Before you can follow Jesus

yeshuaslavejeff

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Apart from the debate about Christians and wealth, the OP said that we have to give up our wealth before we can follow Jesus. Implication, we have to DO something to be able to follow Jesus; those who don't have any wealth presumably won't be able to become a disciple, ditto those who are homeless, sick, poor etc.
sorry it seems so confusing.
actually it is simple ...

everyone has their own will (which must be given up),
their own dreams (which must be given up),
their own family (which must be given up),
their old friends (which must be given up),
their own careers (which must be given up),
their own job (which must be given up),
their own achievements (which must be given up),
their own talents (which must be given up) ,
their own minds (which must be given up),
their own emotions and feelings (which must be given up),
their own home/house/place they stay (which must be given up),
their own plans (which must be given up),
their own bodies (which must be given up) ,
their own education (which must be given up),
their own doctrines(of man and demons) which must be given up,
their own religion (which must be given up) ,
their own knowledge (which must be given up),
their own future and past (which must be given up) ....
et al,
as written ....
 
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RaymondG

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When Christ came to me and later was truly born again, I wanted to give everything away. However, my wife was not where I was at that time. I gave away something of value and she retrieved it. Since in marriage two become one, that was her right. However, I definitely understand what it feels like to want to give away all of your belongings. You absolutely know that Christ has you and that you will be taken care of. That does not mean that you can sit on your tail and expect your needs to fall from Heaven. It is a joyful time when you absolutely know Christ and what Born Again really means.
How did it make you feel to give away your belonging? What did you gain from doing so? And if you felt burdened by the things you had, why would it be good to place that burden on another?
 
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Strong in Him

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sorry it seems so confusing.
actually it is simple ...

everyone has their own will (which must be given up),
their own dreams (which must be given up),
their own family (which must be given up),
their old friends (which must be given up),
their own careers (which must be given up),
their own job (which must be given up),
their own achievements (which must be given up),
their own talents (which must be given up) ,
their own minds (which must be given up),
their own emotions and feelings (which must be given up),
their own home/house/place they stay (which must be given up),
their own plans (which must be given up),
their own bodies (which must be given up) ,
their own education (which must be given up),
their own doctrines(of man and demons) which must be given up,
their own religion (which must be given up) ,
their own knowledge (which must be given up),
their own future and past (which must be given up) ....

That's not simple.
Are you saying that when people become Christians they have to give up their talents; stop using the gifts that God has given them, just because they've just realised that it WAS God who gave them to them?
Are you saying that people should give up their job, because they got it when they weren't a Christian and therefore didn't pray about it?
Should I, as a teenager, and left school and given up on my exams - I did try - in order to stay at home, sponge off Mum and Dad until God showed me what to do and how to serve him; difficult if I had no exams.
Should I, when I was old enough, have said to my parents "you can't be real Christians otherwise you would have sold this house and we'd all be sleeping in cardboard boxes"?
How does someone give up knowledge - how do you un-know something?
How does someone give up their past?
How does someone give up their feelings?
Where are we told we have to give up our old friends, and these other things too?

We can certainly place them into God's hands, release our grip on them, stop putting them first or making them the sole focus of our lives - seek ye first the Kingdom of God. But where are we told to give everything up and become homeless, hungry, friendless, talentless and poor?
 
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Carl Emerson

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If Jesus (you know, God!) gives a command, it’s law. I don’t know how else to explain it.

OK understood, what we need to know then is, if Jesus was requiring the rich man to sell all he had in order to be follower - was this a requirement for anyone wanting to be a follower?
 
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Wordkeeper

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And who do you think is going to provide the money for missions, the church, to feed the hungry and find the homeless shelter if we do?
Indeed, if we give up ALL our money, we will soon become one of those who relies on others for help. Other people - probably non Christians - would have to feed our families, and so on.
This is good advice, but it is based on a rationalistic principle. Rationalists say nothing is true unless it can be proved.

However, spiritual matters transcend reason. When we say turn away from hoarding and protecting life preserving resources because that activity harms others, although that is how the natural world functions, we are living by our beliefs, the belief that God exists, and He wants us to live that way, acknowledging He exists and will ensure His Way is life preserving, not life threatening.

Else there is no difference between Christians and unbelievers.
 
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Hammster

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OK understood, what we need to know then is, if Jesus was requiring the rich man to sell all he had in order to be follower - was this a requirement for anyone wanting to be a follower?

I think this helps.

Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”
— Mark 1:14-15
 
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JIMINZ

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OK understood, what we need to know then is, if Jesus was requiring the rich man to sell all he had in order to be follower - was this a requirement for anyone wanting to be a follower?

That is where it becomes a little sticky, people (Christians) pick and choose what it is the want to follow, (believe) when there are things which make them appear to be special, then what has been written is surely to be believed as meaning all Believers of all time.
 
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Wordkeeper

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Apart from the debate about Christians and wealth, the OP said that we have to give up our wealth before we can follow Jesus. Implication, we have to DO something to be able to follow Jesus; those who don't have any wealth presumably won't be able to become a disciple, ditto those who are homeless, sick, poor etc.
Non sequitor. The correct way to explain this situation is: poor people should be proud because God made them poor, recognising they had the strength to give up the little they had, and their poverty was His way of recognising that fact. Rich people were recognised as not having the strength to give up their wealth, so they were made rich, acknowledging that they would have to depend on God to remove whatever it was that prevented them from entering the Kingdom.

James 1
9Believers in humble circumstances ought to take pride in their high position. 10But the rich should take pride in their humiliation—since they will pass away like a wild flower.11For the sun rises with scorching heat and withers the plant; its blossom falls and its beauty is destroyed. In the same way, the rich will fade away even while they go about their business.

Matthew 19
26But Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
 
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Wordkeeper

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That's not simple.
Are you saying that when people become Christians they have to give up their talents; stop using the gifts that God has given them, just because they've just realised that it WAS God who gave them to them?
Are you saying that people should give up their job, because they got it when they weren't a Christian and therefore didn't pray about it?
Should I, as a teenager, and left school and given up on my exams - I did try - in order to stay at home, sponge off Mum and Dad until God showed me what to do and how to serve him; difficult if I had no exams.
Should I, when I was old enough, have said to my parents "you can't be real Christians otherwise you would have sold this house and we'd all be sleeping in cardboard boxes"?
How does someone give up knowledge - how do you un-know something?
How does someone give up their past?
How does someone give up their feelings?
Where are we told we have to give up our old friends, and these other things too?

We can certainly place them into God's hands, release our grip on them, stop putting them first or making them the sole focus of our lives - seek ye first the Kingdom of God. But where are we told to give everything up and become homeless, hungry, friendless, talentless and poor?

Quote
But where are we told to give everything up and become homeless, hungry, friendless, talentless and poor?


;)

Matthew 8
18Now when Jesus saw a crowd around Him, He gave orders to depart to the other side of the sea. 19Then a scribe came and said to Him, “Teacher, I will follow You wherever You go.” 20Jesus said to him, “The foxes have holes and the birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay His head.”
 
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Wordkeeper

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I think this helps.

Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”
— Mark 1:14-15
C'mon Hammster, don't mince words, pull your finger out, say it like it is.

Luke 14
33“So then, none of you can be My disciple (follower) who does not give up all his own possessions.
 
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