Why is it ok to be a fat pastor but not a gay pastor?

[Neogaia777]

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, Sexually Immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."
• Revelation 21:8


I don't see "Fat People" in that list.


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We're talking about ones here who have took a vow of celibacy or abstinance from any kind of sexual immorality or impurity...? But maybe can still get tripped up every once in a great while, stricken by or with the temptation (at least), or (at least) the feelings at least, associated with certain kind of sin, or sinful desires/temptations, but don't have, and maybe have never given into them, etc...?

God Bless!

 

[Hazelelponi]

That list covers just about everbody with any kind or kinds of sin problems at all, really...

God Bless!

Like the sermon I shared discussed, on the one hand antinomianism is heresy because it refuses to fall under the Lordship of Christ, but on the other there is legalism, also heresy, which has a variety of forms, the most extreme of which tries to save itself without understanding that, as it is written, "by the works of the law shall no man be justified." Thereby refusing the grace of God.

There is a balance each Christian should reach, one that both falls under the Lordship of Christ, but recognizes through faith that the work of salvation is Christ's work.

John 3:18 is a good example in a single verse, because there are translation choices where "obey" can also mean "believe", of which both choices are correct because it's talking about the work of Salvation being Christ's, while we ourselves fall under His Lordship through faith.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

We're talking about ones here who have took a vow of celibacy or abstinance from any kind of sexual immorality or impurity...? But maybe can still get tripped up every once in a great while, stricken by or with the temptation (at least), or (at least) the feelings at least, associated with certain kind of sin, or sinful desires/temptations, but don't have, and maybe have never given into them, etc...?

God Bless!

I was just showing that those verses don't say anything about "Fat People" but they do mention people who are sexually immoral, adulterers, homosexuals, sodomites, murderers, sorcerers etc.


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[Presbyterian Continuist]

Ezekiel 16:49-50 New International Version (NIV)
49 “‘Now this was the sin of your sister She and her daughters were arrogant, overfedand unconcerned;they did not help the poor and needy.50 and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen.

It is important that you quote Scripture in its right context. Here is how Ezekiel 16 starts:

"The word of the Lord came to me: “Son of man, confront Jerusalem with her detestable practices and say, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says to Jerusalem:" (Ezekiel 16:1-3).

He is speaking of Jerusalem which had gone away from the Lord and been unfaithful to Him. Therefore your reference is not about fat people at all, especially fat pastors. Not a wise move to twist Scripture out of context to try and put words into Ezekiel's mouth which he never said.

 

[SkyWriting]

I like your position on abstinent celibate unmarried gay Christians. If you look through all of the scripture on homosexuality none of it contradicts that (admittedly rare) application. One could have homosexual feelings or tendencies and as long as they were abstinent/celibate they would not be in sin. There is a famous biblical scholar who does conference appearances that is that way.

It's not a correct thing for anyone else to judge.

Especially since looking with lust at a non-spouse is no different than doin' it.

Matthew 5:28
But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

So the abstinence thing is not an option.

 

[SkyWriting]

I was just showing that those verses don't say anything about "Fat People" but they do mention people who are sexually immoral, adulterers, homosexuals, sodomites, murderers, sorcerers etc.
.

excess of food
prosperous ease
"did not aid the poor and needy"
haughty
impurity
sensuality
idolatry
enmity
strife
jealousy
fits of anger
rivalries
dissensions
divisions
envy
drunkenness
-and things like these.

But not overeating you are claiming?

Philippians 3:19
Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

Proverbs 23:2
And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

 

[Neogaia777]

It is important that you quote Scripture in its right context. Here is how Ezekiel 16 starts:

"The word of the Lord came to me: “Son of man, confront Jerusalem with her detestable practices and say, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says to Jerusalem:" (Ezekiel 16:1-3).

He is speaking of Jerusalem which had gone away from the Lord and been unfaithful to Him. Therefore your reference is not about fat people at all, especially fat pastors. Not a wise move to twist Scripture out of context to try and put words into Ezekiel's mouth which he never said.

Come on now, it begins with "now this was the sin of your (Jerusalem's) sister Sodom"...?

I don't think it gets anymore context than that...?

God Bless!

 

[SkyWriting]

It is important that you quote Scripture in its right context. Here is how Ezekiel 16 starts:
"The word of the Lord came to me: “Son of man, confront Jerusalem with her detestable practices and say, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says to Jerusalem:" (Ezekiel 16:1-3).
He is speaking of Jerusalem which had gone away from the Lord and been unfaithful to Him. Therefore your reference is not about fat people at all, especially fat pastors. Not a wise move to twist Scripture out of context to try and put words into Ezekiel's mouth which he never said.

Ezekiel 16:49-50
Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food, and prosperous ease, but did not aid the poor and needy. They were haughty and did an abomination before me. So I removed them, when I saw it.

Luke 16:19-21
“There was a rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and who feasted sumptuously every day. And at his gate was laid a poor man named Lazarus, covered with sores, who desired to be fed with what fell from the rich man's table. Moreover, even the dogs came and licked his sores.

 

[Neogaia777]

I was just showing that those verses don't say anything about "Fat People" but they do mention people who are sexually immoral, adulterers, homosexuals, sodomites, murderers, sorcerers etc.


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You left a few out...? And they are each meant to be broad terms, interpreted broadly, covering a lot or sin that almost all of us are guilty of and many fail to ever live up to perfectly in their or this life, most especially in their hearts all of the time, etc...

God Bless!

 

[johnflinst]

So in summation, it appears it's ok to be a fat pastor becasue:
-some people have medical conditions that make them fat
-god doesn't hate fat people as much as gay people
-being gay is a far worse sin than being fat(if being fat is even a sin)
-Christians will defend their own sins and lash out at others sins to make themselves feel better

I think I got it all. Thanks guys!

 

[Neogaia777]

I'm not a homosexual BTW, but have I been "touched by the feelings of those infirmities", sometimes, but not because I am gay myself, but due other things, thing that my mind does or sees and interprets sometime with what and all is going on, sometimes causes the same kind feelings sometimes, sometimes, etc, it's like fight or flight, moments of panic, fear, the adrenaline, etc...

I don't feel as if I am in control of it, what my mind does sometimes, but think there could be something or someone on the other side of it sometimes maybe sometimes, something intelligent, and powerful, etc...

This is why it is said I have a mental disorder, etc...

But anyway, I'm not really gay, not really anyway, as I tried to explain, and I only shared what I did in order that others might see how they are deceived in this area, with some, etc, maybe not all but "some", might hopefully benefit from it, etc...

Anyway,

I went over to a friend's house for just a little bit, and he was watching some perfectly normal show, for the most part, and I had to ask him if he could turn it down or mute it or stop it or shut it off, and I had to tell him it's part of my mental disorder, and that was not seeing or hearing what i was seeing and hearing, etc, this perspective shifting and changing all of the time, from one instance to the next, etc, i had to tell him that you guys are not seeing the things I am seeing or hearing the things I am hearing, etc, for you it's a perfectly normal experience, but not so for me a lot, etc...

Had to ask if he stop or silence it, so we could talk until I left, cause it was going to be only a very short visit, then I was going back to my place, etc...

Anyway, had to see if he could get it to stop, and, I'm not gay, etc...

God Bless!

 

[S.O.J.I.A.]

holy deflection batman!

 

[alan650]

As someone who only is attracted to other men I can definitely say I never ever chose to have gay feelings. This is my number one struggle. Unless you are in my shoes you don't know how hard of a struggle it is. I think people just love to levitate being gay as ultimate sin. However, we are sinful creatures for many reasons.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

I'm not a homosexual BTW, but have I been "touched by the feelings of those infirmities", sometimes, but not because I am gay myself, but due other things, thing that my mind does or sees and interprets sometime with what and all is going on, sometimes causes the same kind feelings sometimes, sometimes, etc, it's like fight or flight, moments of panic, fear, the adrenaline, etc...

I don't feel as if I am in control of it, what my mind does sometimes, but think there could be something or someone on the other side of it sometimes maybe sometimes, something intelligent, and powerful, etc...

This is why it is said I have a mental disorder, etc...

But anyway, I'm not really gay, not really anyway, as I tried to explain, and I only shared what I did in order that others might see how they are deceived in this area, with some, etc, maybe not all but "some", might hopefully benefit from it, etc...

Anyway,

I went over to a friend's house for just a little bit, and he was watching some perfectly normal show, for the most part, and I had to ask him if he could turn it down or mute it or stop it or shut it off, and I had to tell him it's part of my mental disorder, and that was not seeing or hearing what i was seeing and hearing, etc, this perspective shifting and changing all of the time, from one instance to the next, etc, i had to tell him that you guys are not seeing the things I am seeing or hearing the things I am hearing, etc, for you it's a perfectly normal experience, but not so for me a lot, etc...

Had to ask if he stop or silence it, so we could talk until I left, cause it was going to be only a very short visit, then I was going back to my place, etc...

Anyway, had to see if he could get it to stop, and, I'm not gay, etc...

God Bless!

The truth is that some sins are caused by demonic attachments. Especially sexual sins.

That's why sometimes people have temptations / physical feelings / thoughts that seem involuntary.


.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

excess of food
prosperous ease
"did not aid the poor and needy"
haughty
impurity
sensuality
idolatry
enmity
strife
jealousy
fits of anger
rivalries
dissensions
divisions
envy
drunkenness
-and things like these.

But not overeating you are claiming?

Philippians 3:19
Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

Proverbs 23:2
And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

The men of Sodom weren't trying to get extra helpings at the buffet table before they were destroyed.


Now before they lay down, the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both old and young, all the people from every quarter, surrounded the house. And they called to Lot and said to him, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may know them carnally." So Lot went out to them through the doorway, shut the door behind him, and said, "Please, my brethren, do not do so wickedly! See now, I have two daughters who have not known a man; please, let me bring them out to you, and you may do to them as you wish; only do nothing to these men, since this is the reason they have come under the shadow of my roof." And they said, "Stand back!" Then they said, "This one came in to stay here, and he keeps acting as a judge; now we will deal worse with you than with them." So they pressed hard against the man Lot, and came near to break down the door. But the men reached out their hands and pulled Lot into the house with them, and shut the door. And they struck the men who were at the doorway of the house with blindness, both small and great, so that they became weary trying to find the door.

• Genesis 19:4-11


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[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

As someone who only is attracted to other men I can definitely say I never ever chose to have gay feelings. This is my number one struggle. Unless you are in my shoes you don't know how hard of a struggle it is.

It's caused by demonic spirits that's why it's Involuntary. The feelings are Involuntary but the actions are voluntary.

Check out the story of Saint Justina and Saint Cyprian. It shows us that Involuntary physical feelings and thoughts can be caused from demonic spirits.

Make the sign of the cross, drink Holy Water, pray and fast etc :

Saints Cyprian and Justina and what we can learn from their story as Christians (Repost)


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[alan650]

I am sorry but I just had to laugh about putting food in one's ear. I do not understand why small children have gay mannerisms already. Some kids in first grade who are effeminate grow to become homosexual. So I think homosexuality is a very difficult condition. While heterosexuals are enjoying sex homosexuals must refrain.
I am not condoning homosexuality. I am just expressing concern about people who have dealt with this condition for much of their lives. It is a heavy burden for some to bear. I prefer to let God be the judge because I do not want to be judged harshly. I think many ministers have changed their minds about homosexuality and it's expression in a loving committed relationship. I am not there yet. I just don't think a first grader chooses to express homosexual mannerisms for no reason. And not all gays are effeminate. It is more complicated than my mind can grasp.

THIS! Being dealt the gay struggle is extremely difficult! I would know! Only way I can explain it is that I am attracted to men the same way a straight person is attracted to the opposite sex. I have no sexual attraction to women. It's the worst sinful burden to overcome and I've often pleaded with God about it. It's easy to rant and rave about "the gays" and act superior to this sin but you must know what a difficult and strong sin it is to bear!!!!

 

[alan650]

It's caused by demonic spirits that's why it's Involuntary. The feelings are Involuntary but the actions are voluntary.

Check out the story of Saint Justina and Saint Cyprian. It shows us that Involuntary physical feelings and thoughts can be caused from demonic spirits.

Make the sign of the cross, drink Holy Water, pray and fast etc :

Saints Cyprian and Justina and what we can learn from their story as Christians (Repost)


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Perhaps? All I know is that I've never been attracted to women since I hit puberty and it has stayed that way. Sorry but I don't believe in "making the sign of the cross" or this supposed "holy water"

Praying and fasting are definite biblical concepts though. You don't think I've prayed hard ever since I've realized this was my lot? I've prayed so much about it. I ended up only having peace when I realized this was the cross I am to bear. We all have sins and struggles. We are deceiving ourselves if we think we don't. However, a blanket statement of telling people who are struggling with homosexuality to pray, fast, drink holy water, and do "sign of the cross" is no help!

 

[solid_core]

I love my fat gay pastor!

Fat homosexual divorced female pastor!

 

[expos4ever]

I think there is a deeper issue bubbling beneath the surface here. Many of us who are not comfortable with American-stlye fundamentalism are, I suggest, rightly suspicious of the zeal with which homosexuality is vilified. Whether this is overly judgmental of us or not, we see a slice of American Christian culture that embraces guns, militarism, and the pursuit of wealth while simultaneously demonizing efforts create a society where the least of these are actually supported in a material way.

In short, many of us think the fundamentalists have created an amorphous fusion of certain American cultural values with Biblical values. And, in the process, true Biblical values get distorted.

True - the Scriptures do speak of homosexual practise as sin. But since most of us are not tempted in that direction, it is an all-too-available target for self-righteous ire. And while perhaps over-eating is a very different issue, it is clearly not desirable to be overweight and we should do everything we can to deal with this massive public health issue.