God loves everyone?

[BNR32FAN]

And is natural man inherently sinful or not, in your belief?

“But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by the so-called "Circumcision," which is performed in the flesh by human hands- remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:4-13‬ ‭NASB‬‬

 

[renniks]

No, you haven’t. If you had, you wouldn’t make straw man arguments.

Reformation Theology: Compatibilistic Determinism

Your own people confirm it.

 

[98cwitr]

“But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by the so-called "Circumcision," which is performed in the flesh by human hands- remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:4-13‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Sure. This speaks to conversion. I'm not sure of your point there. Just look at latter part of your quote there: "that formerly you..."

Would you have the respect for me, as I have previously shown you, to directly answer my question?

 

[Hammster]

“But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by the so-called "Circumcision," which is performed in the flesh by human hands- remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:4-13‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Yep. All God’s doing.

 

[Hammster]

Reformation Theology: Compatibilistic Determinism

Your own people confirm it.

The only time I found “programmed” was in a response.

 

[Strong in Him]

In my opinion if your in despair so that you take your life you never actually knew God..

I can only assume that you've never known true, clinical, depression or crushing despair; in which case, I'm glad for you. But many others have, and do, and it is not unknown for a Christian to feel suicidal, or even to act on that feeling.

sorry doesn't cut it,

Doesn't cut it with you; clearly.

faith is necessary.

If someone is crushingly depressed or in despair, they may not feel they have any faith or that God is even there. That doesn't mean they don't and he isn't - but that's what depression does to people.

 

[98cwitr]

Yes

Okay cool. Follow up if I may: Does a man have the nature will or ability to lead a sinless life?

 

[Hazelelponi]

I can only assume that you've never known true, clinical, depression or crushing despair; in which case, I'm glad for you. But many others have, and do, and it is not unknown for a Christian to feel suicidal, or even to act on that feeling.



Doesn't cut it with you; clearly.



If someone is crushingly depressed or in despair, they may not feel they have any faith or that God is even there. That doesn't mean they don't and he isn't - but that's what depression does to people.

I've felt defeated, and been in crushing despair not knowing what to do..

but when we reflect, we realize we must grab hold of faith like our lives depend on it, (because it does) and we do this because we know God. Because we have seen Him at work and realize our lack of faith is piddling and petty and it demonstrates a fault in our belief, our trust of God because we have known a trustworthy God who has never let us down...

If you know God, you will end up like Peter, but if you don't know God you end up like Judas.

This is not me being judgemental, the Bible tells us what was the end of both, and we saw it played out..Peter was full of despair too, but their actions in that state were different, Peter went to God, Judas took his life. Peter was forgiven, Judas is known in Scripture as a son of perdition..

 

[renniks]

The only time I found “programmed” was in a response.

There's no way around the conclusion that if everything is caused by God's decree, you are just fulfilling your role. Most important, logically, it makes God the author of sin.

 

[98cwitr]

There's no way around the conclusion that if everything is caused by God's decree, you are just fulfilling your role. Most important, logically, it makes God the author of sin.

Thoughts on Isaiah 45:7 please.

 

[Hammster]

There's no way around the conclusion that if everything is caused by God's decree, you are just fulfilling your role. Most important, logically, it makes God the author of sin.

If that’s how you want to misconstrue it, my experience is that there’s nothing I can do to change your mind.

 

[A_Thinker]

I've felt defeated, and been in crushing despair not knowing what to do..

Even Elijah, the great warrior prophet of God felt crushing despair, ... so much so that he sought an end to his living ...

1 Kings 19

3 And Elijah was afraid and ran for his life. When he came to Beersheba in Judah, he left his servant there, 4 while he himself traveled on a day’s journey into the wilderness. He sat down under a broom tree and prayed that he might die. “I have had enough, LORD,” he said. “Take my life, for I am no better than my fathers.”

It was God Who came to his rescue ...

5 Then he lay down under the broom tree and fell asleep.

Suddenly an angel touched him and said, “Get up and eat.”

6 And he looked around, and there by his head was a cake of bread baked over hot coals, and a jar of water. So he ate and drank and lay down again.

7 A second time the angel of the LORD returned and touched him, saying, “Get up and eat, or the journey will be too much for you.”

8 So he got up and ate and drank. And strengthened by that food, he walked forty days and forty nights until he reached Horeb, the mountain of God.

If you know God, you will end up like Peter, but if you don't know God you end up like Judas.

God made the difference. Those who know God will ultimately be delivered ... according to God's will and in His timing ...

 

[renniks]

Thoughts on Isaiah 45:7 please.

A better interpretation is I"create calamity or disaster".. and specifically it's in regard to Israel's judgment. It has nothing to do with God creating moral evil, that would contradict numerous verses and passages. For example, God said it never entered his mind that his people would sacrifice children to idols.

 

[renniks]

If that’s how you want to misconstrue it, my experience is that there’s nothing I can do to change your mind.

It's not misconstruing, it's the logical conclusion of the theology.

 

[Hammster]

It's not misconstruing, it's the logical conclusion of the theology.

Well, it’s the logical conclusion of your straw man, I’ll give you that.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Are we not His disciples?

Of course

 

[BNR32FAN]

I’ll help you out.

Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
— Romans 8:1-8

Pleasing God and believing are two different things entirely.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Understand I lived the first 25 years of my life as a rather militant atheist. I knew that if I had any faith, what I was doing was sinful, thus a product of my sinful nature, but rejected Christian theology entirely. I Would say the best way to put my conversion to faith was the working of the Holy Spirit to first acknowledge the existence of God, then to learn of Him, then to struggle with Him, then to find peace within Him.

We’re you born again and became a new creation before you believed?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Okay cool. Follow up if I may: Does a man have the nature will or ability to lead a sinless life?

No

 

[BNR32FAN]

Sure. This speaks to conversion. I'm not sure of your point there. Just look at latter part of your quote there: "that formerly you..."

Would you have the respect for me, as I have previously shown you, to directly answer my question?

Sorry I’m still at work, yes man is sinful in his natural state.