Did the event of 1948 Israel fulfill any Bible prophecy?

[jgr]

Everything will be Christ's after he returns.

The verses I cited are all present tense. They were already true when they were written.

No waiting required.

 

[miamited]

Hi lulav,

Thanks for your response. You responded:

Because he was pure like Noah was, the only choice to bring through the Messiah.

While I appreciate that they 'may' have been the reason that God chose Abram, there isn't any Scriptural evidence that it was the reason that God chose him. The account of Abram just pops up in the narrative as a descendant of Terah, but there are no indicators that he was particularly more 'religious' about the one true and living God than Lot or any of the other male descendants that are mentioned in the genealogy from Shem to Noah.

Once God addressed and began to work with Abram, yes, we find that Abram was fairly faithful. However, all of this came about after God made Himself known to Abram. Had God made Himself known to Lot in the same way, Lot may also have been found faithful. So, I stand by my claim that we really don't know 'why' God chose Abram. We can speculate, but that would be as far as we can go in offering up any verifiable reason that God chose Abram.

For that matter, we really don't even know why God waited until the sons of Terah were born to call a man to know Him. Can anyone find any reason, given in the Scriptures, that God didn't call one of the sons of Nahor? Why didn't God call Terah?

Now, I'm certainly not arguing that Abram was any kind of wrong or bad choice. God calls who God calls. Yes, when God begins to tell us about Noah, God tells us that Noah was a righteous man as one of the first things that we know that God sees in Noah. It just isn't the same in God's calling of Abram.

God bless,
In Christ, ted

 

[Grip Docility]

That does play into it somewhat. The one thing that made Noah and his family the only ones worthy. And it wasn't because he was spiritually perfect, as we see later after the flood. Folks that get falling down drunk while butt naked are not usually those that we would call "pillars of the community" and giants of the faith.

Humorous thought... If I had just built an Ark out of faith, and God's direction, told the entire human race to hop in or die... and realized the whole human race, other than myself and 7 others had died...

I would probably get hammered, too.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Scripture?

Galatians 3:29 does not include the word "only".

Genesis 49 reveals the birthright promise going to Joseph, not Jesus.

22 "Joseph is a fruitful bough, even a fruitful bough by a well; whose branches run over the wall:

23 The archers have sorely grieved him, and shot at him, and hated him:

24 But his bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty God of Jacob; (from thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel

25 Even by the God of thy father, who shall help thee; and by the Almighty, who shall bless thee with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lieth under, blessings of the breasts, and of the womb:

26 The blessings of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills: they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren."

This occurs in the "latter days", after Christ.

 

[jgr]

Yup,

And that blood is Jewish blood!

So were these:


Matthew 23:33
Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

John 8:44a
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.


Their Jewish blood couldn't save them.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

So "all the promises" doesn't mean "all the promises".

Whose Bible are you reading from?

The Jews of today are still waiting on Yahweh to fulfill the coming of the promised Messiah.......they have waited about 2000yrs, so what's another 2000yrs.......

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us!
when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952> and full-end<4930> of the Age?

Peter brings this up to the Jews:

2 Peter 3:4 and saying, 'Where is the promise of his parousia <3952>?
for since the fathers did fall asleep, all things so remain from the beginning of the creation;'

James says it is near......did James deceive the 1st century elect Christian Jews?

James 5:8
be ye patient! also stand-fast! the hearts of ye, that the parousia <3952> of the Lord has-neared/hggiken <1448> (5758);
======================================
Brings to mind this thread:

What is the "Parousia" in the New Testament

Why is Matthew 24 the only place in the Gospels that uses the unique word "3952"

 

[jgr]

Genesis 49 reveals the birthright promise going to Joseph, not Jesus.

22 "Joseph is a fruitful bough, even a fruitful bough by a well; whose branches run over the wall:

23 The archers have sorely grieved him, and shot at him, and hated him:

24 But his bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty God of Jacob; (from thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel

25 Even by the God of thy father, who shall help thee; and by the Almighty, who shall bless thee with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lieth under, blessings of the breasts, and of the womb:

26 The blessings of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills: they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren."

Where does Joseph appear in 2 Corinthians 1:20?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Where does Joseph appear in 2 Corinthians 1:20?

I think you're beating dead horse here.

 

[jgr]

I think you're beating dead horse here.

In God's New Will and Testament, all covenants and promises are fulfilled in Christ and those who are in Christ.

The OT covenants and promises are the promissory clauses of God's Old Will and Testament, and they are both revoked and fulfilled in the promissory clauses of His New Will and Testament, written in the Blood of His Son Jesus Christ, the Divine Testator, coming into full force and effect upon His death.

If you have made your own Will and Testament, you will see that the very first clause states the following or its equivalent:

"I HEREBY REVOKE all former Wills and other testamentary dispositions by me at any time therefore made and declare this to be my Last Will and Testament."

This means that all former wills and testaments, and all of their promissory clauses in their entirety, are completely null and void. In their place, the promissory clauses of the current last new will and testament are the only ones in force and effect. Any promissory clause which appeared in the old will and testament, but does not appear in the new will and testament, is irrevocably null and void unless yet another new will and testament is made which re-includes it.

Thus we see:

Hebrews 9
15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

Hebrews 10
9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

Hebrews 8
13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

God`s New Will and Testament is everlasting:

Hebrews 13
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant.

There is none greater.

We see other new promissory clauses of the New Will and Testament in:

Matthew 21:33-45
In this parable, the son, who is identified as the heir, typifies Christ.

Galatians 3:16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

2 Corinthians 1:20
For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Hebrews 1:1,2
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

In them, we see that the Heir and Beneficiary is Christ alone, that all of the promises are affirmed and confirmed in Him, and that He is Heir of all things. All includes the OT land promises, the restoration promises, the blessings promises, and all else. There are no exceptions.

And His New Will and Testament contains even better promises:

Hebrews 8
6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

Such as:

Hebrews 11
16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

Additional promissory clauses in...:

Romans 8:16-17
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Galatians 3:29
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

...make us who are in Christ joint heirs with Him.

But notice:
There are no promissory clauses for anyone, Jew or Gentile, who is not in Christ.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

In God's New Will and Testament, all covenants and promises are fulfilled in Christ and those who are in Christ.
Galatians 3:29
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
...make us who are in Christ joint heirs with Him.
There are no promissory clauses for anyone, Jew or Gentile, who is not in Christ.

Correct.
Revelation 14:12 includes "and the faith of Jesus"

Luke 21:24
And they shall be falling to mouth of sword and they shall be being led captive into all the nations............[Revelation 13:10]

Rev 14:12
Here is the patience/endurance<5281> of the Saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus

Revelation 13:10
If any to-captivity, into captivity is going away.
If any in sword to be killed, is binding him in sword to be killed.
Here is the patience/endurance<5281> and the faith of the Saints.[Luke 21:24]

G5281 (NKJV)
G5281 ὑπομονή (hypomonē), occurs 32 times in 31 verses

5281. hupomone hoop-om-on-ay' from 5278;
cheerful (or hopeful) endurance, constancy:--enduring, patience, patient continuance (waiting).

 

[Dave L]

But when did the 1000 years start so that we know when Satan was released to start his attacks?

The 1000 years are a symbol for Satan's binding. They are not literal years.

 

[Dave L]

So like you assume it will be? I never stated what I assume it will be. I only made the comment that it must have some feature that no other period from then to now had so we could distinguish that end is upon us. I am pretty sure of what was going on in Noah's day that caused Yahweh to eliminate all land life on the planet. And since Yeshua said it would be like Noah's day, then that unique characteristic of Noah's day must be in view.

It will be just as today, as in Noah's day.

 

[Dave L]

Abraham isn't Jacob! Romans 11 Specifies Jacob for a Reason!

It is sloppy exegesis to confuse Abraham with Jacob!

Abraham is to the New Jerusalem (Through Jesus)
Jacob is to the Current Jerusalem (Through Jacob's descendants)

This is elementary! Nowhere is scripture, and I mean NOWHERE does it say otherwise!

Jacob is to "Thy Seeds"
Abraham is to "Thy Seed (Singular)" <- Paul affirms this!

Israel started the BOC! Israel became the first fruits of the BOC... Because all lose identity in Jesus... Just as scripture says... and Ephesians 2 Affirms, Jews carnally remain Jews within the BOC, but lose their identity "Spiritually", in Christ, and are Merely part of the BOC!

If the BOC were Israel, it would be a WIDOW! Israel Divorced it's Husband and forsook it's King.

Do you Forsake your King?

Israel is WAITING for it's King. The BOC is One with it's King! How is this complicated?

Apples aren't Oranges!

Jacob isn't Abraham! How in the Sheol do people get this so mixed up!

I'll tell you... Disturbed theology that attempts to exalt itself as the Truth (When Jesus IS the Truth) had to hijack Israel's election to make it's false premises fit!

Make a list of fringe Theology and I promise you... and I mean PROMISE you... that Suppression is at it's core.

Jesus is Israel according to Matthew and Paul. Also those who believe in him.

 

[Dave L]

Israel was the mechanism that God used to raise up His (100% Human/100% God) Incarnation's Mother.

Israel is God the Father's Bride and God the Son's Mother.

You're failing to understand the purpose of the New Covenant.

Could God Forgive Sin before Jesus died on the Cross?

Jesus is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. God trusts himself not to welsh on his plan.

 

[Copperhead]

Being blithely unaware of our miserable moral condition, and in fact reveling in it.

Not good enough. That is something that many periods of history could lay claim too.

 

[Copperhead]

Humorous thought... If I had just built an Ark out of faith, and God's direction, told the entire human race to hop in or die... and realized the whole human race, other than myself and 7 others had died...

I would probably get hammered, too.

LOL. But there was something totally unique that distinguished Noah and his family from the rest of the world. And based on Noah's performance later, it was not spiritual in nature.

The Lord was gong to have to do a reboot on the human race. That would require people that were "tamiym" or unblemished physically. Tamiym is the word used to describe Noah. It is also the word used to describe an unblemished animal for sacrifice. It is a physical description not a spiritual one.

Given the events of Genesis 6, it would seem the entirety of the human race had become blemished physically.... genetically tainted. The event description in the early text of Genesis 6 suggests that idea. And many Hebrew writings like the Targums on Genesis suggest the same idea. The non canonical book of Enoch suggests that also.

It is possible that this will be the characteristic of the mark of the beast yet future and why all those who take the mark are condemned with no apparent option of repentance. Genetic manipulation is in view. And Daniel 2:43 could be alluding to this very idea of the latter days.....

Daniel 2:43 (NKJV) As you saw iron mixed with ceramic clay, they will mingle with the seed of men; but they will not adhere to one another, just as iron does not mix with clay

For the passage to have any realistic meaning, whoever is mixing their seed with the seed of men must be something other than the seed of men. Something strange like what happened in Noah's day is being described by Daniel. And I am convinced that is what Yeshua was pointing to when He said it would be as the days of Noah. if you look at the original Greek regarding the eating and drinking Yeshua mentioned, there is an illusion to cannibalism and drinking blood. Again, similar to the description of such things about Genesis in Enoch and other sources.

 

[Grip Docility]

LOL. But there was something totally unique that distinguished Noah and his family from the rest of the world. And based on Noah's performance later, it was not spiritual in nature.

The Lord was gong to have to do a reboot on the human race. That would require people that were "tamiym" or unblemished physically. Tamiym is the word used to describe Noah. It is also the word used to describe an unblemished animal for sacrifice. It is a physical description not a spiritual one.

Given the events of Genesis 6, it would seem the entirety of the human race had become blemished physically.... genetically tainted. The event description in the early text of Genesis 6 suggests that idea. And many Hebrew writings like the Targums on Genesis suggest the same idea. The non canonical book of Enoch suggests that also.

It is possible that this will be the characteristic of the mark of the beast yet future and why all those who take the mark are condemned with no apparent option of repentance. Genetic manipulation is in view. And Daniel 2:43 could be alluding to this very idea of the latter days.....

Daniel 2:43 (NKJV) As you saw iron mixed with ceramic clay, they will mingle with the seed of men; but they will not adhere to one another, just as iron does not mix with clay

For the passage to have any realistic meaning, whoever is mixing their seed with the seed of men must be something other than the seed of men. Something strange like what happened in Noah's day is being described by Daniel. And I am convinced that is what Yeshua was pointing to when He said it would be as the days of Noah. if you look at the original Greek regarding the eating and drinking Yeshua mentioned, there is an illusion to cannibalism and drinking blood. Again, similar to the description of such things about Genesis in Enoch and other sources.

I was picking up on Enoch... in your inference. I know the places we find all the words to deliberate this matter.

One thing is for certain... because the dispensation of Angels was ended upon Christ’s DBR, the idea that people will again dwell where Angels May have free reign to do as they once did, for even a short while, will make for some seriously supernatural occurrences.

There won’t be a single Atheist left on the face of the earth.

 

[Copperhead]

There won’t be a single Atheist left on the face of the earth.

You bet. Everything in scripture about that time gives no indication that the atheist game will be in play. Kind of along the line of soldiers in battle... there are no atheists in foxholes.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

I was picking up on Enoch... in your inference. I know the places we find all the words to deliberate this matter.

One thing is for certain... because the dispensation of Angels was ended upon Christ’s DBR, the idea that people will again dwell where Angels May have free reign to do as they once did, for even a short while, will make for some seriously supernatural occurrences.

There won’t be a single Atheist left on the face of the earth.

I read thru it just 1 time about a decade ago and what most got my interest was the 10 weeks in it.
Here are a few links to Enoch on CF:

The 10 weeks of Enoch, inspired or not?
10 weeks of Enoch

Enoch. The prophecy of the 10 weeks

3. And Enoch began to recount from the books and said;
I was born the seventh in the first week,
While judgement and righteousness still endured.
4. And after me there shall arise in the second week great wickedness,
And deceit shall have sprung up;
And in it there shall be the first end. And in it a man shall be saved;
And after it is ended unrighteousness shall grow up;
And a law shall be made for the sinners.
5. And after that in the third week at it’s close
A man shall be elected as the plant of righteous Judgement.
And his posterity shall become the plant of righteousness for evermore.
6. And after that in the fourth week, at it’s close,
Visions of the holy and righteous shall be seen.
And a law for all generations and an enclosure shall be made for them.
7. And after that in the fifth week, at it’s close,
The house of glory and dominion shall be built for ever.
8. And after that in the sixth week all who live in it shall be blinded,
And the hearts of all of them shall godlessly forsake wisdom.
And in it a man shall ascend; and at it’s close the house of dominion shall be burnt with fire,
And the race of the chosen root shall be dispersed.
9. And after that in the seventh week shall an apostate generation arise,
and many shall be it’s deeds, And all it’s deed shall be apostate.
10. And at it’s close shall be elected The elect righteous of the eternal plant of righteousness,
To receive sevenfold instruction concerning all His creation.

12. And after that there shall be another, the eighth week, that of righteousness,
And a sword shall be given to it that a righteous Judgement may be executed on the oppressors,
And the sinners shall be delivered into the hands of the righteous.
13. And at it’s close they shall acquire houses through their righteousness,
And a house shall be built for the Great King in glory for evermore,
And all mankind shall look to the path of uprightness.
14. And after that in the ninth week, the righteous judgment
shall be revealed to the whole world,
And all the works of the godless shall vanish from all the earth.
And the world shall be written down for destruction.
15. And after this, in the tenth week in the seventh part,
There shall be the great eternal judgement, in which
He will execute vengeance amongst the angels.
16. And the first heaven shall depart and pass away,
and a new heaven shall appear, and all the powers of the heavens shall give sevenfold light.
17. And after that there will be many weeks without number forever.

This is the end of the Apocalypse of the ten weeks.
As you can see, like all the prophecies of God it is coming to pass exactly as it was supposed to. God is still in charge. Here we have yet another word from God that this is the time all the world has been waiting for. .......................
========================================
There is an interesting thread on rock formations resembling giants and Enoch was brought up.
What is nice about the vid is, you can listen to it while still browsing the web and forum......

Here is the link to post which has it:

Mountains were giants (cool pics!)

Not "most" of them like this says, I'd wager...
If you want to skip the bible texts and whatever other intro text there is, go to 3&1/2 minutes in:

This Ethiopic version of the Book of Enoch is deemed by scholars to be older by several centuries than the Slavonic one, and portions of that older version are in turn known to have been based on Keepers of the Secrets 129 even older manuscripts, such as a lost Book of Noah. Fragments of the Enoch books were discovered among the Dead Sea scrolls. The astronomical-calendrical tale of Enoch thus goes back into great antiquity - perhaps, as the Bible asserts, to pre-Diluvial times. ~ Z.S.

 

[Douggg]

I read thru it just 1 time about a decade ago and what most got my interest was the 10 weeks in it.
Here are a few links to Enoch on CF:

The 10 weeks of Enoch, inspired or not?
10 weeks of Enoch

Enoch. The prophecy of the 10 weeks

3. And Enoch began to recount from the books and said;
I was born the seventh in the first week,
While judgement and righteousness still endured.
4. And after me there shall arise in the second week great wickedness,
And deceit shall have sprung up;
And in it there shall be the first end. And in it a man shall be saved;
And after it is ended unrighteousness shall grow up;
And a law shall be made for the sinners.
5. And after that in the third week at it’s close
A man shall be elected as the plant of righteous Judgement.
And his posterity shall become the plant of righteousness for evermore.
6. And after that in the fourth week, at it’s close,
Visions of the holy and righteous shall be seen.
And a law for all generations and an enclosure shall be made for them.
7. And after that in the fifth week, at it’s close,
The house of glory and dominion shall be built for ever.
8. And after that in the sixth week all who live in it shall be blinded,
And the hearts of all of them shall godlessly forsake wisdom.
And in it a man shall ascend; and at it’s close the house of dominion shall be burnt with fire,
And the race of the chosen root shall be dispersed.
9. And after that in the seventh week shall an apostate generation arise,
and many shall be it’s deeds, And all it’s deed shall be apostate.
10. And at it’s close shall be elected The elect righteous of the eternal plant of righteousness,
To receive sevenfold instruction concerning all His creation.

12. And after that there shall be another, the eighth week, that of righteousness,
And a sword shall be given to it that a righteous Judgement may be executed on the oppressors,
And the sinners shall be delivered into the hands of the righteous.
13. And at it’s close they shall acquire houses through their righteousness,
And a house shall be built for the Great King in glory for evermore,
And all mankind shall look to the path of uprightness.
14. And after that in the ninth week, the righteous judgment
shall be revealed to the whole world,
And all the works of the godless shall vanish from all the earth.
And the world shall be written down for destruction.
15. And after this, in the tenth week in the seventh part,
There shall be the great eternal judgement, in which
He will execute vengeance amongst the angels.
16. And the first heaven shall depart and pass away,
and a new heaven shall appear, and all the powers of the heavens shall give sevenfold light.
17. And after that there will be many weeks without number forever.

This is the end of the Apocalypse of the ten weeks.
As you can see, like all the prophecies of God it is coming to pass exactly as it was supposed to. God is still in charge. Here we have yet another word from God that this is the time all the world has been waiting for. .......................
========================================
There is an interesting thread on rock formations resembling giants and Enoch was brought up.
What is nice about the vid is, you can listen to it while still browsing the web and forum......

Here is the link to post which has it:

Mountains were giants (cool pics!)




This Ethiopic version of the Book of Enoch is deemed by scholars to be older by several centuries than the Slavonic one, and portions of that older version are in turn known to have been based on Keepers of the Secrets 129 even older manuscripts, such as a lost Book of Noah. Fragments of the Enoch books were discovered among the Dead Sea scrolls. The astronomical-calendrical tale of Enoch thus goes back into great antiquity - perhaps, as the Bible asserts, to pre-Diluvial times. ~ Z.S.

You may have missed one of my posts, which I requested this. But could you do a companion thread (poll)regarding Jerusalem back in the hands of the Jews 1967 as fulfilling bible prophecy?