly just to alleviate severe pain, not to get intoxicated but intoxication is a side effect. They may have use of marijuana when other pharmaceutical agents have failed for various conditions, chronic pain and inflammation, seizure disorders, as an adjunct to chemotherapy in cancer, etc.
so as a Christian you're in a bind. Do you use the medication that helps with medical symptoms that your doctor has prescribed for you, or do you obey the command to be sober minded even if you're in so much pain that it distracts you from all other things (which is in a way, also not being sober minded, you can't focus on God when your focus is pretty much railroaded on pleasure that does not come from God, OR on pain). The bible doesn't really address it, and faith leaders and pastors you may ask, can only give their opinions based on leaps of logic from scripture about other topics.

That is just one example but there are others that in modern life, the bible just doesn't seem to address.
It's hard to me to adhere to biblical sufficiency when I come to a situation and think "what does the bible say about (x)?" and the answer is nothing, it says nothing, so it doesn't help as a guide there and all I can go with are human opinions and leaps of logic which are never consistent.
Not in a bind over this OP.

If I was in severe pain and the doctor offered an opioid for pain relief, I would have no objection what so ever.

I do not even see the issue here.

There is a difference between taking medicine (opioids) for a painful medical condition and using drugs for self indulgent purposes.
 
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Well that isn't really proven. Seems like when everyone ate their food around a smokey campfire the human race would have gone extinct if inhaling smoke was such a dangerous thing. You don't have to smoke herbs anyway. You can eat pot and other herbs and they still affect you if they have psychotropic qualities.

But where does it say you can't smoke weed?

Really?! Are you serious?
 
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Well that isn't really proven. Seems like when everyone ate their food around a smokey campfire the human race would have gone extinct if inhaling smoke was such a dangerous thing. You don't have to smoke herbs anyway. You can eat pot and other herbs and they still affect you if they have psychotropic qualities.

But where does it say you can't smoke weed?

Cigarette smoking is responsible for more than 480,000 deaths per year in the United States, including more than 41,000 deaths resulting from secondhand smoke exposure. This is about one in five deaths annually, or 1,300 deaths every day. On average, smokers die 10 years earlier than nonsmokers.

Source:
Fast Facts
 
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Well that isn't really proven. Seems like when everyone ate their food around a smokey campfire the human race would have gone extinct if inhaling smoke was such a dangerous thing. You don't have to smoke herbs anyway. You can eat pot and other herbs and they still affect you if they have psychotropic qualities.

But where does it say you can't smoke weed?

  • More than 16 million Americans are living with a disease caused by smoking.
  • For every person who dies because of smoking, at least 30 people live with a serious smoking-related illness.
  • Smoking causes cancer, heart disease, stroke, lung diseases, diabetes, and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), which includes emphysema and chronic bronchitis.
  • Smoking also increases risk for tuberculosis, certain eye diseases, and problems of the immune system, including rheumatoid arthritis.

Source:
Fast Facts
 
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CharismaticLady

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This was your quote 'just like alcohol, people are going to use it, and so it is with marijuana. So why not make it legal and get the tax money from it. Moderation in everything is the rule.'
This was the same rhetoric that lead to prostitution being legal in many jurisdictions, ...thus, my comment.
And all that you came back with was 'sex can't be taxed'. Thus, my simpleton comment, for it wasn't the point, plus, it wasn't true.

Making marijuana, or any other vice, legal, advocates its use under any situation. We do not condone, support, or capitalize on activities simply because we have not the means to eradicate it, ...especially when they are hedonistic and sinful, and whether its usage is in moderation or not (a little yeast, permeates the whole).
You find this position ludicrous or simple?

I will gladly take any drug prescribed by a doctor, eg: marijuana, methodone, demerol, etc.. Just enough until my affliction is over. Never will I support the legalization of these chemicals outside of a medicinal context.

The point is, they are not a sin in themselves. That is all I care about. What God thinks. I belong to Him, and Him only. And certainly not how the world sins and takes what is allowed to the extreme and brings it to the level of a sin. Let the perishing pay taxes.
 
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I believe smoking and vaping of any kind is a grievous sin in God's eyes because it destroys the body in a really bad way. 1 Corinthians 3:17 is not an easy pill for some Christians to swallow. Legalizing a sin (By the state or country) does not undo the fact that is a sin still in God's eyes.

As for non-smoking or non-vaping forms of marijuana:
A believer should never proclaim they do this before others if they desperately need it to ease pain because they could come off as stoners to others (When they are not). If they find that the use of this substance is damaging to them in a bad way, they should stop taking it. We are not to harm our bodies. We are also to be sober minded, as well. If we are never sober minded at any point in our life for the Lord, then we are disobeying the instructions within His word to be sober minded. For if we cannot think clearly, then the enemy can make us to believe wrong things about God, His Word, and other people.
 
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Al Touthentop

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  • More than 16 million Americans are living with a disease caused by smoking.
  • For every person who dies because of smoking, at least 30 people live with a serious smoking-related illness.
  • Smoking causes cancer, heart disease, stroke, lung diseases, diabetes, and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), which includes emphysema and chronic bronchitis.
  • Smoking also increases risk for tuberculosis, certain eye diseases, and problems of the immune system, including rheumatoid arthritis.
Source:
Fast Facts

Which is irrelevant. Driving causes highway deaths. Is it a sin?
 
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CharismaticLady

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I believe smoking and vaping of any kind is a grievous sin in God's eyes because it destroys the body in a really bad way. 1 Corinthians 3:17 is not an easy pill for some Christians to swallow. Legalizing a sin (By the state or country) does not undo the fact that is a sin still in God's eyes.

As for non-smoking or non-vaping forms of marijuana:
A believer should never proclaim they do this before others if they desperately need it to ease pain because they could come off as stoners to others (When they are not). If they find that the use of this substance is damaging to them in a bad way, they should stop taking it. We are not to harm our bodies. We are also to be sober minded, as well. If we are never sober minded at any point in our life for the Lord, then we are disobeying the instructions within His word to be sober minded. For if we cannot think clearly, then the enemy can make us to believe wrong things about God, His Word, and other people.


I'm not arguing with you, just making a statement here:

The danger in Christians is calling something a sin, when God doesn't. And finding excuses for behavior when God says it is a sin.
 
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CharismaticLady

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Unfortunately it will likely also go the same way regarding recreational use, which is a shame because I don’t believe that is supported by scripture in the slightest.

I read this a couple times, and still don't know what you are agreeing to or disagreeing to.
 
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I'm not arguing with you, just making a statement here:

The danger in Christians is calling something a sin, when God doesn't. And finding excuses for behavior when God says it is a sin.

Do you believe smoking does not damage the body?
Does not 1 Corinthians 3:17 say that if we defile the temple, God will destroy us?
Is not smoking a form of defiling (destroying) God's temple by causing lung cancer and other related diseases?
 
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Which is irrelevant. Driving causes highway deaths. Is it a sin?

Not the same thing. We know that being followers of Jesus can lead to our own persecution and death, but it is for a good cause. Death related driving accidents that are not the fault of the person does not mean it was wrong for them to drive, it was merely their time to go and it was when God called that person to die. There is no accident when a person gets lung cancer or other smoke related diseases as a result of smoking. It is a punishment for their sin. Just as when a person gets sexual diseases for sleeping around. Just as a person can get thrown in the slammer for the sin of armed robbery. The result of their sin is no accident.
 
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Which is irrelevant. Driving causes highway deaths. Is it a sin?

Oh, and if you believe driving is a sin because people die, then by all means, show us in Scripture that driving is a sin. If not, then you are making a point that does not relate to smoke related diseases that are caused by smoking. A person will die early if they smoke. It is just basic Science and or cause and effect. If you eat poison, then you will die. Was that an accident if you knew it was poison? No. Of course not. So please do not try to act like cigarette smoke is not a sin that kills people every day.
 
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CharismaticLady

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Do you believe smoking does not damage the body?
Does not 1 Corinthians 3:17 say that if we defile the temple, God will destroy us?
Is not smoking a form of defiling (destroying) God's temple by causing lung cancer and other related diseases?

What God is actually saying in that chapter is it is not what we put into the body in moderation, but using the body for sexual immorality that defiles the body, and in particular, in that case, with demon-possessed pagan temple prostitutes. That is what God calls sin. It is joining together the devil with the Holy Spirit. And that is all I care about. What He thinks. We are not taking this body to heaven with us. Knowing what God calls sin, and what He doesn't will help us judge rightly, and not illegally in His sight. Be careful, for with the same measure we judge others, God will judge us.
 
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Which is irrelevant. Driving causes highway deaths. Is it a sin?

What do you make of 1 Corinthians 3:17?
Is not smoking a form of defiling the temple?
Can you honestly say that smoking is good for the body?
Is it not common knowledge that people know smoking is bad for them?
Are you unaware of this?
 
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