Did the event of 1948 Israel fulfill any Bible prophecy?

Did event of Israel 1948 fulfill any Bible prophecy?


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keras

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When one looks with literal eyes, maybe it's "plain".....but you may be waiting a LOOOOONG time for things to work out the way you've painted them in your mind.
I confidently expect all the prophesies about the end times of this Christian era and the glorious Return of Jesus, as painted by all the prophets; to happen within the next 20 years. I have the time periods as given in the Bible to support this.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Is there any historical evidence that the events in Matthew 24: 30-31 have occurred? This would have been a pretty big deal.

30 "And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."
It was a pretty big deal for the 1st century Jews

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us!
when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952> and full-end<4930> of the Age?

This is still talking about the 1st century Temple and City and note the singular use of cloud.
Perhaps clouds can symbolize horses?

Luke 21:27
‘And then they shall see the Son of Man coming in a cloud[white horse?], with power and much glory;

This is the Harvest of 70ad Jerusalem.......Notice it says "one like as a son of man" not "the son of man". Do you really believe it is a literal cloud and sickle?

Perhaps the Jews of today can explain it.....oh wait.....they don't read Revelation.....

Why does Luke 21:27 use the singular "cloud" instead of "clouds"?
Why does Luke 21:27 use the singular "cloud" instead of "clouds"?

Revelation 14:
14 Then I looked, and behold! a white cloud,
and on the cloud sat One like the Son of Man, having on His head a golden crown,
and in His hand a sharp sickle.
15 And another angel came out of the Sanctuary, crying with a loud voice to Him who sat on the cloud, “Thrust in Your sickle and reap, for the time has come for You to reap,
for the harvest of the land is ripe.”
16 So He who sat on the cloud thrust in His sickle on the earth,and the earth was reaped.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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mkgal1 said:
It was being argued that Revelation's theme is "The Day of the Lord". While I agree that there's a connection to "Day of the Lord" and "the great day of their wrath has come" - I still don't agree that is support that is Revelation's theme (or that it's completely accurate to say that the same term is being used).

Revelation 6:17 Lexicon: for the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?"
OldWiseGuy said:
John was projected into the future, in the spirit. That's why he speaks of events in the present tense.
mkgal1 said:
True....but it was more like four-seven years into the future - not 2000+ years into the future.
keras said:
But it is plain even to a child, that what Revelation prophesies, had not yet happened.
With the exception of Revelation 1 to 6, up to verse 11.
mkgal1 said:
When one looks with literal eyes, maybe it's "plain".....but you may be waiting a LOOOOONG time for things to work out the way you've painted them in your mind.
I confidently expect all the prophesies about the end times of this Christian era and the glorious Return of Jesus, as painted by all the prophets; to happen within the next 20 years. I have the time periods as given in the Bible to support this.
Care to make a bet? I am almost 69 yrs old, so I will probably not be around to collect on it anyway :sigh:..........

Statement of Purpose - Eschatology Forum Statement of Purpose

V. Additional Rules
  • Full preterism is not allowed.
  • Date setting or date speculation is not allowed.
  • No Personal Prophecy (prophetic utterance) allowed.
  • Do not refer to specific religious leaders (alive or deceased) as the antichrist, the beast, or the false prophet.
  • Discussion or promotion of any form of serpent seed doctrine that dehumanizes existing groups of people is not allowed.
  • Please respect the guidelines and purpose of the safehouse threads as stated in the OP's of the Safehouse threads.
 
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jgr

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John was projected into the future, in the spirit. That's why he speaks of events in the present tense.

John disagrees.

Revelation 1
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

"Shortly come to pass" was written before John entered the Spirit on the Lord's Day (v. 10). It is thus relative to the time at which John wrote it. He had not yet entered the Spirit.

Nor after John entered the Spirit did he suggest or imply that he was "projected into the future". Rather, he began to witness what he had been told would "shortly come to pass".

Dispensational-style extreme indeterminate futurization is neither chronologically, nor logically, tenable.
 
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Copperhead

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And this Justifies bulldozing the home of an Arab who's family had lived there for generations....how?

What was the back story? I never trust any reports of such things.... on either side.... without some serious independent corroboration. News outlets are notoriously dishonest, be it Israel, America, or most everything else. And claims fly around all over the place. I am cynical by nature. Probably because of the lies and obfuscation I got broke in on during the Viet Nam era. I opened my eyes as a young man.

As as been stated before.... the first casualty in any conflict is the truth.

Nobody seems to report how the IDF has standing orders that any Syrian soldier who is injured and makes it to the Israeli border is to receive medical treatment and food. Or how many of the folks who cause problems for the Israeli's, their family is destitute and basically held hostage by the Hammas, PLO, or whoever by these organizations withholding money, food, medical care, etc from the people, but will pay the family a stipend if a member of the family will do their bidding like suicide bombing, throwing rocks at IDF soldiers, whatever comes up.

Or how that even Jordan had to deal with these "Palestinian' goof balls. Ever hear of Black September? King Hussein of Jordan took care of the "Palestinian" problem in his country and slaughtered 5000 of them and drove them out of the country. They had started playing the same games with his country as the do the Israelis. And when Jordan did this, Israel came forward and protected King Hussein from retribution attacks by Syria.

Or how that Yassar Arafat of the PLO ordered several of his own "Palestinian" people in Nablus hung by their jaws on butcher's hooks until they died. And ordered many of the pregnant "Palestinian" woman to be cut open and their babies killed. All for not supporting and cooperating with the PLO agenda.

The list goes on and on and on. Israel is not as pure as the wind driven snow, but the Arabs and "palestinians" make Israel look like perfect angels in comparison. And the "Palestinian" people are damned no matter what they do. If they don't cause problems for Israel, they are harassed, starved, etc by the PLO or Hammas. If they do what these thugs want, then they risk being killed fighting the Israelis.

Ask Walid Shoebat, J. D. Farag, and other guys who grew up "Palestinian" and are Christian brothers now and have seen things first hand what the real truth is.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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It was a pretty big deal for the 1st century Jews

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us!
when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952> and full-end<4930> of the Age?

This is still talking about the 1st century Temple and City and note the singular use of cloud.
Perhaps clouds can symbolize horses?

Luke 21:27
‘And then they shall see the Son of Man coming in a cloud[white horse?], with power and much glory;

This is the Harvest of 70ad Jerusalem.......Notice it says "one like as a son of man" not "the son of man". Do you really believe it is a literal cloud and sickle?

Perhaps the Jews of today can explain it.....oh wait.....they don't read Revelation.....

Why does Luke 21:27 use the singular "cloud" instead of "clouds"?
Why does Luke 21:27 use the singular "cloud" instead of "clouds"?

Revelation 14:
14 Then I looked, and behold! a white cloud,
and on the cloud sat One like the Son of Man, having on His head a golden crown,
and in His hand a sharp sickle.
15 And another angel came out of the Sanctuary, crying with a loud voice to Him who sat on the cloud, “Thrust in Your sickle and reap, for the time has come for You to reap,
for the harvest of the land is ripe.”
16 So He who sat on the cloud thrust in His sickle on the earth,and the earth was reaped.

Revelation 19:11
And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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John disagrees.

Revelation 1
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

"Shortly come to pass" was written before John entered the Spirit on the Lord's Day (v. 10). It is thus relative to the time at which John wrote it. He had not yet entered the Spirit.

Nor after John entered the Spirit did he suggest or imply that he was "projected into the future". Rather, he began to witness what he had been told would "shortly come to pass".

Dispensational-style extreme indeterminate futurization is neither chronologically, nor logically, tenable.

Revelation 1
 
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OldWiseGuy

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John disagrees.

Revelation 1
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

"Shortly come to pass" was written before John entered the Spirit on the Lord's Day (v. 10). It is thus relative to the time at which John wrote it. He had not yet entered the Spirit.

Nor after John entered the Spirit did he suggest or imply that he was "projected into the future". Rather, he began to witness what he had been told would "shortly come to pass".

Dispensational-style extreme indeterminate futurization is neither chronologically, nor logically, tenable.

Revelation 1:19

"Write therefore the things which thou sawest, and the things which are, and the things which shall come to pass hereafter;"
"Hereafter" is indeterminate.

This verse suggests three major periods of time, and is recorded after John is "in the spirit?

Regarding chronology; some things are, some are not. Some repeat, some recap in different metaphors ("here a little, there a little, line upon line").
 
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keras

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Care to make a bet? I am almost 69 yrs old, so I will probably not be around to collect on it anyway :sigh:..........
I am 77, but I do expect to see it all happen before I die.
My confidence is because the Lord has made it clear to me that I will and also because the Bible confirms the timing. Jesus prophesied the 2000 year gap between His first and second Advents. Luke 13:32 is the 2 'days' He will spend in heaven and the third 'day' is His Millennium reign. Proved by Hosea 6:2.
We are now at the 1989th year since Jesus commenced His earthly Ministry.

Believe the Prophets, when things do start, events will happen quickly, amazing things, that will literally happen as they described. They did for the first Advent, why not for the second?
I'll put up my beach house; you got a farm for your bet?
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Care to make a bet? I am almost 69 yrs old, so I will probably not be around to collect on it anyway :sigh:..........

Statement of Purpose - Eschatology Forum Statement of Purpose

V. Additional Rules
  • Full preterism is not allowed.
  • Date setting or date speculation is not allowed.
  • No Personal Prophecy (prophetic utterance) allowed.
  • Do not refer to specific religious leaders (alive or deceased) as the antichrist, the beast, or the false prophet.
  • Discussion or promotion of any form of serpent seed doctrine that dehumanizes existing groups of people is not allowed.
  • Please respect the guidelines and purpose of the safehouse threads as stated in the OP's of the Safehouse threads.

Are you a full Preterist? So far you have expressed only full Preterist opinions, which is a violation.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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I am 77, but I do expect to see it all happen before I die.
My confidence is because the Lord has made it clear to me that I will and also because the Bible confirms the timing. Jesus prophesied the 2000 year gap between His first and second Advents. Luke 13:32 is the 2 'days' He will spend in heaven and the third 'day' is His Millennium reign. Proved by Hosea 6:2.
We are now at the 1989th year since Jesus commenced His earthly Ministry.

Believe the Prophets, when things do start, events will happen quickly, amazing things, that will literally happen as they described. They did for the first Advent, why not for the second?
I'll put up my beach house; you got a farm for your bet?

No one knows the "day or the hour", but things could go south very quickly. :eek:
 
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jgr

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Revelation 1:19

"Write therefore the things which thou sawest, and the things which are, and the things which shall come to pass hereafter;"
"Hereafter" is indeterminate.

This verse suggests three major periods of time, and is recorded after John is "in the spirit?

Regarding chronology; some things are, some are not. Some repeat, some recap in different metaphors ("here a little, there a little, line upon line").

Indeterminate, but not long.

3195 [e]
mellei
μέλλει
are about
V-PIA-3S
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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OldWiseGuy said:
John was projected into the future, in the spirit. That's why he speaks of events in the present tense.
No one knows the "day or the hour", but things could go south very quickly. :eek:
John disagrees.

Revelation 1
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

"Shortly come to pass" was written before John entered the Spirit on the Lord's Day (v. 10). It is thus relative to the time at which John wrote it. He had not yet entered the Spirit.

Nor after John entered the Spirit did he suggest or imply that he was "projected into the future". Rather, he began to witness what he had been told would "shortly come to pass".

Dispensational-style extreme indeterminate futurization is neither chronologically, nor logically, tenable.
Both in Swiftness and the time was Nigh.............

"THE TIME IS NIGH AT HAND" AND "COMING IN SWIFTNESS" REVELATION PROPHECY

Revelation 1:1
An un-veiling of Jesus Christ, which gives to Him, the GOD, to show to the bond-servants of Him, which-things is binding to be becoming In/en <1722> Swiftness/tacei <5034>.
Revelation 1:3
Blessed/happy the one reading and the ones hearing the words of the Prophecy and keepings in it having been written/gegrammena <1125> (5772),
That the Time/Season is nigh<1451>.

Revelation 22:6
And said to me: "These the Words Faithful and True. And Lord, the GOD of the spirits of the holy Prophets commissions the messenger of Him to show to the bond-servents of Him which-things is binding to be becoming In/en <1722> Swiftness/tacei <5034>.
Revelation 22:10

And he is saying to me "no thou should be sealing the Words of the Prophecy of the Scroll, this.
That the Time/Season is nigh<1451>

1451. eggus from a primary verb agcho (to squeeze or throttle; akin to the base of 43); near (literally or figuratively, of place or time):--from , at hand, near, nigh (at hand, unto), ready.
1448. eggizo from 1451; to make near, i.e. (reflexively) approach:--approach, be at hand, come (draw) near, be (come, draw) nigh.

James 5:8

be ye patient!, also stand-fast the hearts of ye, that the Parousia <3952> of the Lord has-neared<1448>

1 Peter 4:7
Of all-things yet the End<5056> is nigh<1448>

be sane then, and be sober into the prayers,
================================
The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

The dead bodies of priests and worshippers, both natives and foreigners were heaped together, and a lake of blood stagnated in the sacred courts. John of Gischala, who headed one of the factions, burnt storehouses full of provisions ; and Simon, his great antagonist, who headed another of them, soon afterwards followed his example. Thus they cut the very sinews of their own strength.

At this critical and alarming conjuncture, intelligence arrived that the Roman army was approaching the city. The Jews were petrified with astonishment and fear ; there was no time for counsel, no hope of pacification, no means of flight:-- all was wild disorder and perplexity :- nothing was to be heard but "the confused noise of the warrior, " -- nothing to be seen but garments rolled in blood," -- nothing to be expected from the Romans but signal and exemplary vengeance..........................
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized
Luke 21:22 That days of vengeance these are, of the to be fulfilled<4130> all the having been written 23 “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great Distress in the land and wrath upon this people.
............The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover ; and it is deserving of the very particular attention of the reader, that this was the anniversary of that memorable period in which the Jews crucified their Messiah! At this season multitudes came up from all the surrounding country, and from distant parts, to keep the festival. How suitable and how kind, then, was the prophetic admonition of our LORD, and how clearly he into futurity when he said "Let not them that are in the countries enter into Jerusalem." Luke xxi. 21.

Nevertheless, the city was at this time crowded with Jewish strangers, and foreigners from all parts, so that the whole nation may be considered as having been shut up in one prison, preparatory to the execution of the Divine vengeance ;
and, according to Josephus this event took place suddenly; thus, not only fulfilling the predictions of our LORD, that these calamities should come, like the swift-darting lightning" that cometh out of the east and shineth even unto the West," and " as a snare on all of them (the Jews) who dwelt upon the face of the whole earth " (Matt. xxiv. 27, and Luke xxi 35,) but justifying, also, his friendly direction, that those who fled from the place should use the utmost possible expedition.
============
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized

Matthew 24:16
then those in
the Judea let them be fleeing! into the mountains
Mark 13:14
Whenever yet ye may be seeing see the abomination of the desolation<2050>, the one being declared by Daniel the prophet, standing where it is not binding, (whoever is reading let him be understanding!)
Then those in the Judea, let them be fleeing into the mountains
Luke 21:
21 then those in the Judea,
let them be fleeing into the mountains;
and those in midst of Her, let them be coming out to country;
and those in the countries placed, let them not come be entering into Her
22 That days of vengeance these are, of the to be fulfilled<4130> all the having been written 23 “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great Distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

Matthew 24:27
For even as the lightning coming forth out of east and is appearing till of the west,
thus shall be being the parousia of the Son of the Man.
Luke 17:24
For even as the lightning flashing out of under the heaven into the under heaven is shining,
thus also shall be being the Son of the Man
=====================
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Both in Swiftness and the time was Nigh.............

"THE TIME IS NIGH AT HAND" AND "COMING IN SWIFTNESS" REVELATION PROPHECY

Revelation 1:1
An un-veiling of Jesus Christ, which gives to Him, the GOD, to show to the bond-servants of Him, which-things is binding to be becoming In/en <1722> Swiftness/tacei <5034>.
Revelation 1:3
Blessed/happy the one reading and the ones hearing the words of the Prophecy and keepings in it having been written/gegrammena <1125> (5772),
That the Time/Season is nigh<1451>.

Revelation 22:6
And said to me: "These the Words Faithful and True. And Lord, the GOD of the spirits of the holy Prophets commissions the messenger of Him to show to the bond-servents of Him which-things is binding to be becoming In/en <1722> Swiftness/tacei <5034>.
Revelation 22:10

And he is saying to me "no thou should be sealing the Words of the Prophecy of the Scroll, this.
That the Time/Season is nigh<1451>

1451. eggus from a primary verb agcho (to squeeze or throttle; akin to the base of 43); near (literally or figuratively, of place or time):--from , at hand, near, nigh (at hand, unto), ready.
1448. eggizo from 1451; to make near, i.e. (reflexively) approach:--approach, be at hand, come (draw) near, be (come, draw) nigh.

James 5:8

be ye patient!, also stand-fast the hearts of ye, that the Parousia <3952> of the Lord has-neared<1448>

1 Peter 4:7
Of all-things yet the End<5056> is nigh<1448>

be sane then, and be sober into the prayers,
================================
The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

The dead bodies of priests and worshippers, both natives and foreigners were heaped together, and a lake of blood stagnated in the sacred courts. John of Gischala, who headed one of the factions, burnt storehouses full of provisions ; and Simon, his great antagonist, who headed another of them, soon afterwards followed his example. Thus they cut the very sinews of their own strength.

At this critical and alarming conjuncture, intelligence arrived that the Roman army was approaching the city. The Jews were petrified with astonishment and fear ; there was no time for counsel, no hope of pacification, no means of flight:-- all was wild disorder and perplexity :- nothing was to be heard but "the confused noise of the warrior, " -- nothing to be seen but garments rolled in blood," -- nothing to be expected from the Romans but signal and exemplary vengeance..........................
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized

............The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover ; and it is deserving of the very particular attention of the reader, that this was the anniversary of that memorable period in which the Jews crucified their Messiah! At this season multitudes came up from all the surrounding country, and from distant parts, to keep the festival. How suitable and how kind, then, was the prophetic admonition of our LORD, and how clearly he into futurity when he said "Let not them that are in the countries enter into Jerusalem." Luke xxi. 21.

Nevertheless, the city was at this time crowded with Jewish strangers, and foreigners from all parts, so that the whole nation may be considered as having been shut up in one prison, preparatory to the execution of the Divine vengeance ;
and, according to Josephus this event took place suddenly; thus, not only fulfilling the predictions of our LORD, that these calamities should come, like the swift-darting lightning" that cometh out of the east and shineth even unto the West," and " as a snare on all of them (the Jews) who dwelt upon the face of the whole earth " (Matt. xxiv. 27, and Luke xxi 35,) but justifying, also, his friendly direction, that those who fled from the place should use the utmost possible expedition.
============
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized

Matthew 24:16
then those in
the Judea let them be fleeing! into the mountains
Mark 13:14
Whenever yet ye may be seeing see the abomination of the desolation<2050>, the one being declared by Daniel the prophet, standing where it is not binding, (whoever is reading let him be understanding!)
Then those in the Judea, let them be fleeing into the mountains
Luke 21:
21 then those in the Judea,
let them be fleeing into the mountains;
and those in midst of Her, let them be coming out to country;
and those in the countries placed, let them not come be entering into Her
22 That days of vengeance these are, of the to be fulfilled<4130> all the having been written 23 “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great Distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

Matthew 24:27
For even as the lightning coming forth out of east and is appearing till of the west,
thus shall be being the parousia of the Son of the Man.
Luke 17:24
For even as the lightning flashing out of under the heaven into the under heaven is shining,
thus also shall be being the Son of the Man
=====================

Do you believe that Christ has returned?
 
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Seville90210

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Are you sure you're not a full Preterist pretending to be a partial Preterist so you can safely post on these forums?

Oh yeah that's no secret to many of us on this forum. It's only to the moderators he's hidden under their radar.
 
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OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
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Define full preterism........

That would mean ALL of Revelation is fulfilled, including
Gog Magog,
and the final resurrection and judgement of the dead which occurs after the 1000yrs......

That's loony. How can there even be full Preterism?

To the question. Do you believe Christ has already returned?
 
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LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
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LittleLambofJesus said:
Define full preterism........

That would mean ALL of Revelation is fulfilled, including
Gog Magog,
and the final resurrection and judgement of the dead which occurs after the 1000yrs.....

That's loony. How can there even be full Preterism?
Good question.......I am still confused by it all.........

http://www.preteristarchive.com/

https://www.preteristarchive.com/PartialPreterism/index.html

Contemporary "Partial Preterist" View

A.D.70 S
A
coming (parousia) of Christ
A day of the Lord
A judgment
The end of the Jewish Age

Still future
The
Day of the Lord
The Resurrection of the dead
The Rapture of the living
The (final) Judgment
The end of history

=====================================

https://www.preteristarchive.com/Modern/index.html

MODERN PRETERISM
(MP) - A) Umbrella term covering all those who believe that the majority of Bible prophecy was totally fulfilled in the early centuries of the Christian era. Determined by looking at where authors find a "transition" from the past to the future using the Olivet Discourse of Matthew 24/25 and the Apocalypse of John.
Differs from Full Preterism in that it does not make the Parousia, the General Judgment, nor the General Resurrection events solely of the past.
B) According to known literature, this class emerged during the Reformation or Counter Reformation and can be seen in a fully developed form at the beginning of the 17th century in the writings of the Jesuit Alcasar -- although many believe that the "Preterist Assumption" seen throughout church history reveals the ancient and medieval equivalents of the Modern Preterist view. (perhaps systematized the most consistenty in 310 by Eusebius in "Theophany").
C) Teaches that the bulk of "end times" prophecy has sole application to ancient Israel, but that some regards the "last day" -- sometimes that "end" being personal, not global, in nature. Transitions somewhere in Matthew 25, or near the end of the Apocalypse of John.
 
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