At least 9 dead, 26 injured in mass shooting in downtown Dayton, Ohio

[OldWiseGuy]

I think it has more to do with lack of a quality screening process.

Even when comparing ourselves to other first world countries with more permissive gun laws (though, I know the list is fairly short), we're still the standout when it comes to the frequency for which this occurs.

If you compare the US with the Czech Republic, it's an eye opener.

They, like us, allow ownership of handguns, shotguns, semi-auto rifles, etc...
They, like us, have "shall-issue" concealed carry permits.
They, like us, have roughly 3% of the population having said CCW permits
Interesting additional notes
They actually have a more permissive CCW system...they don't have gun free zones (you can carry in your kid's school if you're picking them up) and they have universal reciprocity among their administrative districts as where in the US, there are some states that you can't go to with your home state's permit.

What they do have, that we don't, is a thorough vetting process that acts as an "upstream check" before someone reaches "gun owner" status that involves extensive training, education, and clean bill of mental health from their physician.

The outcome is, a nation where you can pack heat, but that has only 1/5 the homicide rate (per capita) that we do, and a fraction of a percent of the mass shooting events.

Screening works when done properly. Even in the states that do enforce background checks, the FBI/NICS background check process is weak. There's no mandate for training required, there's no test to pass, and the only time a mental illness disqualifies you is if you've ever been involuntarily committed to an institution by a judge via court order.

Theoretically, a person with bipolar disorder can easily pass the background check in the majority of cases.

What are the qualifiers/disqualifiers in the Czech Republic that account for their low gun crime rate?

 

[Not David]

Everyone repeats gun control yet no one seems to explain the specific details how it would had prevented it in those situations.

 

[SummerMadness]

Yes and no to mass shootings happening every day. Most sources define a mass shooting as four or more people killed OR injured. Yes, there is probably somewhere in the U.S. where that happens every day, but not all of those really fit what is covered.

As to taking guns into God's house yes I support that partly because bad guys do.

Four or more people killed or injured is a lot. I think considering that definition a problem speaks to the broader issue of the new normal. You don't need 500 shot and 70 dead for it to be a mass shooting. We've seen this problem with genocide too where some believe millions need to die in order for it to be considered genocide.

I think the other issue is labeling things as good guys and bad guys, we're all just people, and some of us do bad things with guns. Good guy with a gun is nothing more than a gun lover's fantasy.

 

[dogs4thewin]

Everyone repeats gun control yet no one seems to explain the specific details how it would had prevented it in those situations.

They think that if we had gun control people would not get guns false. Most of these are committed by people who either A got the gun illegally anyway, or people who got from someone who would pass a check. Very few if any of these attacks are committed by people of sound mind with their own lawfully held firearms.

 

[DamianWarS]

It will take a well regulated militia. They need to keep guns out of the hands of people that are not trained to use them for good and not evil.

I live in a country where handguns are restricted and semis are banned... we also don't have mass shootings. sometimes the most obvious answer is the right answer (even if you don't like it)

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Or you could change the drug laws and end the failed war on drugs.

I agree that death by drug overdose is less messy than gunshot death. Although I believe there would still be a competitive illegal drug trade with the same violent results.

I do agree that all drugs should be legal however. And that users should bear full responsibility for the results of their use. It would be a good way to identify the morally weak and irresponsible in our society. Of course once identified they would not be able to purchase or own guns. This would reduce gun violence.

 

[SummerMadness]

https://everytownresearch.org/reports/mass-shootings-analysis/

This group has analyzed a few factors that can be addressed, yet they are not. Remember, it's more about reduction than eliminating, which is likely impossible.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I live in a country where handguns are restricted and semis are banned... we also don't have mass shootings. sometimes the most obvious answer is the right answer (even if you don't like it)

Our duck hunters wouldn't like that (most other game can be taken with single action weapons).

 

[dogs4thewin]

I live in a country where handguns are restricted and semis are banned... we also don't have mass shootings. sometimes the most obvious answer is the right answer (even if you don't like it)

Yet people who mean harm find a way and just as a note remember there are literally about as many guns in this country as there are people and most of those guns are NEVER used to commit a violent crime.

 

[bèlla]

yup sometimes I wonder what would happen if they did not make a big deal out of mass shootings. Not in the sense that it is not a big deal, but in the sense that there is not coverage ( except for local coverage and of course telling the families of any victims ( whether that particular victim is killed or not).

They inspire unstable people to act who’d do the same without encouragement.

I remember an episode of Criminal Minds. It’s the lone one I’ve watched. A school bus filled with children was abducted and placed in a simulated video game. Except the danger and bullets were real.

My grandmother made a similar remark. She felt it should not have been aired due to the likelihood it would encourage the same. I believe most of our entertainment is inspired by real events with a few modifications.

Our sin has made us sick. We can’t get well on our own.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

https://everytownresearch.org/reports/mass-shootings-analysis/

This group has analyzed a few factors that can be addressed, yet they are not. Remember, it's more about reduction than eliminating, which is likely impossible.

The only way to effectively reduce it is by armed security personnel on site.

 

[bèlla]

Chicago has mass killings nearly every weekend. And worse, there are multiple killers.

Chicago has mass killings in some neighborhoods. The majority aren’t violent, poor, or gang and drug infested. When you add that to the mix bad things happen.

 

[dogs4thewin]

The only way to effectively reduce it is by armed security personnel on site.

Which of course would cost money and maybe freak people out.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Chicago has mass killings in some neighborhoods. The majority aren’t violent, poor, or gang and drug infested. When you add that to the mix bad things happen.

Check out the map in this story.

9 Killed, 39 Wounded In Weekend Shootings Across Chicago

 

[Desk trauma]

I agree that death by drug overdose is less messy than gunshot death. Although I believe there would still be a competitive illegal drug trade with the same violent results.

Just like how the alcohol market could never fully be brought back from the violent criminal organizations that controlled it during prohibition and liquor distribution deals frequently end in gun fire. Oh, wait, that didn't happen and illegal alcohol is a fraction of percent of the market...

 

[mama2one]

this is horrible for all the communities where this is happening

 

[inquiring mind]

It doesn’t have anything to do with our laws, processes, or the number of guns... we just have a lot of ‘nuts’ here.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Just like how the alcohol market could never fully be brought back from the violent criminal organizations that controlled it during prohibition and liquor distribution deals frequently end in gun fire. Oh, wait, that didn't happen and illegal alcohol is a fraction of percent of the market...

If legally produced liquor were expensive you can bet there would be an illegal source. Booze of all kinds is cheap here, one of the great blessings of American free enterprise.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

this is horrible for all the communities where this is happening

said to husband this week, maybe we should get vests to wear when going out in public
think some kid's backpacks are now being made that can be used as a shield (need to look into that)


when we attended a big group event a few years ago, told husband if there was shooting to grab our child's hand and run and don't worry about me

I'm guessing he didn't take that very well.

 

[Desk trauma]

If legally produced liquor were expensive you can bet there would be an illegal source. Booze of all kinds is cheap here, one of the great blessings f American free enterprise.

The inflated prices of illegal drugs are products of prohibition.