Did the event of 1948 Israel fulfill any Bible prophecy?

[claninja]

The fall of Jerusalem was just one in a continuing series of judgments against the Jews, judgments that were declared even while they were captives in Babylon. The prophecies in Revelation, and Matthew 24 are dual, predicting soon to be events as well as end time events.

Again more sidestepping from the issue that was brought up. You accused LLOJ of full preterism because of the belief the coming of judgment of Christ in 70ad. But it is not a violation for a partial preterist to post about the coming judgment of Christ in 70ad, in the eschatological forums per forum rules.

 

[jgr]

Paul was speaking of a particular infirmity, which God declined to heal.

God's grace alone isn't sufficient for us?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

The holocaust could have been "A judgement" on the Jews, but not "THE" judgement shown in the 70ad Olivet Discourse and Revelation. They were in different cities of Nazi occupied Germany.

Exactly. "A" judgment.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Again more sidestepping from the issue that was brought up. You accused LLOJ of full preterism because of the belief the coming of judgment of Christ in 70ad. But it is not a violation for a partial preterist to post about the coming judgment of Christ in 70ad, in the eschatological forums per forum rules.

I didn't 'accuse', I suggested.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

OldWiseGuy said: ↑
The fall of Jerusalem was just one in a continuing series of judgments against the Jews, judgments that were declared even while they were captives in Babylon. The prophecies in Revelation, and Matthew 24 are dual, predicting soon to be events as well as end time events.

As horrendous as the siege of Jerusalem was in 70 AD it pales compared to the slaughter of six million Jews. It should be noted as well that the Jews were under the judgment of God way before 70 AD, and that judgment continues to this day.

Did you/others happen to see this news article concerning the leader of Israel and the prophecy of Ezekiel 37? [I do browse other boards]

Prophecies of Ezekiel 37

In a stunning and remarkable moment, Netanyahu also declared to the people of Europe and the world that the prophecies of Ezekiel 37 have been fulfilled.
The Holocaust, he said, represented the "dry bones" and "graves" of the Jewish people, and out of that horror the State of Israel was resurrected, just as the Lord said would happen through the Hebrew Prophet Ezekiel. Rarely has any world leader given a major address on an international stage declaring End Times prophecies from the Bible have come true. But that is exactly what Netanyahu did. - Joel Rosenberg
NTEB: God's Prophetical Promise To Return The Jews To Israel
I though this was relevant for Christians to read as a part of fulfillment of Biblical Prophecy.

I have a slightly different eschatological view of that concerning the 1st century 70ad holocaust, but the fact that a leader in Israel relates Ezek 37 to the WW2 holocaust is still amazing.

Here is my view of it
Lazarus and 2 witnesses of Reve 11 similarity

I would say this is talking about both Judah and Israel

Ezekiel 37:10
So I prophesied as He commanded me and a breath/spirit came into them and they lived and they stood upon their feet, an exceedingly great army.
11 Then He said to me, "Son of adam, these bones are the whole house of Israel.

Luke uses the same greek word #386 as used in Revelation 20:5 concerning the 1st Resurrection:

Luke 2:34
and Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mariam his mother
"behold!, this-one is set for the falling and resurrection/rising<386> of many in Israel, and for a sign spoken against--

Revelation 11:11
And after the three days and half-equal, a spirit/breath of life out of the God entered in them and they stand/esthsan <2476> (5627) on their feet and great fear falls upon the ones observing them.

Revelation 20:5 The rest of the dead-ones not live until should be being finished the thousand years.
This the first Resurrection<386>
===================================

OldWiseGuy said: ↑
The fall of Jerusalem was just one in a continuing series of judgments against the Jews, judgments that were declared even while they were captives in Babylon. The prophecies in Revelation, and Matthew 24 are dual, predicting soon to be events as well as end time events.

OldWiseGuy said: ↑
As horrendous as the siege of Jerusalem was in 70 AD it pales compared to the slaughter of six million Jews. It should be noted as well that the Jews were under the judgment of God way before 70 AD, and that judgment continues to this day

LittleLambofJesus said: ↑

The holocaust could have been "A judgement" on the Jews, but not "THE" judgement shown in the 70ad Olivet Discourse and Revelation. They were in different cities of Nazi occupied Germany.

Exactly. "A" judgment.

There is actually a thread on the holocaust.

The Holocaust: Was it the wrath and judgment of God?

This thread is to discuss a relatively controversial subject: whether or not the Holocaust was the wrath and judgment of God upon the Jews. The question is a controversial one. Going into Scripture, we find examples of what God will do to the Jews if they disobey his commands:

"“‘And I will heap disasters upon them; I will spend my arrows on them; 24 they shall be wasted with hunger, and devoured by plague and poisonous pestilence; I will send the teeth of beasts against them, with the venom of things that crawl in the dust. 25 Outdoors the sword shall bereave, and indoors terror, for young man and woman alike, the nursing child with the man of gray hairs." Deut. 32:23-25 (ESV)

We clearly see in Scripture that God is not a God who is incompatible with a Holocaust. The main argument is actually not a Biblical one but rather a moral one: any God who would punish someone with something like the Holocaust is unjust and cruel. This is particularly true when considering the fact that many children died in the Holocaust and they could not have been in conscious rebellion against God.

I guess I could simplify this thread into three questions:

1) Do you believe that the Holocaust is incompatible with the revealed Scripture of the Judaeo-Christian God?
2) Do you believe that any God who would use the Holocaust as punishment is cruel?
3) Is it possible that the Holocaust was the wrath and judgment of God?

I'll leave the rest open. Thoughts?

 

[claninja]

I didn't 'accuse', I suggested.

In post #630 you claimed LLOJ "expressed only full preterists opinions, WHICH IS A VIOLATION"

Are you a full Preterist? So far you have expressed only full Preterist opinions, which is a violation.

Definition of accuse: claim that (someone) has done something wrong.

Did you are did not you claim that LLOJ did something wrong in violation of forum rules?

In post #630 you didn't seem to merely suggest the LLOJ might have done something or seemingly done something, you stated LLOJ did something in violation of forum rules.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

In post #630 you claimed LLOJ "expressed only full preterists opinions, WHICH IS A VIOLATION"



Definition of accuse: claim that (someone) has done something wrong.

Did you are did not you claim that LLOJ did something wrong in violation of forum rules?

In post #630 you didn't seem to merely suggest the LLOJ might have done something or seemingly done something, you stated LLOJ did something in violation of forum rules.

The post was a question, not an accusation. Evidence was presented to support the question.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Did you/others happen to see this news article concerning the leader of Israel and the prophecy of Ezekiel 37? [I do browse other boards]

Prophecies of Ezekiel 37

I have a slightly different eschatological view of that concerning the 1st century 70ad holocaust, but the fact that a leader in Israel relates Ezek 37 to the WW2 holocaust is still amazing.

I had heard that. It's baloney.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

God's grace alone isn't sufficient for us?

Sufficient for some perhaps.

God, speaking through John, wishes us health and prosperity. Who would turn that down to remain in sickness and poverty.

 

[jgr]

Sufficient for some perhaps.

But not for all?

Where has He told us that His grace alone is not sufficient for all of us?

Here's what Paul said earlier in 2 Corinthians:

2 Corinthians 9:8
And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work:

Is that merely "sufficient for some"?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

In post #630 you claimed LLOJ "expressed only full preterists opinions, WHICH IS A VIOLATION"

Definition of accuse: claim that (someone) has done something wrong.

Did you are did not you claim that LLOJ did something wrong in violation of forum rules?

In post #630 you didn't seem to merely suggest the LLOJ might have done something or seemingly done something, you stated LLOJ did something in violation of forum rules.

Aren't Partial Preterist and Amills allowed to view 1st century Jerusalem in Revelation [as is the Olivet Disourse], as the End of the OC Mosaic and Temple worship/age?

Why Jerusalem is Mystically Called Sodom and Egypt

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized
Matt 24:1

Matthew 24:1
And Jesus going out of the Temple
Mark 13:1
And of His going out<1607> of the Temple
Luke 21:5
and of some saying concerning the Temple

Matt 24:3 "full end/consummation of the age"

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us!
when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952>
and full-end<4930> of the Age?

Mark 13
and what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> all these to be fully concluded<4931>.

Luke 21
And what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> these to becoming<1096>?
=======================================
Matthew 24:3
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952>
and full-end<4930> of the Age?

https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
The Historical Fall of Jerusalem in AD70

http://www.preteristarchive.com/PartialPreterism/index.html

Contemporary "Partial Preterist" View

A.D.70
A coming (parousia) of Christ
A day of the Lord
A judgment
The end of the Jewish Age

(Source: R.C. Sproul, Last Days) The Coming (parousia) of Christ

Still Future

The Day of the Lord
The Resurrection of the dead
The Rapture of the living
The (final) Judgment
The end of history

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

LittleLambofJesus said: ↑
Did you/others happen to see this news article concerning the leader of Israel and the prophecy of Ezekiel 37?
The Gryphon said: ↑
In a stunning and remarkable moment, Netanyahu also declared to the people of Europe and the world that the prophecies of Ezekiel 37 have been fulfilled.
The Holocaust, he said, represented the "dry bones" and "graves" of the Jewish people, and out of that horror the State of Israel was resurrected, just as the Lord said would happen through the Hebrew Prophet Ezekiel. Rarely has any world leader given a major address on an international stage declaring End Times prophecies from the Bible have come true. But that is exactly what Netanyahu did. - Joel Rosenberg
NTEB: God's Prophetical Promise To Return The Jews To Israel

I had heard that. It's baloney.

Why do you say that?

 

[claninja]

The post was a question, not an accusation. Evidence was presented to support the question.

In post #630, You didn't provide any evidence. there was not even one supporting quotation of LLOJ's to substantiate your claim, that LLOJ had violated forum rules.


From Post #630, this is a question, as it ends with a question mark:

Are you a full Preterist?

Now, From #630, this not a question, as did doesn't end with a question mark. This is an accusation, which by definition, is a claim that someone did something wrong:

So far you have expressed only full Preterist opinions, which is a violation

Additionally, the above quote of yours from post #630 is not evidence, it is an accusation that LLOJ violated forum rules based on your misunderstanding of partial preterism.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

In post #630, You didn't provide any evidence. there was not even one supporting quotation of LLOJ's to substantiate your claim, that LLOJ had violated forum rules.

From Post #630, this is a question, as it ends with a question mark

Now, From #630, this not a question, as did doesn't end with a question mark. This is an accusation, which by definition, is a claim that someone did something wrong:


Additionally, the above quote of yours from post #630 is not evidence, it is an accusation that LLOJ violated forum rules based on your misunderstanding of partial preterism.

Hello claninja.

Has anyone here seen anywhere on CF that explains CF's definition of "full preterism"?

LittleLambofJesus said: ↑
Define full preterism........

That would mean ALL of Revelation is fulfilled, including
Gog Magog,
and the final resurrection and judgement of the dead which occurs after the 1000yrs......

OldWiseGuy said: ↑
That's loony. How can there even be full Preterism?

 

[parousia70]

Don't Preterists believe that all prophecies have been fulfilled?

Full preterists believe all eschatology is fulfilled.

Partial preterists, (or classical, orthodox preterists) on the other hand espouse exactly what you have espoused.

Congratulations.
You are a preterist.

 

[keras]

Why do you say that?

OWG said that Netanyahu's statement that Ezekiel 37 was fulfilled; was balony.
I agreed with it.
Just read that chapter to see that its obvious; the spiritual blessings have not happened, let alone the rejoining of the House of Judah, now occupying a small part of the holy Land and the House of Israel, still scattered among the nations. Who have, in the main, become Christians.
They will all come together and live in all of the holy Land soon after the Lord has cleared and cleansed the entire area. Deuteronomy 32:34-43, Jeremiah 50:3-4, Ezekiel 20:34-38

 

[parousia70]

Point out exactly what I stated and I'll address it. Thanks.

Ok, I’ll do so AGAIN.

It appears that John thought the end was imminent.

Do you believe John was correct in believing and teaching this, or do you assert John believed and taught this in error, that he was wrong?

 

[keras]

Congratulations.
You are a preterist.

This is a nonsense statement.
Believing in provable historical facts does not make one a preterist.
It is when people believe in fulfilments that cannot be shown to have happened, that preterism shows its error.

I see Preterism as a shameful avoidance of probable future difficulties. They simply can't see how the great Plan of God for His people will unfold for their eventual good.

 

[jgr]

I see Preterism as a shameful avoidance of probable future difficulties. They simply can't see how the great Plan of God for His people will unfold for their eventual good.

I see fantasy futuritis as a deplorable denial of proven past fulfillments. It simply can't see how the great Plan of God for His people has unfolded for their good and His glory in the completed accomplishments of His Son at Calvary.

Daniel 9:24; Matthew 5:17,18; Mark 1:15; Luke 24:44; Acts 3:18; Acts 13:22,27,29,33

 

[ItIsFinished!]

I see fantasy futuritis as a deplorable denial of proven past fulfillments. It simply can't see how the great Plan of God for His people has unfolded for their good and His glory in the completed accomplishments of His Son at Calvary.

Daniel 9:24; Matthew 5:17,18; Mark 1:15; Luke 24:44; Acts 3:18; Acts 13:22,27,29,33

When has the mark of the beast ever been implemented in regards to the future prophecy??