The bible is not pratical

[TRVL ONE]

Exodus 1:15-20 Then the king of Egypt spoke to the Hebrew midwives, one of whom was named Shiphrah and the other was named Puah; and he said, "When you are helping the Hebrew women to give birth and see them upon the birthstool, if it is a son, then you shall put him to death; but if it is a daughter, then she shall live." But the midwives feared God, and did not do as the king of Egypt had commanded them, but let the boys live. So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, "Why have you done this thing, and let the boys live?" The midwives said to Pharaoh, "Because the Hebrew women are not as the Egyptian women; for they are vigorous and give birth before the midwife can get to them." So God was good to the midwives, and the people multiplied, and became very mighty.

Are you familiar with the above passage? The Hebrew midwives lied and deceived the king of Egypt. Not only does God not say what they did was wrong, but in response to their lying and deceiving, God actually blessed them.

If lying is as black and white as you seem to be suggesting, how do you reconcile the above passage? How do you think you can relate it to undercover police?

Can you define cussing?

Can I define cussing? Can you interpret scripture?
However; you or I interpret "sinful speech,obscene speech, God's name in vain, etc, I doubt that undercover cops or their bosses care"

I have lived all my life surrounded by undercover cops and they don't care about this type of thing.

Colossians 3:8
But now you must put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene talk from your mouth.

Ephesians 5:1-33
Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children. And walk in love, as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us, a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God. But sexual immorality and all impurity or covetousness must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints. Let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place, but instead let there be thanksgiving. For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. ...
Exodus 20:7
“You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain.

Ecclesiastes 7:21-22 ESV / 10 helpful votes
Do not take to heart all the things that people say, lest you hear your servant cursing you. Your heart knows that many times you yourself have cursed others.

 

[Dave L]

Normally, Christians are not unequally yoked with unbelievers. So it's not a problem unless they ignore Paul and do so anyway.

 

[TRVL ONE]

Exodus 1:15-20 Then the king of Egypt spoke to the Hebrew midwives, one of whom was named Shiphrah and the other was named Puah; and he said, "When you are helping the Hebrew women to give birth and see them upon the birthstool, if it is a son, then you shall put him to death; but if it is a daughter, then she shall live." But the midwives feared God, and did not do as the king of Egypt had commanded them, but let the boys live. So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, "Why have you done this thing, and let the boys live?" The midwives said to Pharaoh, "Because the Hebrew women are not as the Egyptian women; for they are vigorous and give birth before the midwife can get to them." So God was good to the midwives, and the people multiplied, and became very mighty.

Are you familiar with the above passage? The Hebrew midwives lied and deceived the king of Egypt. Not only does God not say what they did was wrong, but in response to their lying and deceiving, God actually blessed them.

If lying is as black and white as you seem to be suggesting, how do you reconcile the above passage? How do you think you can relate it to undercover police?

Can you define cussing?

The bible talks about obscene talk etc. Can you define what that is? Can you define what obscene talk meant when that verse was written? There is something that is considered obscene speech, what is it? Maybe you know? Whatever it is, it does exist and it is wrong. Did the bible specificly say obscene talk means when you talk about XYZ or ZZZ or AAA or YYY, no it didn't. What is gluttony? Is it one apple too much?

 

[topher694]

Perhaps the answer here is not scripural supposition and "what if" scenarios, but rather to strengthen and deepen our own personal relationship with God so that when we personally face a real situation like this we can turn to Him to guide us, trust the answer He gives us, and lean on His strength to see it through.

 

[TRVL ONE]

Perhaps the answer here is not scripural supposition and "what if" scenarios, but rather to strengthen and deepen our own personal relationship with God so that when we personally face a real situation like this we can turn to Him to guide us, trust the answer He gives us, and lean on His strength to see it through.

That's a good point. My guess is that the bible is not part of the "Rule book" for undercover work.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

In order to catch criminals undercover cops have to lie, deceive and often times cuss. They have to sin in order to catch criminals, which means that the bible is useless.

If we did things the way the bible tells, criminals would never get caught.

You mean to tell me you can’t catch a criminal unless you’re cussing?

Rahab told the people that were after the two Israelite spies that they left her house to protect them. I’m not saying to just run with that and lie whenever you want but there are times that you can lie ie. when undercover to catch a criminal etc.

Hope that helps

 

[TRVL ONE]

You mean to tell me you can’t catch a criminal unless you’re cussing?

Rahab told the people that were after the two Israelite spies that they left her house to protect them. I’m not saying to just run with that and lie whenever you want but there are times that you can lie ie. when undercover to catch a criminal etc.

Hope that helps

In the bible there are only a few times, that God approves of any kind of deception. I don't know of anyone smart enough to define when it is okay and when it is not. It is the best practice not to.
I doubt the bible is included with the FBI,CIA, OR DEA "rule books". I don't believe they are all that concerned about sinning.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Are you saying you don't want criminals to get caught? How else can it be done without sinning?

hahaha --- wonderful question.

How did Ananias and Saphira get 'caught' ? The Apostles did not sin to catch them.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I doubt the bible is included with the FBI,CIA, OR DEA "rule books". I don't believe they are all that concerned about sinning.

As far as known, all those agencies are controlled by the 'beast', top to bottom.

i.e. not at all concerned with serving God, rather totally opposed to Him.

 

[TRVL ONE]

As far as known, all those agencies are controlled by the 'beast', top to bottom.

i.e. not at all concerned with serving God, rather totally opposed to Him.

Anti-Christ system. This is true, but I don't think everyone in government is evil. I do believe the foundation of the anti-Christ system is already present. Jesus said the anti-Christ system was around when he was here.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

In order to catch criminals undercover cops have to lie, deceive and often times cuss. They have to sin in order to catch criminals, which means that the bible is useless.

If we did things the way the bible tells, criminals would never get caught.

Every man is accountable for his own sins and will have to answer to The Lord Jesus Christ for Every Action and Word spoken in this life.

"I was just doing my job" or "I was just following orders" or "I was serving my country" isn't going to cut it on judgement day.

 

[gideon123]

OP

Your logic is false.

You say. Lies are justified because undercover cops must use them.

And the public says ... lies are justified because the political system is stupid and taxes are too high. So they are going to.lie and cheat. But just a bit of dishonesty, when nobody is looking.

And others say ... you are stupid if you left your wallet in the front seat of you car where people can see it. So they smash the window and take your money, and then they say that 'your stupidity' was to blame, and not their behavior. You were the one at fault and not them.

And that is where we are today .. a whole world filled with lies, cheating and dishonesty ... and always someone else is to blame. From top to bottom our whole society has become crooked, and you can hardly find one honest person.

But God says .. "you walk in Truth and you do not take one step to the right or the left ... or else you will never enter My Kingdom".

So it's your choice, isn't it?
You have been told the outcome - very clearly.
The same rules for everyone.

You choose.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

Undercover law enforcement officers are playing a roll when they lie, or deceive a criminal to obtain information to convict them. This is to protect the public and possibly save the life of the criminal also. God knows the heart, yes scripture says he searches the heart and tries the reins. When you ride a horse you can try the reins and find out how the horse is on the inside, calm, feeling wild, healthy or not. So, God knows why they may lie or cuss, it does not come from their heart. The ends, protecting the innocent, justifies the means.

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, Sorcerers, idolaters, AND ALL LIARS Shall Have Their Part In The Lake Which Burns With Fire And Brimstone, .....
• Revelation 21:8


Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. But outside are dogs and Sorcerers and Sexually Immoral and Murderers and Idolaters, And WHOEVER LOVES AND PRACTICES A LIE.
• Revelation 22:14-15



This includes people who harass and attack someone in secret but pretend not to be, present themselves to be someone or something that they are not, etc.

It also includes those who take part in deceiving through Psyops.

 

[steve78]

In order to catch criminals undercover cops have to lie, deceive and often times cuss. They have to sin in order to catch criminals, which means that the bible is useless.

If we did things the way the bible tells, criminals would never get caught.

If everybody adhered to the 10 commandments there would be no criminials. If you apply the bible to criminal law then you get some really stupid laws which create criminials.

 

[TRVL ONE]

Every man is accountable for his own sins and will have to answer to The Lord Jesus Christ for Every Action and Word spoken in this life.

"I was just doing my job" or "I was just following orders" or "I was serving my country" isn't going to cut it on judgement day.

I agree. I believe that the government is in a demonic trap. In order to catch some criminals they have to sin, because of how our laws are written. You have politicians making the laws instead of law enforcement making the law.

 

[TRVL ONE]

If everybody adhered to the 10 commandments there would be no criminials. If you apply the bible to criminal law then you get some really stupid laws which create criminials.

Are you saying biblical principals can create criminals?

 

[steve78]

OP

And that is where we are today .. a whole world filled with lies, cheating and dishonesty ... and always someone else is to blame. From top to bottom our whole society has become crooked, and you can hardly find one honest person.

You choose.

There are plenty of good honest people, its just that often we don't hear about them. The media is so focused on the bad rather than the good.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

It reminds me of The last and twentieth toll-house which is the toll-house of Unmercifulness: failing to show mercy and charity to people, and being cruel in any way.
Aerial Toll-Houses - OrthodoxWiki
St. Theodora's Journey Through the Aerial Toll-Houses


This includes Psychological Harassment and bullying. It also includes Specifically going to churches with ulterior motives to provoke, intimidate, monitor, deceive and gain intel etc. This also includes people who take part in deceiving through Psyops.
United Nations Convention against Torture - Wikipedia



The Lord will judge and punish people who do these things.

 

[Sola1517]

Just because they do these things, doesn't make it right. They are not God. Maybe, if the only way to get the gospel into a country is by sinning, maybe it is God's way of saying no. The holy spirit kept Paul out of places.

You completely missed the point, goodbye.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

In the bible there are only a few times, that God approves of any kind of deception. I don't know of anyone smart enough to define when it is okay and when it is not. It is the best practice not to.
I doubt the bible is included with the FBI,CIA, OR DEA "rule books". I don't believe they are all that concerned about sinning.

I’m not sure what point you’re getting at. Are you against the FBI or something? I don’t see how you couldn’t be a Christian and still work for the FBI.