Christianity Today calls for Trump's removal from office

durangodawood

Dis Member
Aug 28, 2007
23,413
15,561
Colorado
✟428,039.00
Country
United States
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Single
...
Is Christianity Today feeding the bad wolf or the good wolf?

Is Donald Trump feeding the bad wolf or the good wolf?
I dont know what internal struggles Trump or this magazine may be going through.

I just know what they put out into the world. And with Trump, I dont like it.
 
Upvote 0

rambot

Senior Member
Apr 13, 2006
24,494
13,119
Up your nose....wid a rubbah hose.
✟361,729.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Greens
Good wolf, bad wolf::Good Christian, bad Christian
So is Christianity Today the good Christian and Trump the bad Christian?
Or is Christianity Today the bad Christian and Trump the good Christian?

There's an ancient Cherokee story from before Columbus that frames the same question:

A child goes to the Chief with a question:

"Sometimes I see a person act good. And then at other times I see the same person act bad. I don't understand."

The Chief:

"Inside each person there are both a good wolf and a bad wolf. And they fight."

Child:

"Why do they fight?"

Chief:

"Each wants to win control of you."

Child:

"Which one wins?"

Chief:

"The one you feed."

(I use this because I'm a tribal member.)

The question about good christian, bad Christian is then framed in terms of "food."

Is Christianity Today feeding the bad wolf or the good wolf?

Is Donald Trump feeding the bad wolf or the good wolf?

Examples?
CT: Measured gracious, humble communication. Grudgingly rebukes but does so because they feel God led to do so.

Trump: Abusive, bombastic, rude, insulting, power tripping and abusive in communication. Is quick to rebuke, unable to accept corrective speech of any kind, completely lacking in grace.

It seems kinda easy for me to figure out whose feeding what.
 
Upvote 0

NothingIsImpossible

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2015
5,615
3,254
✟274,922.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I feel people missed the point on why people voted for Trump. We already knew he was a bad person, however he wanted to try to help us on hold on to our religious rights. Where as Hillary wanted the opposite. She was far more interested in doing things that would give us even less rights. So we voted Trump because it was the only choice when it comes to religious freedom.

I would add the CT has leaned left over the last few years. They tend to post liberal sided articles now including articles that are essentially "White people bad! Feel bad if you're white!". No surprise they are against Trump.

Here are some good quotes about whats wrong with CT's statement:
It’s true that this also speaks of disunity within our ranks. But where is it written that we must have political unity to be one in Christ? That we must have the same view of the president to stand together for the larger cause of the gospel?

As I’ve said many times before, when we stand before God on that day, He will ask us what we have done with Jesus. Not what we have done with Trump. I’m aware, of course, of how the secular media will spin this. Galli’s editorial will be used to deepen the divide between us.

It will be used to make rejection of Trump a litmus test for true evangelical Christianity. (Ironically, in other circles, it is support of Trump that serves as a litmus test of one’s true faith.) It will be used to discourage evangelicals from voting for Trump, if not to shame them from voting for him.

I agree with Galli that, under the current administration, there has been a dumbing down of the idea of morality. And it’s true that many evangelicals now wink at things that once grieved them, thankful to have a man like Trump who will stand up and fight (many would say, “Finally!”).

But that doesn’t mean we remove him for his alleged dumbing down of morality. It means we are careful not to lose our own morality in the process.

The stakes are very high, and our nation is dangerously divided. Let us be sure that, as God’s people, we do not follow suit.


If you look here on this forum, we indeed have come to that last thing he said.
 
Upvote 0

TLK Valentine

I've already read the books you want burned.
Apr 15, 2012
64,493
30,319
Behind the 8-ball, but ahead of the curve.
✟541,512.00
Country
United States
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Single
I could not understand why Christians could not see the con job before he was elected. It baffled me that so many were enthralled by him.

In all fairness to the evangelicals, Donald did successfully portray himself as pro-America, anti-abortion, anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim, anti-liberal... so there was quite a bit for them to gain by his election.

Now, if I myself were a Christian, I would take the time to remind those Christians that when they face the final judgement, Jesus is not going to be interested in what they bought with thirty pieces of silver, only in what they sold to get them...

...but I'm no Christian; why should they care about my opinion? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
Upvote 0

Rubiks

proud libtard
Aug 14, 2012
4,293
2,259
United States
✟137,866.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I feel people missed the point on why people voted for Trump. We already knew he was a bad person, however he wanted to try to help us on hold on to our religious rights. Where as Hillary wanted the opposite. She was far more interested in doing things that would give us even less rights. So we voted Trump because it was the only choice when it comes to religious freedom.

I would add the CT has leaned left over the last few years. They tend to post liberal sided articles now including articles that are essentially "White people bad! Feel bad if you're white!". No surprise they are against Trump.

Here are some good quotes about whats wrong with CT's statement:
It’s true that this also speaks of disunity within our ranks. But where is it written that we must have political unity to be one in Christ? That we must have the same view of the president to stand together for the larger cause of the gospel?

As I’ve said many times before, when we stand before God on that day, He will ask us what we have done with Jesus. Not what we have done with Trump. I’m aware, of course, of how the secular media will spin this. Galli’s editorial will be used to deepen the divide between us.

It will be used to make rejection of Trump a litmus test for true evangelical Christianity. (Ironically, in other circles, it is support of Trump that serves as a litmus test of one’s true faith.) It will be used to discourage evangelicals from voting for Trump, if not to shame them from voting for him.

I agree with Galli that, under the current administration, there has been a dumbing down of the idea of morality. And it’s true that many evangelicals now wink at things that once grieved them, thankful to have a man like Trump who will stand up and fight (many would say, “Finally!”).

But that doesn’t mean we remove him for his alleged dumbing down of morality. It means we are careful not to lose our own morality in the process.

The stakes are very high, and our nation is dangerously divided. Let us be sure that, as God’s people, we do not follow suit.


If you look here on this forum, we indeed have come to that last thing he said.

What makes you think religious rights are under attack in America?
 
Upvote 0

TLK Valentine

I've already read the books you want burned.
Apr 15, 2012
64,493
30,319
Behind the 8-ball, but ahead of the curve.
✟541,512.00
Country
United States
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Single
I feel people missed the point on why people voted for Trump. We already knew he was a bad person, however he wanted to try to help us on hold on to our religious rights.

Some might say you compromised your principles in order to hang on to worldly power.

Where as Hillary wanted the opposite. She was far more interested in doing things that would give us even less rights.

Who told you that?

So we voted Trump because it was the only choice when it comes to religious freedom.

You had no choice, hmm?

I would add the CT has leaned left over the last few years. They tend to post liberal sided articles now including articles that are essentially "White people bad! Feel bad if you're white!". No surprise they are against Trump.

They could also be against Donald because they're right... "right" as in correct, not politically "right," that is...

Here are some good quotes about whats wrong with CT's statement:
It’s true that this also speaks of disunity within our ranks. But where is it written that we must have political unity to be one in Christ? That we must have the same view of the president to stand together for the larger cause of the gospel?

This isn't about political unity, it's about moral unity. Is Donald a "good" person because he's been giving you what you want?

As I’ve said many times before, when we stand before God on that day, He will ask us what we have done with Jesus. Not what we have done with Trump. I’m aware, of course, of how the secular media will spin this. Galli’s editorial will be used to deepen the divide between us.

Indeed -- this editorial will be used to deepen the divide...

Trump Blasts Christian Magazine that Called for His Removal

Franklin Graham’s followers rage at his father’s magazine: ‘Christianity Today is an accomplice to the immoral left’

and look how quickly they're tossing Christianity Today aside, choosing instead to stand by Donald.

It will be used to make rejection of Trump a litmus test for true evangelical Christianity. (Ironically, in other circles, it is support of Trump that serves as a litmus test of one’s true faith.) It will be used to discourage evangelicals from voting for Trump, if not to shame them from voting for him.

It should be used to make rejection of sin a litmus test for true evangelical Christianity.

Vanity. Wrath. Greed. Lust. Envy. Gluttony. Sloth. A Christian is supposed to repent of their sins. What we've seen of Donald is that he revels in them... and encourages his followers to do likewise.

Any other president who did any of this would be (and has been) condemned as immoral... and rightly so. What makes Donald immune?

Tell the truth -- which of these sins has Donald not exemplified and profited from in his public life?

I agree with Galli that, under the current administration, there has been a dumbing down of the idea of morality. And it’s true that many evangelicals now wink at things that once grieved them, thankful to have a man like Trump who will stand up and fight (many would say, “Finally!”).

But that doesn’t mean we remove him for his alleged dumbing down of morality. It means we are careful not to lose our own morality in the process.

The stakes are very high, and our nation is dangerously divided. Let us be sure that, as God’s people, we do not follow suit.



If you look here on this forum, we indeed have come to that last thing he said.

And it is not for you or I to judge who has succeeded or failed in that regard.

All I can say is, Matthew 16:26 was supposed to be rhetorical. I hope we haven't found an answer.
 
Upvote 0

essentialsaltes

Stranger in a Strange Land
Oct 17, 2011
32,828
36,129
Los Angeles Area
✟820,798.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Legal Union (Other)
  • Agree
Reactions: john23237
Upvote 0

Handmaid for Jesus

You can't steal my joy
Supporter
Dec 19, 2010
25,583
32,975
enroute
✟1,395,850.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Others
In all fairness to the evangelicals, Donald did successfully portray himself as pro-America, anti-abortion, anti-immigrant, anti-Muslim, anti-liberal... so there was quite a bit for them to gain by his election.

Now, if I myself were a Christian, I would take the time to remind those Christians that when they face the final judgement, Jesus is not going to be interested in what they bought with thirty pieces of silver, only in what they sold to get them...

...but I'm no Christian; why should they care about my opinion? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yeah, well, he was very liberal before he decided he wanted to be President.He did not care about any of those things. Saying he did was a sham that some of us saw through.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

gym_class_hero

Well-Known Member
Dec 31, 2016
839
966
state of grace
✟122,069.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Because they could not abide by the rules for any officially recognized campus organization, such as allowing anyone to join who wanted to.
Not true. For example, the university of Iowa has been cited by the courts twice in the last year for discriminating against Christian student groups
 
Upvote 0

TLK Valentine

I've already read the books you want burned.
Apr 15, 2012
64,493
30,319
Behind the 8-ball, but ahead of the curve.
✟541,512.00
Country
United States
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Single
Yeah, well, he was very liberal before he decided he wanted to be President.He did not care about any of those things. Saying he did was a sham that some of us saw through.

That's why I said he portrayed himself as...

Now, it's certainly possible that his flip flops were legitimate; Donald might have had quite the "Road-to-Damascus" moment in his private time... who can say for certain?

A pity that whatever force caused his re-evaluation on those political issues left his views on greed, vanity, lust, and envy unchanged...
 
Upvote 0

bekkilyn

Contemplative Christian
Supporter
Apr 27, 2017
7,612
8,475
USA
✟677,608.00
Country
United States
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Celibate
Politics
US-Others
1. Why did they kick out Christian organizations?

2. Did they kick out Muslim and Jewish groups as well?

I could pretty much guarantee that it wasn't because they were Christian, but more than likely because they weren't allowed to be jerks in some way in the name of being Christian.

Hmm I wonder if there is an organization actually called "Jerks for Jesus"? Going to have to look that one up. :)
 
  • Haha
Reactions: john23237
Upvote 0

gym_class_hero

Well-Known Member
Dec 31, 2016
839
966
state of grace
✟122,069.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I could pretty much guarantee that it wasn't because they were Christian, but more than likely because they weren't allowed to be jerks in some way in the name of being Christian.

Hmm I wonder if there is an organization actually called "Jerks for Jesus"? Going to have to look that one up. :)
No one was banned for limiting their leadership to people who aligned with their views.
For second time this year, judge says University of Iowa violated Christian group's rights
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

NothingIsImpossible

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2015
5,615
3,254
✟274,922.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
To be fair I realize the bible says we will be hated, epecially in the end days. So I guess being annoyed at our mistreatment is sort of pointless. Just wish people would see christians are attacked way more then any other "religion". BTW I am not just talking now mind you, this was way before Trump came.

I also realize we don't have it as bad as christians do in other countries. Still....
 
Upvote 0

TLK Valentine

I've already read the books you want burned.
Apr 15, 2012
64,493
30,319
Behind the 8-ball, but ahead of the curve.
✟541,512.00
Country
United States
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Single
To be fair I realize the bible says we will be hated, epecially in the end days. So I guess being annoyed at our mistreatment is sort of pointless. Just wish people would see christians are attacked way more then any other "religion". BTW I am not just talking now mind you, this was way before Trump came.

I also realize we don't have it as bad as christians do in other countries. Still....

I'm sure the editors of Christianity Today were well aware of all of this... and they chose to publish regardless.
 
Upvote 0

bekkilyn

Contemplative Christian
Supporter
Apr 27, 2017
7,612
8,475
USA
✟677,608.00
Country
United States
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Celibate
Politics
US-Others
No one was banned for limiting their leadership to people who aligned with their views.
For second time this year, judge says University of Iowa violated Christian group's rights

While the University of Iowa may have decided to deregister the group due to disagreement over its stance on LGBTQ+, it did not at all deregister the group for being *Christian*.

To be fair I realize the bible says we will be hated, epecially in the end days. So I guess being annoyed at our mistreatment is sort of pointless. Just wish people would see christians are attacked way more then any other "religion". BTW I am not just talking now mind you, this was way before Trump came.

I also realize we don't have it as bad as christians do in other countries. Still....

That verse about Christians being hated is the typical verse cherry-picked out of scripture to justify terrible behavior. Christian acts like a jerk and gets called out on it, and then tries to counter with that verse, "Well of *course* we are hated..." when absolutely no real persecution is being done.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: john23237
Upvote 0

GACfan

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2019
1,958
2,257
Texas
✟77,930.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
That verse about Christians being hated is the typical verse cherry-picked out of scripture to justify terrible behavior. Christian acts like a jerk and gets called out on it, and then tries to counter with that verse, "Well of *course* we are hated..." when absolutely no real persecution is being done.

^ This. SMH because I've heard that lame excuse before.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

gym_class_hero

Well-Known Member
Dec 31, 2016
839
966
state of grace
✟122,069.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
While the University of Iowa may have decided to deregister the group due to disagreement over its stance on LGBTQ+, it did not at all deregister the group for being *Christian*.



That verse about Christians being hated is the typical verse cherry-picked out of scripture to justify terrible behavior. Christian acts like a jerk and gets called out on it, and then tries to counter with that verse, "Well of *course* we are hated..." when absolutely no real persecution is being done.
Ok, they deregistered them for following biblical principles
 
Upvote 0