Could the impeachment process cost the Dems among Independents?

Aldebaran

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*Despite his criminality.

A non-conviction is not the same as being totally innocent. There’s no reason to believe a party-line vote in the senate to exonerate Trump wouldn’t equally be motivated by political considerations.

Yeah, yeah, we've all heard it before about how a person who is not convicted is not the same as innocent. It's just a way of continuing to make a person prove their innocence even after going through the legal process, and thereby you ignore the legal process when it doesn't give you the results you desire.
 
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A_Thinker

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Yeah, yeah, we've all heard it before about how a person who is not convicted is not the same as innocent. It's just a way of continuing to make a person prove their innocence even after going through the legal process, and thereby you ignore the legal process when it doesn't give you the results you desire.
When you have jurors (i.e. Senators) who refuse to consider the evidence ... not convicted /= innocent ...

I'm glad Lindsey told us he was burying his head in the sand. That way, ... we have no illusions as to what's going on ...
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Yeah, yeah, we've all heard it before about how a person who is not convicted is not the same as innocent. It's just a way of continuing to make a person prove their innocence even after going through the legal process, and thereby you ignore the legal process when it doesn't give you the results you desire.
I can’t help it if Trump can win in an actual court but never does in the court of public opinion.
 
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Aldebaran

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I can’t help it if Trump can win in an actual court but never does in the court of public opinion.

And nobody can help it if the court of public opinion is more highly valued than an actual court is by some people.
 
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Aldebaran

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When you have jurors (i.e. Senators) who refuse to consider the evidence ... not convicted /= innocent ...

I'm glad Lindsey told us he was burying his head in the sand. That way, ... we have no illusions as to what's going on ...

Got a source for that quote?
 
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A_Thinker

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Aldebaran

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Did they ever request any who were relevant?

Relevant to what? Relevant to obtaining the goal of getting the president impeached? Relevance to serving one side of the story is the same as only allowing witnesses that testify for the accusers.
 
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Aldebaran

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iluvatar5150

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Relevant to what? Relevant to obtaining the goal of getting the president impeached? Relevance to serving one side of the story is the same as only allowing witnesses that testify for the accusers.

Relevant to determining whether or not Trump did anything improper.
 
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Aldebaran

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Relevant to determining whether or not Trump did anything improper.

Then witnesses called by the Republicans should have been allowed to be heard so that it could be determined. But since things were done as they were, Reps and Dems are going to vote along party lines because the hearings were done along party lines.
 
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straykat

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I consider myself an independent and I won't be voting for Dems at least (and probably not anyone else). I even voted for Hillary last time, despite not liking her. That should show just bad the current Democratic party is to me, where they've managed to be even more loathsome than she is. Or maybe.. they always were, and I shouldn't have even voted for her either.
 
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A_Thinker

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I consider myself an independent and I won't be voting for Dems at least (and probably not anyone else). I even voted for Hillary last time, despite not liking her. That should show just bad the current Democratic party is to me, where they've managed to be even more loathsome than she is. Or maybe.. they always were, and I shouldn't have even voted for her either.
Plenty good room in my Father's kingdom ...
 
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iluvatar5150

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Then witnesses called by the Republicans should have been allowed to be heard so that it could be determined. But since things were done as they were, Reps and Dems are going to vote along party lines because the hearings were done along party lines.

You didn’t answer my question. Did Republicans request any witnesses whose testimonies would have been relevant?
 
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Aldebaran

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You didn’t answer my question. Did Republicans request any witnesses whose testimonies would have been relevant?

We'll never know since they weren't allowed to present their testimonies.
 
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iluvatar5150

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We'll never know since they weren't allowed to present their testimonies.

Huh? You don’t know if somebody’s testimony is going to be relevant until they start testifying? You call random witnesses and just let things play out? Lol, that’s a good way to waste a lot of time and get some unpleasant surprises. Why don’t you and I testify? Maybe we have something relevant to say.
 
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Aldebaran

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Huh? You don’t know if somebody’s testimony is going to be relevant until they start testifying? You call random witnesses and just let things play out? Lol, that’s a good way to waste a lot of time and get some unpleasant surprises. Why don’t you and I testify? Maybe we have something relevant to say.

Tell me again which political party got to determine who was relevant and who wasn't.
 
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