Ladies and Gentleman... Covenant/Supersession Theology is officially Rebuffed

[Grip Docility]

Zechariah 3:10 In that day, saith Jehovah of hosts, shall ye invite every man his neighbor under the vine and under the fig-tree.

In Zechariah 3 the Vine (JESUS) is differentiated from the Fig Tree (Israel)

This explains why Paul begins the Tree analogy apart from the "Fig Tree"

Paul is using the appointment of the Apostolic church... brought forth by the (11)... of the 12... to signify the BOC, as the 11 were of "Israel" right up until "Penteost"? Mid Acts... ? Late Acts.... WHO Cares!?! Paul is then brought into the BOC for the Delivery of the Gospel to the Gentiles!!!!! He is nodding to the BOC's Jewish roots, by using the Olive Tree!

Don't get all argumentative about When it was official... (Acts 1... Mid... Late) ... Meh... It happened! Ta DA!

John 15 + Matthew 24:32 + Mark 11:12-25 + Romans 11 + Acts of the Apostles 1:6-7 + Acts of the Apostles 1:10-12 + Zechariah 14:1-6 (Especially Zechariah 14:4) ... Joel 2-3

Zechariah 3 is a shadow of Christ and it shows Christ's justification before God (The Father is invisible, but can be heard), as the Devil is Accusing Him, while He is literally Dressed in our Sins, before The Father.

Joshua is the true English way of saying (Jesus... which is the Greek transliteration)... as Yeshua is the Hebrew "Post Babylonian" way of saying Jesus... and YeHoshua is the Pre-Babylonian way of saying Jesus...

So... Check my work (Non Supersessionists)... Pretty Please

As you can see Ephesians 2:14-16 calls Christ the new Man, which vindicates that Paul is speaking about a NEW CREATION in the Grafting and Re-grafting, while Broken off ISRAEL literal is The FIG TREE.

Folks... This PROOFS, beyond a shadow of a doubt that The BOC is not Israel and Israel is not the BOC!

Check it, load it into Romans 11:13-24

Done deed!

All Love in our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, the NEW MAN, Head of the BOC and/but also King of Israel.

Spoiler

 

[Grip Docility]

Spoiler

the dispensationalism of Irenaeus

Please do not comment on this link... here.

Irenaeus is important, because he is in the direct line of Apostles Discipled by John the Revelater... that is part of Scriptural Chain of Custody.

I EMPHASIZE... PLEASE... Do not comment on the link in Spoiler, nor debate at the link. It is to make a very important point.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Zechariah 3:10 In that day, saith Jehovah of hosts, shall ye invite every man his neighbor under the vine and under the fig-tree.

In Zechariah 3 the Vine (JESUS) is differentiated from the Fig Tree (Israel)

This explains why Paul begins the Tree analogy apart from the "Fig Tree"

Paul is using the appointment of the Apostolic church... brought forth by the (11)... of the 12... to signify the BOC, as the 11 were of "Israel" right up until "Penteost"? Mid Acts... ? Late Acts.... WHO Cares!?! Paul is then brought into the BOC for the Delivery of the Gospel to the Gentiles!!!!! He is nodding to the BOC's Jewish roots, by using the Olive Tree!

Don't get all argumentative about When it was official... (Acts 1... Mid... Late) ... Meh... It happened! Ta DA!

John 15 + Matthew 24:32 + Mark 11:12-25 + Romans 11 + Acts of the Apostles 1:6-7 + Acts of the Apostles 1:10-12 + Zechariah 14:1-6 (Especially Zechariah 14:4) ... Joel 2-3

Zechariah 3 is a shadow of Christ and it shows Christ's justification before God, as the Devil is Accusing Him, while He is literally Dressed in our Sins, before The Father.

Joshua is the true English way of saying (Jesus... which is the Greek transliteration)... as Yeshua is the Hebrew "Post Babylonian" way of saying Jesus... and YeHoshua is the Pre-Babylonian way of saying Jesus...

So... Check my work (Non Supersessionists)... Pretty Please
As you can see Ephesians 2:14-16 calls Christ the new Man, which vindicates that Paul is speaking about a NEW CREATION in the Grafting and Re-grafting, while Broken off ISRAEL literal is The FIG TREE.
Folks... This PROOFS, beyond a shadow of a doubt that The BOC is not Israel and Israel is not the BOC!

Check it, load it into Romans 11:13-24
Done deed!
All Love in our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, the NEW MAN, Head of the BOC and/but also King of Israel.

I like figs.
Were the leaves sprouting when Titus and the Roman army sieged Jerusalem in 70ad?

Mar 11:13
Seeing in the distance a fig tree in leaf, he went to find out if it had any fruit. When he reached it, he found nothing but leaves, because it was not the season for figs.

Titus sieges Jerusalem on Feast of Passover/Destroyer in Revelation

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us! when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952>
and full-end<4930> of the Age?

Matthew 24:32
Yet from the fig-tree be ye learning! the parable:
Whenever already its branch may be becoming tender, and the leaves may be sprouting<1631>,
ye are knowing that nigh the summer

Mark 13:28
‘Yet from the fig-tree, be ye learning the parable.
When the branch of it tender may be becoming, and may be sprouting<1631> the leaves,
ye are knowing that nigh is the summer

Luke 21:
29 And He told a parable to them. Be seeing the fig-tree and all the trees,
30 whenever they should be budding<4261> already observing from yourselves
ye are knowing thru that already nigh is the summer



The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover;.........

The Temple now presented little more than a heap of ruins..................

This memorable siege terminated on the eighth day of the ninth month, A. D. 70 : its duration was nearly five months, the Romans having invested the city on the fourteenth day of the fourth month, preceeding.
================================
Rev 6:13
and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind.

 

[Daniel Marsh]

I thought I was linking to a book, disappointed

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The replacement was the removal of the OC Mosaic carnal corrupt murderous Priesthood and replaced with the NC Christian spiritual Priesthood

OC Mosaic Priesthood cursed forever?

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge,
I also will reject you from being priest for Me;
Because you have forgotten the law of your God, I also will forget your children.

Malachi 2
1 “And now, O priests, this command is for you. 2 If you will not listen, if you will not take it to heart to give honor to my name, says the Lord of hosts, then I will send the curse upon you and I will curse your blessings. Indeed, I have already cursed them, because you do not lay it to heart.
3 Behold, I will rebuke your offspring, and spread dung on your faces, the dung of your offerings, and you shall be taken away with it

How would the Law be changed under the NC?

Hebrews 7:12
For being translated/changed<3346> the Priesthood, out of necessity also, of Law a translation/change<3331> is becoming

Revelation 1:6
And makes us a Kingdom of Priests[*Kings and Priests] to the God and Father of Him. To Him the glory and the holding into the ages of the ages, Amen.
===========================
How many Priests were in Jerusalem during the 70ad feast of Passover?

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

,.........The three factions, rendered frantic by drunkenness, rage, and desperation, trampling on heaps of slain, fought against each other with brutal savageness and madness. Even such as brou't sacrifices to the temple were murdered. The dead bodies of priests and worshipers, both natives and foreigners were heaped together, and a lake of blood stagnated in the sacred courts..............

The old and the young, the common people and the priests, those who surrendered and those who resisted, were equally involved in this horrible and indiscriminate carnage. Meanwhile the Temple continued burning, until at length, vast as was its size,...........

For five days after the destruction of the Temple, the priests who had escaped, sat, pining with hunger, on the top of one of its broken walls; at length, they came down, and humbly asked the pardon of Titus, which, however, he refused to grant them, saying, that, "as the Temple, for the sake of which he would have spared them, was destroyed, it was but fit that its priests should parish also:" -whereupon he commanded that they should be put to death. .........
===================================
https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM

 

[Kenny'sID]

The op started out with scripture that will be meaningless to those of us who don't understand the title...like me.

Could you please give us just a little insight?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Ladies and Gentleman... Covenant/Supersession Theology is officially Rebuffed

The op started out with scripture that will be meaningless to those of us who don't understand the title...like me.

Could you please give us just a little insight?

I only really know about ir from being on the Eschatology and Dispensationalist boards, where Israel and the endtimes are discussed..

Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum

A lot of times being on them is like watching this series [which I notice is in your avatar ehehe]

 

[Grip Docility]

The op started out with scripture that will be meaningless to those of us who don't understand the title...like me.

Could you please give us just a little insight?

For over 1800 years... much church doctrine has taught that the Body of Christ is Israel.

Prior to this... the Church had been discipled by the chain of Apostles that Israel and the BOC (Body of Christ) were separate entities, especially in the respects of Israel's Future Promises.

This is crucial to understand, because many heresies have crept into the BOC through the usurping of Israel's "Chosen" "Elected" status.

The New Covenant is the "Superior" Covenant, by scripture, as the Old covenant has been Fulfilled and it's "Testator" was murdered. This same Testator also "Ratified" the New Covenant.

This gets pretty complex, as it involves proper understanding of "The Son's" pre-Incarnate station in Scripture. 1 Corinthians 10:1-4 should help with this. The Piller of Fire by Night and the Cloud by Day should make a light bulb go on.

The Supersession (Covenant Theology) premise, roots in a misreading of Justin Martyr, during the 70 AD event, involving the temple.

The Mother Church began to establish itself as Israel and thus, authoritatively bolstered it's ability to govern. This doesn't make the Mother Church bad... it's simply what happened, because Jerusalem was raised, in a deep sense, causing yet another intense Jewish Diaspora... which caused the church to lose faith that Israel would be restored, again.

This would become a book, if I kept going.

The biggest issue is that Romans 9-11 has perpetually been shifted and sorted out of context to justify certain opportunistic Doctrine that was wrestled together by a certain reformer that prolifically founded their belief systems on Pre-Apostate Augustine, and Recanted, Respected Post Apostate Augustine.

I really have to be cautious how I communicate the rest, but if you have any questions about the actual verses provided, I will do my best to communicate a bit more.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

For over 1800 years... much church doctrine has taught that the Body of Christ is Israel.

Prior to this... the Church had been discipled by the chain of Apostles that Israel and the BOC (Body of Christ) were separate entities, especially in the respects of Israel's Future Promises.
The Supersession (Covenant Theology) premise, roots in a misreading of Justin Martyr, during the 70 AD event, involving the temple.

I really have to be cautious how I communicate the rest, but if you have any questions about the actual verses provided, I will do my best to communicate a bit more.

Have you ever studied Revelation in conjunction with the 70ad Olivet Discourse? I highly recommend it, especially to the Jews.

Matthew 3:7
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them,
“Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the being about wrath<ὀργῆς<3709>?

Luke 3:7
Then he said to the multitudes that came out to be baptized by him, “Brood of vipers! Who warned ye to flee from the being about wrath<ὀργῆς<3709>?

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be Great Distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

Eph 5:6 - Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.
Col 3:6 - Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience,
1Th 2:16 - forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

Revelation 6:
16 - and they are saying to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb!
17 - “For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”

Rev 11:18 - The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come,
And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints,
And those who fear Your name, small and great,
And should destroy those who destroy the earth.”
===================================
"Ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles" 1st century Judea

Matthew 24:6
“Yet ye shall be being about to be hearing battles and hearings of battles, be seeing! be not be being troubled<2360>, for is binding to becoming,
but not as yet the End<5056>
Mark 13:7
“Yet whenever ye should be hearing battles and hearings of battles, be seeing! be not be being troubled for is binding to be becoming,
but not as yet the End<5056>
Luke 21:9
“Yet whenever ye should be hearing battles and tumults<181>, no may be being frightened<4422>, for is binding these to be becoming,
but not immediately the End<5056>

https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM


CAST OF CHARACTERS: Roman: Emperor Nero | General Vespasian | General Titus | The Roman Army || Jewish: General / Historian Josephus | Factional Leaders in Jerusalem || Administrators of Roman Judea Targets: Jerusalem | Herod's Temple // Maps of the Roman Invasion // Theological Timeline

CHRONOLOGY IMMEDIATELY SURROUNDING THE WAR

Stage 1: Murder of James the Just, "Opposition High Priest" ; Irrevocable Split: 62
Stage 2: General Revolt in Jerusalem ; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
Stage 3: The Campaign of Cestius Gallus and the Defeat of the Twelfth Legion: October-November 66
Stage 4: End of Collaborative Government, Priesthood ; General Flight: November 66 - March 67
Part 6: Vespasian Subdues Northern and Western Palestine: December 66 - December 68
Part 7: Three-way Power Struggle within Jerusalem After Roman Retreat: January 68 - May 70
Part 8: Romans Breach City Walls and Leave Jerusalem Desolate: May 10 - September 10, 70

 

[Grip Docility]

Have you ever studied Revelation in conjunction with the 70ad Olivet Discourse? I highly recommend it, especially to the Jews.

Matthew 3:7
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them,
“Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the being about wrath<ὀργῆς<3709>?

Luke 3:7
Then he said to the multitudes that came out to be baptized by him, “Brood of vipers! Who warned ye to flee from the being about wrath<ὀργῆς<3709>?

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be Great Distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

Eph 5:6 - Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.
Col 3:6 - Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience,
1Th 2:16 - forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

Revelation 6:
16 - and they are saying to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb!
17 - “For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”

Rev 11:18 - The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come,
And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints,
And those who fear Your name, small and great,
And should destroy those who destroy the earth.”
===================================
"Ye will hear of battles and rumors of battles" 1st century Judea

Matthew 24:6
“Yet ye shall be being about to be hearing battles and hearings of battles, be seeing! be not be being troubled<2360>, for is binding to becoming,
but not as yet the End<5056>
Mark 13:7
“Yet whenever ye should be hearing battles and hearings of battles, be seeing! be not be being troubled for is binding to be becoming,
but not as yet the End<5056>
Luke 21:9
“Yet whenever ye should be hearing battles and tumults<181>, no may be being frightened<4422>, for is binding these to be becoming,
but not immediately the End<5056>

https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM


CAST OF CHARACTERS: Roman: Emperor Nero | General Vespasian | General Titus | The Roman Army || Jewish: General / Historian Josephus | Factional Leaders in Jerusalem || Administrators of Roman Judea Targets: Jerusalem | Herod's Temple // Maps of the Roman Invasion // Theological Timeline

CHRONOLOGY IMMEDIATELY SURROUNDING THE WAR

Stage 1: Murder of James the Just, "Opposition High Priest" ; Irrevocable Split: 62
Stage 2: General Revolt in Jerusalem ; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
Stage 3: The Campaign of Cestius Gallus and the Defeat of the Twelfth Legion: October-November 66
Stage 4: End of Collaborative Government, Priesthood ; General Flight: November 66 - March 67
Part 6: Vespasian Subdues Northern and Western Palestine: December 66 - December 68
Part 7: Three-way Power Struggle within Jerusalem After Roman Retreat: January 68 - May 70
Part 8: Romans Breach City Walls and Leave Jerusalem Desolate: May 10 - September 10, 70

Israel is a "Type". What is in Revelation is a much different "Anti Type"... that will almost bring the entire world to an end.

How do I know this?

2 Peter 3

4
They will say, "Where is this `coming' he promised? Ever since our fathers died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation."
5
But they deliberately forget that long ago by God's word the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water.
6
By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed.
7
By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8
But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.
9
The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.
10
But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything in it will be laid bare. [1]
11
Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives
12
as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. [2] That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat.

This verse binds the 2nd Coming to a Literal Fire that is likened unto (The Flood). I, personally, believe in a Global Flood. Thus, I must concede that the Fire will be VERY LITERAL.

Sodom and Gomorrah are given as an Example of this Fire to come.

The harlot of Babylon is not Israel, nor Rome. I guarantee this!

Rome professes Christ come in Flesh. NOT Anti Christ. These are Fellow Christians.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Ladies and Gentleman... Covenant/Supersession Theology is officially Rebuffed
I only really know about ir from being on the Eschatology and Dispensationalist boards, where Israel and the endtimes are discussed..

Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum

A lot of times being on them is like watching this series [which I notice is in your avatar ehehe]

LOL, I had forgotten the older Outer Limits used that in their opening.

Thanks for the link.

 

[Grip Docility]

The replacement was the removal of the OC Mosaic carnal corrupt murderous Priesthood and replaced with the NC Christian spiritual Priesthood

OC Mosaic Priesthood cursed forever?

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge,
I also will reject you from being priest for Me;
Because you have forgotten the law of your God, I also will forget your children.

Malachi 2
1 “And now, O priests, this command is for you. 2 If you will not listen, if you will not take it to heart to give honor to my name, says the Lord of hosts, then I will send the curse upon you and I will curse your blessings. Indeed, I have already cursed them, because you do not lay it to heart.
3 Behold, I will rebuke your offspring, and spread dung on your faces, the dung of your offerings, and you shall be taken away with it

How would the Law be changed under the NC?

Hebrews 7:12
For being translated/changed<3346> the Priesthood, out of necessity also, of Law a translation/change<3331> is becoming

Revelation 1:6
And makes us a Kingdom of Priests[*Kings and Priests] to the God and Father of Him. To Him the glory and the holding into the ages of the ages, Amen.
===========================
How many Priests were in Jerusalem during the 70ad feast of Passover?

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

,.........The three factions, rendered frantic by drunkenness, rage, and desperation, trampling on heaps of slain, fought against each other with brutal savageness and madness. Even such as brou't sacrifices to the temple were murdered. The dead bodies of priests and worshipers, both natives and foreigners were heaped together, and a lake of blood stagnated in the sacred courts..............

The old and the young, the common people and the priests, those who surrendered and those who resisted, were equally involved in this horrible and indiscriminate carnage. Meanwhile the Temple continued burning, until at length, vast as was its size,...........

For five days after the destruction of the Temple, the priests who had escaped, sat, pining with hunger, on the top of one of its broken walls; at length, they came down, and humbly asked the pardon of Titus, which, however, he refused to grant them, saying, that, "as the Temple, for the sake of which he would have spared them, was destroyed, it was but fit that its priests should parish also:" -whereupon he commanded that they should be put to death. .........
===================================
https://www.preteristarchive.com/JewishWars/timeline_military.html
"..probably the greatest single slaughter in ancient history."
ROMAN SIEGE AND SACK OF JERUSALEM

What I have posted shows clearly that the BOC is biblically not Israel.

This isn't dispensation or Eschatology... but a biblical principle that is being abused. IMO

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Israel is a "Type". What is in Revelation is a much different "Anti Type"... that will almost bring the entire world to an end.

There is no "end of the whole world" in Revelation. You are in gross error and teaching falsehood........

Tho to the 1st century Jews of the holocaust in 70ad, it did indeed appear to be the "end of the world".

Revelation concerns a Great City.........OC Jerusalem and it's Temple:

The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

Revelation 17
16 And the ten Horns which thou saw and the Beast, These shall be hating the harlot,
and They shall be making Her desolate<2049> and naked,
and the fleshes of Her they shall be eating<5315>
and shall be burning<2618> Her in fire.
18 and the Woman whom thou saw is being the great City,
the one having a kingdom<932> over the kings of the land.’

Revelation 18:
18 And they cried<2896>, observing the smoke of Her burning, saying, "What like to the great City?"
19 and they cast dust upon their heads, and crie, lamenting, weeping and mourning, saying,
"Woe! woe! the great City! in which are rich all those having ships in the sea, out of Her preciousness<5094>,
for to one hour was She was desolated<2049>.
========================
The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

Meanwhile the horrors of famine grew still more melancholy and afflictive.
The Jews, for of food were at length compelled to eat their belts, their sandals, the skins of their shields, dried grass, and even the ordure of oxen. In the depth or this horrible extremity, a Jewess of noble family urged by the intolerable cravings of hunger, slew her infant child, and prepared it for a meal ; and had actually eaten one half thereof, when the soldiers, allured by tile smell of food, threatened her with instant death if she refused to discover it. 'Intimidated by this menace, she immediately produced the remains of her son, which petrified them with horror. At the recital of this melancholy and affecting occurrence, the whole city stood aghast, and poured forth their congratulations on those whom death had hurried away from such heartrending scenes. Indeed, humanity at once shudders and sickens at the narration, nor can any one of the least sensibility reflect upon the pitiable condition to which the female part of the inhabitants of Jerusalem must at this time have been reduced, without experiencing the tenderest emotions of sympathy, or refrain from tears while he reads our SAVIOUR'S pathetic address to the women who " bewailed him" as he was led to Calvary, wherein he evidently refers to these very calamities : "Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but for yourselves and fur your children ; for, behold, the days are coming in which they shall say, 'Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the breasts that never gave suck." Luke xxiii. 29...............

The mournful and desolate condition of Judea, at this time, is exactly described by the prophet Isaiah, in the following of his prophecy : "The cities were without inhabitant, and the houses without a man, and the land was utterly desolate, and the LORD had removed men far away, and there was a great forsaking in the midst of the land." (Isa. vi. 11, 12.)

In executing the command of Titus, relative to the demolition of Jerusalem, the Roman soldiers not only threw down the buildings, but even dug up their foundations, and so completely levelled the whole circuit of the city, that a stranger would scarcely have known that it had ever been inhabited by human beings. Thus was this great City, which only five months before, had been crowded with nearly two millions of people, who gloried in its impregnable strength, entirely depopulated, and levelled with the ground.

 

[Grip Docility]

There is no "end of the whole world" in Revelation. You are in gross error and teaching falsehood........

Tho to the 1st century Jews of the holocaust in 70ad, it did indeed appear to be the "end of the world".

Revelation concerns a Great City.........OC Jerusalem and it's Temple:

The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

Revelation 17
16 And the ten Horns which thou saw and the Beast, These shall be hating the harlot,
and They shall be making Her desolate<2049> and naked,
and the fleshes of Her they shall be eating<5315>
and shall be burning<2618> Her in fire.
18 and the Woman whom thou saw is being the great City,
the one having a kingdom<932> over the kings of the land.’

Revelation 18:
18 And they cried<2896>, observing the smoke of Her burning, saying, "What like to the great City?"
19 and they cast dust upon their heads, and crie, lamenting, weeping and mourning, saying,
"Woe! woe! the great City! in which are rich all those having ships in the sea, out of Her preciousness<5094>,
for to one hour was She was desolated<2049>.
========================

This thread isn't really about the end of the world. It's about the misuse of Israel that has been going on.

I only brought it up because of the idea that 70 AD is used to deny Israels restoration that is clearly in scripture.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

This thread isn't really about the end of the world. It's about the misuse of Israel that has been going on.

I only brought it up because of the idea that 70 AD is used to deny Israels restoration that is clearly in scripture.

There are so many RT threads on CF, they should make a separate board on the Dispensationalism board for them..........

replacement theology christian forums site:www.christianforums.com - Google Search

Please Stop Saying "Replacement Theology"

The term "replacement theology" is not helpful because:

1. It is uncharitable. It does not seek to listen to or understand covenant theology, but rather to dismiss it without giving it a proper hearing.
   
   
2. It is pejorative. It's meant to cause harm by making our views seem ridiculous and not worthy of consideration.
   
   
3. It is not accurate. No one would assume this label for themselves because no one believes that the church has "replaced" Israel. When this label is used, what comes across is that our views have not really been understood and the person that we're communicating with does not care to take the time to understand our views.

So please stop using the term "replacement theology". Thanks!

 

[Grip Docility]

There are so many RT threads on CF, they should make a separate board on the Dispensationalism board for them..........

replacement theology christian forums site:www.christianforums.com - Google Search

Please Stop Saying "Replacement Theology"

Do you believe the BOC has Replaced National Israel, the people of Jacob and is simultaneously called Israel?

I identified it as "Covenant/Supersession" Theology... which is a distinguishing difference and allows people to more accurately search this matter out.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Do you believe the BOC has Replaced National Israel, the people of Jacob and is simultaneously called Israel?

I don't think about it............And I am not sure whether I agree or not with the thread below on the Dispy board "national israel is cursed forever" and why I avoid that "controversial board"

[And with that, I withdraw from this "dead horse" thread.......]

Edit to add......I wrapped the post in quotes because of it's length.

National Israel is cursed forever !

National Israel is cursed forever ! (2)

quote OP:

Mk 11:
11And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve.
12And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry:
13And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.

14And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.

The nation of Israel at one time in world history was representive of Gods covenant people here on earth and had many spiritual advantages over and above all other nations of the world..rom 3:

1What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

2Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

The oracles of God, meaning in short, important spiritual matters of the True God..

rom 9:

3For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

4Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;

Much had been given to them as a nation in order to preserve her seperated from all other nations, in order for the messiah, to be born under Gods Law, to die the accursed for the seed of abraham..

Now Israels history as the special covenant people of God is riddled with unfaithfulness to God and apostacy, however, God tolerated her exisitnce up unto the promised seed was born, lived and died under the Law..

After the death of christ, of which national Israel was the chief culprit in bringing about, God Judged that nation as unworthy of eternal life acts 13:

45But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy, and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul, contradicting and blaspheming.

46Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.

This is here a final confirmation of God rejecting and leaving israel, the etnic jews under His Judgement..

This is confirmed too in matt 21:

33Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:

34And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.

35And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.

36Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.

37But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.

38But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.

39And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.

40When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?

41They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

42Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

43Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

israel as a nation , ethnic wise, had lost her distinction and spiritual privileges of being that nation that represented the kingdom of God on earth, and that privilege was being granted to a nation, the gentile church, which would bear that precious spiritual fruit unto God..This is too expressed in rom 11:

15For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

They have been cast away..and this casting away is final, as far as nationally is concerned, but not individually..but national Israel who, because of her favoured position, should have bore fruit, because of the outward advantages, which the fig tree indicated, but did not bear fruit, God cursed that nation, and that forever..

14And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.

National Israel will never again have spiritual significance in this world, all those advantages are forever forfieted, but this was always part of Gods eternal plan and purpose for that people..

matt 21:
42Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
43Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof

It was the Lords doings, and as the wise man says:

ecc 3:
14I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him.

National Israel's rejection and curse is final.

 

[Grip Docility]

I think it's time Modern Dispensation and Reformed theology, blended with Post 500AD Mother Church theology... stop defining Romans 9-11 for people, and the BOC can more thoroughly understand it's importance, in special lite of the Modern Israel that resides in it's biblical land, again.

 

[Grip Docility]

I don't think about it............And I am not sure whether I agree or not with the thread below on the Dispy board "national israel is cursed forever" and why I avoid that "controversial board"

[And with that, I withdraw from this "dead horse" thread.......]

National Israel is cursed forever !

National Israel is cursed forever ! (2)

Mk 11:

11And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve.

12And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry:
13And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.

14And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.

The nation of Israel at one time in world history was representive of Gods covenant people here on earth and had many spiritual advantages over and above all other nations of the world..rom 3:

1What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?

2Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

The oracles of God, meaning in short, important spiritual matters of the True God..

rom 9:

3For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

4Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;

Much had been given to them as a nation in order to preserve her seperated from all other nations, in order for the messiah, to be born under Gods Law, to die the accursed for the seed of abraham..

Now Israels history as the special covenant people of God is riddled with unfaithfulness to God and apostacy, however, God tolerated her exisitnce up unto the promised seed was born, lived and died under the Law..

After the death of christ, of which national Israel was the chief culprit in bringing about, God Judged that nation as unworthy of eternal life acts 13:

45But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy, and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul, contradicting and blaspheming.

46Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.

This is here a final confirmation of God rejecting and leaving israel, the etnic jews under His Judgement..

This is confirmed too in matt 21:

33Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:

34And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.

35And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.

36Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.

37But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.

38But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.

39And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.

40When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?

41They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

42Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

43Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

israel as a nation , ethnic wise, had lost her distinction and spiritual privileges of being that nation that represented the kingdom of God on earth, and that privilege was being granted to a nation, the gentile church, which would bear that precious spiritual fruit unto God..This is too expressed in rom 11:

15For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

They have been cast away..and this casting away is final, as far as nationally is concerned, but not individually..but national Israel who, because of her favoured position, should have bore fruit, because of the outward advantages, which the fig tree indicated, but did not bear fruit, God cursed that nation, and that forever..

14And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.

National Israel will never again have spiritual significance in this world, all those advantages are forever forfieted, but this was always part of Gods eternal plan and purpose for that people..

matt 21:

42Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

43Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

It was the Lords doings, and as the wise man says:

ecc 3:

14I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him.

National Israel's rejection and curse is final.

I appreciate all of your excellent counter points... I also state that Romans 11 disagrees that Israel is forever condemned... as well as Acts of the Apostles 1