Dayton shooter was pro antifa

[Ana the Ist]

I'm not so dismissive of the dangers of white supremacy though - two dozen killed by hateful ideology is two dozen too many. Furthermore, violence aside, people seem to be more willing to express racist and white supremacist views openly, and I can't see that as anything but bad for our country.

People express the same views as the Dayton shooter openly...calling anyone who disagrees with them racists and nazis. I've even seen people on this forum express the view that Biden and Bernie have "had their time"....

Is it time to push back on all the leftists who use such extreme language?

 

[RocksInMyHead]

Is it time to push back on all the leftists who use such extreme language?

By all means, push away. Calling someone a racist or Nazi simply because they disagree with you isn't helpful to the conversation. Not sure what the bit about Biden and Sanders is supposed to mean though.

 

[David Kent]

Then I won't bother telling you that the invasion has been going on for just as long as the perceived "prejudice".

The invasion has beeg going on since Cloumbus invaded the New World, and you are part of that invasion.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Oh, you call it an invasion too, huh. I won’t bother correcting you.

It meets the definition of invasion. If you want to say that it's dangerous rhetoric, I'd agree....just like certain recent uses of "concentration camps".

 

[Ana the Ist]

By all means, push away. Calling someone a racist or Nazi simply because they disagree with you isn't helpful to the conversation. Not sure what the bit about Biden and Sanders is supposed to mean though.

He posted similar sentiments about wanting to see their generation "die off".

 

[Albion]

I'm not so dismissive of the dangers of white supremacy though - two dozen killed by hateful ideology is two dozen too many.

I find that interesting since it is the exact opposite of the argument used about illegal aliens. They kill far more people and are not even our citizens, but we are told that it doesn't matter since that's only a minority of the people who aren't supposed to be here.

Furthermore, violence aside, people seem to be more willing to express racist and white supremacist views openly, and I can't see that as anything but bad for our country.

I have NO idea where you'd get an idea like that one, not after the anti-Wall Street encampment, the various riots and beatings inflicted by masked Antifa thugs, etc. etc. By comparison, how many Nazi-uniformed demonstrators have marched in your city??

And that's only overt activity. A dozen Democrat candidates for president are slinging around terms like racist, white supremacists, white nationalists, and worse. In fact, just being white or someone who is likely to vote Republican will qualify you for inclusion on the hit list of some of these folks.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

I find that interesting since it is the exact opposite of the argument used about illegal aliens. They kill far more people and are not even our citizens, but we are told that it doesn't matter since that's only a minority of the people who aren't supposed to be here.

Not the same thing. Illegal immigration doesn't drive people to violence - that would be gang membership, drugs, etc.

I have NO idea where you'd get an idea like that one, not after the anti-Wall Street encampment, the various riots and beatings inflicted by masked Antifa thugs, etc. etc. By comparison, how many Nazi-uniformed demonstrators have marched in your city??

A) One does not preclude the other. In fact, the increase in Antifa is an effect of the increase in white supremacist and fascist rhetoric - Antifa tends to swell in response to a perception in the increase of fascism (which, in the US, tends to go hand-in-hand with white supremacy). Were there no fascists to be against, Antifa would be much less noticeable. Of course, I'm sure that the white supremacists also increase their numbers because Antifa is growing, so it's a bit of a self-perpetuating cycle, but it's totally false to state that white supremacy can't be on the rise because Antifa is around.

B) You do recall Charlottesville, right? While I haven't seen anything quite on that scale near me, I have seen multiple rallies put on by groups that associate themselves with White Nationalism. Nationwide, there have been plenty of instances of violence by white supremacists, white nationalists, and other associate far-right organizations.

And that's only overt activity. A dozen Democrat candidates for president are slinging around terms like racist, white supremacists, white nationalists, and worse. In fact, just being white or someone who is likely to vote Republican will qualify you for inclusion on the hit list of some of these folks.

Simply using the terms "racist, white supremacists, white nationalists" isn't inflammatory in and of itself. Calling a spade a spade is simply telling the truth. There are definitely some who take it too far though, and they are also problematic for the health of the country.

 

[Albion]

Not the same thing. Illegal immigration doesn't drive people to violence - that would be gang membership, drugs, etc.

NO murders or murderers are acceptable.

A) One does not preclude the other.

Does not preclude... In theory, you mean. I was referring to the facts of the matter, what actually happens.

In fact, the increase in Antifa is an effect of the increase in white supremacist and fascist rhetoric - Antifa tends to swell in response to a perception in the increase of fascism

Do stop. That's what someone who is making up excuses on the fly might say.

Antifa is a well-organized outfit which was active even before World War II and portrays anyone who isn't a Marxist as a Fascist.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

NO murders or murderers are acceptable.

Agreed. However, condemning white supremacy because white supremacists killed people over white supremacist ideology is not equivalent to condemning illegal immigration because some illegal immigrants killed people over drugs, gangs, or other non-illegal-immigrant-related reasons.

Does not preclude... In theory, you mean. I was referring to the facts of the matter, what actually happens.

What facts? You said that white supremacism can't be on the rise because of Occupy Wall Street (that was what, eight years ago?) and Antifa. How does that follow? Can I say that there's no such thing as red because blue is a color?

Do stop. That's what someone who is making up excuses on the fly might say.
Antifa is a well-organized outfit which was active even before World War II and portrays anyone who isn't a Marxist as a Fascist.

Antifa organized? Really? I'm sure they have a long-standing hardcore anarcho-communist core that may or may not be organized, but people rush to join or associate themselves with the organization when they perceive a rise in fascism. Those crowds of "Antifa" that you see at demonstrations mainly fall into that second category, and the extent of their "organization" is spreading the word about a counter-protest, buying matching ski masks, and maybe ordering a flag off the internet.

 

[Albion]

Simply using the terms "racist, white supremacists, white nationalists" isn't inflammatory in and of itself. Calling a spade a spade is simply telling the truth.

In that case it is inflammatory.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

In that case it is inflammatory.

If calling a racist a racist when they are objectively so is inflammatory to you, perhaps you need to stop and take a hard look at your beliefs.

At any rate, I think we're getting off-topic here.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

Doing a mass shooting doesn't in and of itself mean your political views are wrong. You can agree with someone's political views without owning everything he does.

 

[Belk]

They were busy obeying the "gun free zone" signs. That's what it means to be a law abiding citizen.

A "gun free zone" sign.... at a Walmart.... in Texas....


Sure.

 

[Aldebaran]

The invasion has beeg going on since Cloumbus invaded the New World, and you are part of that invasion.

The New World wasn't a sovereign nation with posted laws to follow.

 

[Aldebaran]

Oh, you call it an invasion too, huh. I won’t bother correcting you.

No correction needed. It's a fact.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

It’s also a fact these were Hispanic lands long before the Anglo-north Americans invaded.

 

[Aldebaran]

It’s also a fact these were Hispanic lands long before the Anglo-north Americans invaded.

Was it a sovereign nation at that time?

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Was it a sovereign nation at that time?

Is that the requirement for it to be an invasion?

 

[Aldebaran]

Is that the requirement for it to be an invasion?

Correct. Just as a home isn't being invaded by anyone if it's not even owned by anyone.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Correct. Just as a home isn't being invaded by anyone if it's not even owned by anyone.

Just because no ones there to defend the house doesn’t mean it doesn’t belong to anyone.

And all of this is getting away from the point that the shooter was fearful of an “Hispanic invasion of Texas” but there is no Hispanic invasion. Hispanics have lived in that region for the entire existence of Texas and the United States.