God loves everyone?

BNR32FAN

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God who is perfectly Holy and Wise is going to save all that is possible for Him to save. I do not question His infinite wisdom. I trust His Holy , Wise plan. Do you?
he cannot save one more or one less, or His wisdom and plan which are perfect are called into question by rebel sinners.

If this is true then everyone must have the opportunity for salvation and they are condemned by their choice not God’s choice. It seems like you are saying
God chose those whom He foresaw would choose to repent which is not really predestination at all.
 
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BNR32FAN

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In reference to John 15:2

This is not dealing with salvation but rather sanctification.

How so? How does cutting someone off from Christ result in sanctification? I’m assuming this is in reference to 1 Corinthians where Paul tells the church to excommunicate the man who was sleeping with his father’s wife and turn him over to satan. But there’s no indication that the man did repent and return to the church. We don’t know.
 
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BNR32FAN

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God uses means, including warnings, discipline, direct commands and instructions, persecution , to conform us to the image of the Son.

Wouldn’t this make verse 6 a lie? If what you say is true then Jesus’ intent was to deceive his apostles into abiding in Him?
 
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A_Thinker

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If this is true then everyone must have the opportunity for salvation and they are condemned by their choice not God’s choice. It seems like you are saying
God chose those whom He foresaw would choose to repent which is not really predestination at all.
It is predestination ... using the determining factor of those who accept God's offer of salvation.

It is similar to a lifeguard guarding a swimming area. In this scenario, it is predestined that ONLY those who are savable by a lifeguard can be saved.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Gentiles are not to assume anything. Those jews who were broken off in unbelief , perished. God is able in future times to graft believing israelites back into the promises.

The Jews who were broken off did not perish. Paul says in verse 23 that God is able to graft them in again, indicating they were grafted in before.

“Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭11:22-23‬ ‭NASB‬‬

If they had not repented from their unbelief they would’ve perished. This indicates that a believer can fall to unbelief and lose his salvation if he does not repent and turn back to God.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Saved persons do not become unsaved. Not possible.
Professed believers who are not really saved can fall away from a false profession.

Then Paul’s warning to Children of God in Ephesians 5:1-6 is pointless.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Because continuance in the faith , is evidence of the faith,



If indeed! it is certain, not contingen

This is in reference to Colossians 1:22-23. But Paul says they are reconciled meaning they are justified by God. Can those who are not elected by God be justified?

“yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach- if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:22-23‬ ‭NASB‬‬
 
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Hammster

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It is predestination ... using the determining factor of those who accept God's offer of salvation.

It is similar to a lifeguard guarding a swimming area. In this scenario, it is predestined that ONLY those who are savable by a lifeguard can be saved.
Do the people the lifeguard is watching over deserve the wrath of the lifeguard?
 
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BNR32FAN

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It’s not inability, as if someone wants to but cannot. It’s that unregenerate
man has no affection to do so. That’s why we must be born again. The new heart is a new affection.

Does everyone have the ability to be born again?
 
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Hammster

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Perhaps the people who have swam out beyond the safety buoys ... deserve the wrath of the lifeguard who warned them not to ...
Why? What have they done to the lifeguard?

This is the problem with these analogies. They don’t take into consideration that we all deserve God’s wrath.
 
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Hammster

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He could but he gives US the choice.
So if He could, but doesn’t, how is that loving? It baffles me that the all-loving God you propose doesn’t love everyone enough to save them, since He can. He leaves it all up to us.
 
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ilovejcsog

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"So if He could, but doesn’t, how is that loving? It baffles me that the all-loving God you propose doesn’t love everyone enough to save them, since He can. He leaves it all up to us. "

He loves us enough to give us a choice. Why give them a choice then? You would love him more if he took away your choice. What would that make him? You sound like a Universalist. Is that love or even freedom if he takes away our choices to please himself, that is not love.
 
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ilovejcsog

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Okay. But why punish people just because He doesn’t get His way? Seems petty.
He is not punishing them they are responsible for their punishment. They have a choice that doesn't lead to any punishment but glory. Don't you know that humans are gluttons for punishment:)
 
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Hazelelponi

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I don't understand those who think we can know God - really know God to the limit of our humanity - and then say "nope, dont wanna worship you or be near you in eternity".

Like seriously, who would?

I don't think it's a stretch to say that when God lifts someone out of the sin they are dead in, and they open their eyes for the first time, they would love God, really love Him. We love God because He first loved us..

I don't understand those who really really think they'd just tell God off for choosing them to save...

I've seen the other side, and I'm not looking a gift horse in the mouth.
 
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