The bible is not pratical

Alithis

Disciple of Jesus .
Nov 11, 2010
15,750
2,180
Mobile
✟94,492.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What you're talking about is a very thin line and that line will get crossed a lot if you work for certain agencies for any government. If someone commits fornication for the government, because it is part of the work, it is still a sin. I have family that has done this, I was going to be a part of this, but I decided not too. They wanted me to have sex with people, to get close to them.
? The world does not follow know or serve God.
We are to abide by the law of the land peaceably. in so much as it does not call upon us to violate the word of God.
 
Upvote 0

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 28, 2017
3,779
2,856
Arizona
✟529,714.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
The Roman soldiers were just "Serving Their Country" and "Following Orders" and "Just Doing Their Job" right ?

Imagine them trying to defend their actions in the name of Nationalism standing in front of God on judgement day:



 
Upvote 0

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 28, 2017
3,779
2,856
Arizona
✟529,714.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
I was "Serving My Country"
I was "Just Doing My Job"
I was "Just Following Orders"
Etc.






Wounded-Knee.jpg

 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

TRVL ONE

Active Member
May 14, 2019
276
42
48
Austin
✟3,685.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Show me where in The New Testament and in The New Covenant where God tells people to lie.

Also, try giving that as an excuse at The Judgement Seat Of Christ and see how well that works out for you:


Throne%2B%26%2BScrolls%2B%2B850W.jpg

I don't recommend it, but I gave you an example in the OT. Now, the argument comes, is the OT no longer valid for anything? What do we follow from the OT still?

Do you not read the OT? Is it no longer useful for anything?
 
Upvote 0

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 28, 2017
3,779
2,856
Arizona
✟529,714.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
I don't recommend it, but I gave you an example in the OT. Now, the argument comes, is the OT no longer valid for anything? What do we follow from the OT still?

Do you not read the OT? Is it no longer useful for anything?


I'm still waiting for you to show me in The New Testament where God says to lie.

People using the Old Testament for Polygamy and other stuff isn't going to cut it on Judgement Day.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: trulytheone
Upvote 0

Tree of Life

Hide The Pain
Feb 15, 2013
8,824
6,243
✟48,077.00
Country
United States
Faith
Reformed
Marital Status
Married
With warfare I agree, God himself told the Israelites to set up an ambush. However; when you control a government so loosely that you have to sin to catch criminals, that is too much. People even have sex with people to get close to them in our government, I know because I was recruited to do this and I refused.

That would be an appropriate thing to refuse. But working under cover, generally speaking, may not be a sinful thing.
 
Upvote 0

TRVL ONE

Active Member
May 14, 2019
276
42
48
Austin
✟3,685.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
That would be an appropriate thing to refuse. But working under cover, generally speaking, may not be a sinful thing.

It might not be sinful all the time, it is not like the government is going to reveal to the world all they do.
 
Upvote 0

TRVL ONE

Active Member
May 14, 2019
276
42
48
Austin
✟3,685.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
I'm still waiting for you to show me in The New Testament where God says to lie.

People using the Old Testament for Polygamy and other stuff isn't going to cut it on Judgement Day.

There might not be any place in the NT that promotes lying. It sounds like you don't believe the Old Testament is useful anymore?

2 Timothy 3:16
New International Version
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

New Living Translation
All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right.
 
Upvote 0

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 28, 2017
3,779
2,856
Arizona
✟529,714.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
There might not be any place in the NT that promotes lying. It sounds like you don't believe the Old Testament is useful anymore?

2 Timothy 3:16
New International Version
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

New Living Translation
All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right.


This is my answer :

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, AND ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone,....
• Revelation 21:8


This includes Priests and Pastors that secretly work for intelligence agencies, have ulterior motives for ministry, hidden agendas or a secret allegiance to other organizations like political parties, illuminati, freemasonry, The Rosicrucians, Communism, fraternities and sororities Etc.

Masonic Fraternity - Questions & Answers

Freemasonry: Official Statement of the Church of Greece (1933)

Freemasonry in American Orthodox history - Orthodox History



This happened a lot with in the clergy during Communism:



 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

topher694

Go Turtle!
Jan 29, 2019
3,828
3,038
St. Cloud, MN
✟186,760.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
This is my answer :

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, AND ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone,....
• Revelation 21:8


This includes Priests and Pastors that secretly work for intelligence agencies, have ulterior motives for ministry, hidden agendas or a secret allegiance to other organizations Etc.

This happened a lot with in the clergy during Communism:


Aaaaaaand, they should all repent and be saved and embrace the love of our savior, Jesus. Who loves them. And died for them. And rose for them.

(you're welcome... again)
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 28, 2017
3,779
2,856
Arizona
✟529,714.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Aaaaaaand, they should all repent and be saved and embrace the love of our savior, Jesus. Who loves them. And died for them. And rose for them.

(you're welcome... again)


"Some" of them have already crossed the line of no return and don't even have the ability to repent and be saved or even the desire to be saved.


but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit Never Has Forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation"--
• Mark 3:29
 
Upvote 0

topher694

Go Turtle!
Jan 29, 2019
3,828
3,038
St. Cloud, MN
✟186,760.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
"Some" of them have already crossed the line of no return and don't even have the ability to repent and be saved or even the desire to be saved.


but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit Never Has Forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation"--
• Mark 3:29
Cool, so let's rub some salt in their wounds, bash them and condemn them. That'll be fun! It won't change anything, but it will probably make us feel better about ourselves. Great idea!
 
  • Agree
Reactions: tripleseven
Upvote 0

Andrew77

The walking accident
Supporter
Feb 11, 2018
1,912
1,242
Ohio
✟138,616.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Constitution
Are you saying you don't want criminals to get caught? How else can it be done without sinning?

I think I'm in the camp that officers should not be doing undercover police work.

Pay a guy off to testify. Use the witness protection program. Hire one of the users to take a camera in. Tap the phones. Get a search warrant.

There are so many dozens of ways to catch criminals, and deal with criminal gangs and mafia stuff. Yes, going undercover is one of them... but it's only one of them. I'd rather we not have professional liars, paid for by the public, who go around deceiving everyone.

That said, I think some of the Christians here, have correctly pointed out that there are times where people lied in the Bible, and it was ok while confronting evil.

While I don't deny their point, I'm not a big fan of that argument.

However, I will say that we could solve a ton of this, if we simply had a more effective enforcement of the law, and more clear penalties for violating the law. If we put every single drug trafficking idiot, in the electric chair, and fried them.... we would not have drug cartels to put undercover cops in. It's that simple. If we enforced the law, with the level of punishment needed, the crime would stop.
 
Upvote 0

StephenDiscipleofYHWH

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2018
1,483
378
28
Ransom county
✟69,666.00
Country
United States
Faith
Apostolic
Marital Status
Single
In order to catch criminals undercover cops have to lie, deceive and often times cuss. They have to sin in order to catch criminals, which means that the bible is useless.

If we did things the way the bible tells, criminals would never get caught.
Police and Law enforcement serve the Governments of the world and not God. There will always be wicked men paid by the Governments(and swearing allegiance to them) of this world to catch other wicked men.

Every man who transgresses the Law of Christ is judged and punished accordingly by the Lord, not one man escaped his wrath and his judgment. God has a 100% success rate in catching criminals and punishing them. If someone harms a child of God the Lord avenges us in ways that we would never have been able to do, and his judgment is never greater than the crime committed. His judgment is always just.

So if we follow the Lord every criminal will be caught and punished, everyone who harms us will be recompensed by the Lord.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

TRVL ONE

Active Member
May 14, 2019
276
42
48
Austin
✟3,685.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
This is my answer :

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, AND ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone,....
• Revelation 21:8


This includes Priests and Pastors that secretly work for intelligence agencies, have ulterior motives for ministry, hidden agendas or a secret allegiance to other organizations like political parties, illuminati, freemasonry, The Rosicrucians, Communism, fraternities and sororities Etc.

Masonic Fraternity - Questions & Answers

Freemasonry: Official Statement of the Church of Greece (1933)

Freemasonry in American Orthodox history - Orthodox History



This happened a lot with in the clergy during Communism:


Cool, so let's rub some salt in their wounds, bash them and condemn them. That'll be fun! It won't change anything, but it will probably make us feel better about ourselves. Great idea!

If you stick with this belief, you certainly don'thae to worry about sin


Jude 1:22-23.
Be merciful to those who doubt; save others by snatching them from the fire; to others show mercy, mixed with fear--hating even the clothing stained by corrupted flesh.

I believe some people take a different approach. Try kindness first and if that doesn't work get tough on them. Jesus wasn't always nice to people.

Matthew 23:33
"You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?
 
  • Like
Reactions: topher694
Upvote 0

Loversofjesus_2018

Well-Known Member
Nov 13, 2018
653
198
33
West coast
✟32,008.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Undercover law enforcement officers are playing a roll when they lie, or deceive a criminal to obtain information to convict them. This is to protect the public and possibly save the life of the criminal also. God knows the heart, yes scripture says he searches the heart and tries the reins. When you ride a horse you can try the reins and find out how the horse is on the inside, calm, feeling wild, healthy or not. So, God knows why they may lie or cuss, it does not come from their heart. The ends, protecting the innocent, justifies the means.
This outlook can be problematic
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

StephenDiscipleofYHWH

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2018
1,483
378
28
Ransom county
✟69,666.00
Country
United States
Faith
Apostolic
Marital Status
Single
In war, killing is not murder, so it makes perfect sense to me, the war on crime would be similar in that exceptions to rules are allowed.
No allowance is made for harming another man. Nowhere in the NT under grace do we find an occasion for killing. We only find that we are to lay down our own lives for our brethren to be killed all the day long as sheep to the slaughter loving not our lives unto death. Love worketh no ill to his neighbor and to harm ones neighbor shows that you hate him. Thus breaking the command of God.

There is no exception or occasion given for lying or killing. So every servant of the world governments who does these things is damned, even if they think they are doing good.
 
Upvote 0