If you keep sinning after you are saved are you still saved?

[Hammster]

After that last very unfounded accusation, along with trying to make sure everyone knows I did bad, when anyone can see I did nothing, I'm thinking it's a good time for a cool down. Another time, maybe.

Well, everyone can see that I showed how you incorrectly used scripture. So if you want to bow out, that’s fine. It beats having to keep making the same corrections over and over.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Well, everyone can see that I showed how you incorrectly used scripture. So if you want to bow out, that’s fine. It beats having to keep making the same corrections over and over.

They can also see I've not responded thoroughly to all your accusations and for good reason. but if you wan to take that as you must be right, go for it.

No need in all that, I can see clearly exactly what happened, and of course you are going to disagree, and just as times past, that doesn't necessarily mean any one is right or wrong, especially since we haven't even covered it yet due to my break. I mean don't get ahead of yourself. My taking a break from your posts, of which I'll have no problem whatsoever answering to, will also keep me for having to constantly ask you to play fair and answer the questions you insist on skipping, while making a mountain out of a nothing that I did.

So yeah, a break is good. You may have the last word.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Typical adolescent response a number of us have come to expect of you.

Does that mean you can or cannot show me/prove what you accused me of? Who didn't see that coming. Oh, and not a single answer to the questions proving you wrong, just an empty claim with nothing to back it up? I'll show you, what exactly, and in detail was adolescent about my post? Now watch what happens, and I'M the adolescent?

I love these boards.

 

[bcbsr]

Does that mean you can or cannot show me/prove what you accused me of? Who didn't see that coming. Oh, and not a single answer to the questions proving you wrong, just an empty claim with nothing to back it up? I'll show you, what exactly, and in detail was adolescent about my post? Now watch what happens, and I'M the adolescent?

I love these boards.

It's right there in post #338.

 

[Kenny'sID]

It's right there in post #338.

That tells me nothing, Do I really have to say it again...be clear on what you mean.


And BTW, in case some of you think I enjoy saying what I do about the way you are acting, I don't. I'm only trying yo make you see what exactly it is you are doing by not answering questions to help you to one day stop making accusations that bring on such questions. Understand?

It's really is so you don't get yourself into such predicaments with false accusations, as well as because i don't like having to do all the extra typing in order to constantly defend against false accusations.

 

[Hammster]

It's right there in post #338.

It is. And I see he didn’t even address your argument. Just a sentence. He did that to me, also. I guess that’s a tactic that looks a reply, but isn’t.

 

[Kenny'sID]

It is. And I see he didn’t even address your argument. Just a sentence. He did that to me, also. I guess that’s a tactic that looks a reply, but isn’t.

Are you now trying to make trouble? Did I not flat out say I need clarification? If, of course it's ok with you, I'll wait for that clarification.

I'd suggest you all come up with better arguments...resorting to empty accusation which any one can see I was bombarded with today is, well, people just aren't going to buy that as defense, and it may tell them something else altogether.

 

[Hammster]

Are you now trying to make trouble? Did I not flat out say I need clarification? If, of course it's ok with you, I'll wait for that clarification.

I'd suggest you all come up with better arguments...resorting to empty accusation which any one can see I was bombarded with today is, well, people just aren't going to buy that as defense, and it may tell them something else altogether.

I showed how you abused 1 Corinthians 6. Your reply was that you didn’t want to keep the discussion going.

 

[d taylor]

These two terms.

Entering the Kingdom and inheriting the Kingdom are used in the Bible, but they do not carry the same meaning.

To understand salvation and rewards for the believer. The key is understanding the difference between entering the Kingdom of God and inheriting the Kingdom of God.

To enter the Kingdom is only accomplished by faith,belief,trust. Believing that Jesus is the promised Messiah from Old Testament prophecies and trusting in The Messiah for His gift of His eternal life.

Inheriting the Kingdom of God is accomplished by a well lived Christ served life by the believe and involves receiving rewards in the Kingdom of God.

A person enters through a door in a room, a person does not inherit through a door into a room.

Same for going to heaven a believer enters into heaven, a believer does not inherit into heaven.

 

[dcalling]

If you keep sinning after yoluve been saved are you still saved? Jesus promises in John 6:37-40 to not lose one single believer but do believers continue to sin after they've been saved? Like for example say you're caught in the same set of sins are you still saved? Even if you cannot stop doing those same sins over and over again? Like say you like to use Christs name in vain a lot or if you swear a lot or if you're stuck in one particular sin is that person still given to Jesus by God the Father and eternally secure?

It reminded me again why Christianity is the most simple and most complex in the world.

We are not God and we are not perfect, and we will keep sinning.
On the other hand God's grace is irresistible, whoever He wants to save will be saved, and the power of Jesus' blood will wash the faithful clean even when our sin are so red.
And that is why to thank God, we have to keep repent and doing His work.

 

[Contenders Edge]

If you keep sinning after yoluve been saved are you still saved? Jesus promises in John 6:37-40 to not lose one single believer but do believers continue to sin after they've been saved? Like for example say you're caught in the same set of sins are you still saved? Even if you cannot stop doing those same sins over and over again? Like say you like to use Christs name in vain a lot or if you swear a lot or if you're stuck in one particular sin is that person still given to Jesus by God the Father and eternally secure?

Even after salvation through Christ, we will still continue to sin and fall short of the glory of God, but that is why our salvation is grace-based and not works-based. The Apostle Paul describes this struggle in Romans 7:14-25 despite his life being transformed by Christ.

Our thoughts will not always be pure. We will not always treat others the way we should. Our words will not always be pure and wholesome. We may even still tell a white lie on occasion that we think to be of no consequence. We may even still be led astray at times by lies. There will always be some high place in our life that is not taken down.

But when we receive Christ into our lives to be our Savior and submit our lives to him, our lives are supposed to experience a transformation that makes us different than before in how we live our lives, our interests and priorities, and our way of thinking.

As we grow in the Lord, our lives are to become more reflective of who our Lord is and less of what we were before we came to Him. There is a common saying that states: “God does not expect you to be sinless, but He does expect you to sin less.” Now, as long as we live in these inherently corrupt mortal bodies, we will always sin one way or another, no matter how hard we try to do that which is right in the eyes of God, but our sin should be less routine than it was before we came to Christ.

When we give ourselves to Christ, there are sins that will not be hard to stop and changes for the better that will seem easy to make, and then there will be those sinful habits that will die hard and as to what sins will die hard is different for everyone.

But if you are still routinely doing the same things from which you should have turned away when you received Christ to be your Savior and Lord, the scripture gives a dreadful warning that we all do well to heed:


“For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.” (Heb. 10:26-27)


What it comes down to is your attitude towards Christ and how you value the grace by which you are saved. Do you treat the grace by which you were saved as something cheap, or do you strive to live your life in a way that expresses just how precious the gift of grace is and how grateful you are for the salvation that you have received.

The Bible says that there has been no temptation that overtakes anyone that others have not experienced and that God will not allow testing beyond what we can bear, but will always make a way of escape. (1 Cor. 10:13)

To say otherwise is to call God a liar. It all comes down to this: Do you want to stop sinning or not? If you wish to stop doing those things that you did before you got saved, you will not do them. You will find a way to stop and if you desire to conduct yourself and live a life pleasing in God’s sight, you will ask His help and rely on Hid guidance. And even if there are certain sins with which you struggle, you will at the very least not do anything to give any strength to those sins but instead will stay away from those things that strengthen the sinful nature that we all struggle with and you will not seek after those things that might cause you to yield to those sins with which you struggle.

If you struggle with lust, you will not seek after inappropriate contentography or watch any cinema that frequently depicts lewdness and intense sexual content. You will not play any video games featuring the same.

If you struggle with profanity, you should want to keep away from you will not want to listen to or watch anything with profanity laced content.

If you have struggled with drunkenness, you will want to stay away from those places that serve alcoholic beverages.

If you have struggled with drug addictions, again, you will not want to go to drug infested places.

The list goes on.

The scripture says that if we confess our sins, God is faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. (1 Jn. 1:9) You would also do well to examine yourself and determine as to whether or not you really are of the faith (2 Cor. 3:15) and if you find that you might not be, repent with all sincerity lest you find yourself condemned by the one you claim to be your Lord.

 

[Concord1968]

Are you saying we cannot do good?

Rom 3:10-12 as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”

Every thought, word, and deed that you have and do every second of every day including just drawing breath is a damnable sin. Because you can't do it out of a perfect love of God. No one ever has except for Jesus. We are saved by Grace in spite of our utter sinfulness. If our works are added to it it's no longer Grace.

 

[Hammster]

Let me throw this in here, and maybe clear up some confusion.

Those of us who believe that we are justified by faith alone do not believe that we can just believe and be done with it. What we are saying is that we cannot work towards being more righteous in God’s sight. But we can work on being more holy. We can be mortifying sin in our lives, and as such live lives pleasing to God. But that in no way affects our standing. Our standing is in Christ, and if we are in Him, God declares us as righteous.

 

[eleos1954]

On the other hand Paul says, "Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. Meanwhile we groan, longing to be clothed with our heavenly dwelling, because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked.
4 For while we are in this tent, we groan and are burdened, because we do not wish to be unclothed but to be clothed with our heavenly dwelling, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. Now it is God who has made us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come. Therefore we are always confident and know that as long as we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord. We live by faith, not by sight. We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. So we make it our goal to please him, whether we are at home in the body or away from it." 2Cor 5:1-9

Likewise he says, "If I am to go on living in the body, this will mean fruitful labor for me. Yet what shall I choose? I do not know! I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far; but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body." Php 1:22,24

***


1 Timothy 6
16 He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.

Now it is God who has made us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come

2nd Corinthians 2

4 For indeed while we are in this tent, we groan, being burdened, because we do not want to be unclothed but to be clothed, so that what is mortal will be swallowed up by life. 5 Now He who prepared us for this very purpose is God, who gave to us the Spirit (Holy Spirit) as a pledge.

What is to come? Immortality - eternal life with God.

1 Corinthians 15:53-54

For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality. But when this perishable will have put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will come about the saying that is written, "DEATH IS SWALLOWED UP in victory.

1 Corinthians 15:52

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

Changed from what to what? From being mortal to being immortal.

Luke 20:36

for they cannot even die anymore, because they are like angels, and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.

We receive the gift of immortality at the first resurrection, we are fully mortal until then.

1 Thessalonians 4

15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

Psalm 146:4
When his breath departs, he returns to the earth; on that very day his plans perish.

Psalms 115

17It is not the dead who praise the LORD,
nor any who descend into silence.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I showed how you abused 1 Corinthians 6. Your reply was that you didn’t want to keep the discussion going.

My actual reply was I thought a cool down was necessary, maybe another time, something a bit different than you indicate. Why is taking a cool down period for the moment, when it was clearly needed, a problem? Also, between that slight bend of wording there and a few other comments, I have to ask, are you trying to make it appear like I was running from your accusation on Corinthians as attempt to discredit, and falsely at that? If so, not sure why anyone would think that? Nothing to run from.

The unfounded accusation I did something intentional, plus the already attack mode you all were in, on top of part of the result of attack mode...the false accusations, was enough for me to feel a break was necessary...that simple. I would think anyone can see everything I say is true, and my reasons to invoke time out were viable.

Moving on to the the accusation that coincidentally was leveled soon after my asking you why you left scripture out here of another post. Explanation here:

If you keep sinning after you are saved are you still saved?

Since you never so much as indicated there was a problem with Corinthians 6 until after the post in the prior link, it appears you had to go way back and actually look for something to "try" to hang me with, so, seems to me, it's a perfectly fair question to ask you if your accusation was in retaliation, and nothing more? You wanted something to accuse with, you found something, even if it was't really there?

Another reason I would ask you the prior is due to exactly what you said my intentions were. First the scripture in question and the accusation:

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.
— 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

For clarity, Kenny’s argument stops at v. 10, as if Paul is talking about believers. But when you move to v. 11, it’s obvious that he’s making a distinction.

The point being, he took a passage out of context to make a point, and in context it’s the opposite point.

I showed how you abused 1 Corinthians 6. Your reply was that you didn’t want to keep the discussion going.

The scripture I posted says all you say it did not, and just as I posted it, nothing left out, as in, it ended with this:

And that is what some of you were.

The term "were" there, means exactly that, they "were" that way, and now they are not, they are now believers, The part you said I left out on purpose (more on that in a sec). Making your accusation of me intentionally leaving out that they were believers absolutely false. To clarify for you, the posted scripture spoke of those who were believers as well as the unbelievers, a distinction you said I hid.

Secondly, what does it matter? Where does that scripture make the distinction on who will go to hell and who will not if they do those things to begin with? Will you answer that please, so at the very least all this mess is not the complete waste of time it is at this point? There is zero reason to believe those that are believers can do those things and still go to heaven, making even the false accusation not worth making to begin with. to clarify that...look at the very first line there:

"Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived"

Who do you think he is taking to there? He is positively addressing those that were washed, saved at the moment. Or wrongdoers, whoever they may be. He even made it clear they, those he was talking to, should not be "deceived". Deceived of what? What else but them thinking they, the saved, can do those things now and get away with it...when they cannot.

The scripture in question, as I said earlier, means anyone and everyone who does those things unrepentant, will not see the kingdom of God.

Lastly, on the accusation my intentions were to take some action in order to deceive, go to the following page, scroll down to the scripture, and see where I copied all the verses in that post from and exactly what was there to copy, and in exact order as it was at the link. None of the sinister actions of making it a point to not post certain parts of scriptures that didn't work for me, or "he took a passage out of context to make a point" ever existed. I copied what was there, a copy I have used several times here with out so much as a hint of accusation of leaving something out.

http://blog.adw.org/2013/08/five-biblical-lists-of-mortal-sins/

Hopefully you now see my reasoning for what I think really happened here. However, if I get nothing else from these threads, I do know people will see what they choose to see, exactly what just played out here.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

If anybody has found a way to 100% stop sinning after coming to faith or are "saved", what's your secret? And can I have it? PM me.

kthxbai

I have asked that question for years... with no takers.
I wrote a book "How To Never Sin Again" which acknowledges that it is at least possible... God has given us all we need to achieve sinless life. Having said that... never stop confessing your need for forgiveness from our Lord and Savior. You sin every day and do not even know you do it.

 

[Hammster]

Where does that scripture make the distinction on who will go to hell and who will not if they do those things to begin with? Will you answer that please, so at the very least all this mess is not the complete waste of time it is at this point? There is zero reason to believe those that are believers can do those things and still go to heaven, making even the false accusation not worth making to begin with. to clarify that...look at the very first line there:

"Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived"

The assumption that you are making is that believers will do those things. That’s incorrect.

 

[Grip Docility]

The assumption that you are making is that believers will do those things. That’s incorrect.

I think people have difficulty understanding that “dead men” can’t be tried for a crime.

 

[Grip Docility]

I have asked that question for years... with no takers.
I wrote a book "How To Never Sin Again" which acknowledges that it is at least possible... God has given us all we need to achieve sinless life. Having said that... never stop confessing your need for forgiveness from our Lord and Savior. You sin every day and do not even know you do it.

I know the trick! It’s being 6 feet under.

Double meaning in that.

 

[Kenny'sID]

The assumption that you are making is that believers will do those things. That’s incorrect.

No, of course they won't, they woiuld have to fall away in order for that to happen. There are some here that claim they are always saved even if they choose, after salvation, to do those things so do we, in your view, just take it, they are unbelievers?