Indian Court: Transgender Women Can Be ‘Hindu Brides’

[Original Happy Camper]

A court in India ruled on Monday that the term “Hindu bride” must also include transgender women, thus directing authorities to register a marriage solemnized between a man and a transgender woman.

Indian Court: Transgender Woman Can Be 'Hindu Brides'

Genesis 5:2

Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.

 

[FireDragon76]

You do realize that most Indians are not Christians and do not necessarily subscribe to those notions of gender in the first place? All that's happening is that British-enforced, colonial era laws are being gradually struck down.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

I suppose we can expect suttee to return soon...

 

[FireDragon76]

I suppose we can expect suttee to return soon...

I doubt it, but the British condemning a deeply-held cultural custom through their narrow moralism wasn't exactly the most enlightened sort of behavior for people that fancied themselves the greatest empire in the world. I think the Germans at one time had a point in their characterization of the British, they really could be pompous hypocrites.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

I doubt it, but the British condemning a deeply-held cultural custom through their narrow moralism wasn't exactly the most enlightened sort of behavior for people that fancied themselves the greatest empire in the world. I think the Germans at one time had a point in their characterization of the British, they really could be pompous hypocrites.

Actually, the British like other successful empires, were generally accepting of the cultures over which they ruled. Their tolerance, of course, had limits.

"Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."

-Sir Charles James Napier

 

[FireDragon76]

Actually, the British like other successful empires, were generally accepting of the cultures over which they ruled. Their tolerance, of course, had limits.

"Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."

-Sir Charles James Napier

You're making an apology for ruthless imperialism, you know... Napier was a butcher.

 

[~Zao~]

Actually, the British like other successful empires.....When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."

-Sir Charles James Napier

That sounds worse than the German christmas tree custom that was said prepare the ornaments for the tree in a very particular way. I think that was Druids that were traditional in that way.

 

[FireDragon76]

The British failed to appreciate the deep significance of marriage to Hindus and they insisted on forcing their values onto a conquered people. For a Hindu woman at the time, it was understood that her life was entwined with her husband's. Have you even seen a Hindu wedding?

British Victorian marriage mores and laws infantilized and disrespected women in their own ways... that's why I'm saying the British were little more than hypocrites.

 

[~Zao~]

The British failed to appreciate the deep significance of marriage to Hindus and they insisted on forcing their values onto a conquered people. For a Hindu woman at the time, it was understood that her life was entwined with her husband's. Have you even seen a Hindu wedding?

.....

It’s barbaric that the live widow would be burned with a dead husband. What a strange custom that would ensure that the widow didn’t remarry. Doesn’t come close to Christianity in that respect. The aim is to be free to turn from idols to the living God.
Release from the Law
1Do you not know, brothers (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law has authority over a man only as long as he lives? 2For instance, a married woman is bound by law to her husband as long as he lives. But ifher husband dies, she is released from the lawof marriage. 3So then, if she is joined to another man while her husband is still alive, she is called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law and is not an adulteress, even if she marries another man.…

 

[FireDragon76]

It’s barbaric that the live widow would be burned with a dead husband. What a strange custom that would ensure that the widow didn’t remarry.

Remarriage was not common in all cultures. It wasn't easy for widows to remarry, typically they were older. What makes you think women were exactly forced into this practice, anyways? That's looking at it from a prejudiced perspective.

I'm not saying I agree with it but the British were hypocrites in how they dealt with it harshly, without real compassion for Indians.

Doesn’t come close Christianity in that respect.

Using the sword to spread Christian values isn't something I see Jesus endorsing.

 

[~Zao~]

Remarriage was not common in all cultures. It wasn't easy for widows to remarry, typically they were older. What makes you think women were exactly forced into this practice, anyways? That's looking at it from a prejudiced perspective.

Let me ask you if you would willingly get up on a hay wagon that you know was going to be on set on fire. My guess is not unless there was something to fear greater if you didn’t. That’s like saying the slaves of the kings of Egypt all volunteered to be buried with them. Horses and dogs for their loyalties and all that too. Not very human naturalistic if you ask me.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

You're making an apology for ruthless imperialism, you know... Napier was a butcher.

...and you're making an apology for burning women alive.

The British failed to appreciate the deep significance of marriage to Hindus and they insisted on forcing their values onto a conquered people.

Lame excuse... marriage had deep significance to the Victorian British as well.

British Victorian marriage mores and laws infantilized and disrespected women in their own ways...

...they didn't burn widows alive. They allowed widows to live after their husbands died.

Using the sword to spread Christian values isn't something I see Jesus endorsing.

The British generally didn't. All those ancient Hindu temples after 200 years of British rule are still there after all. Nevertheless:

"Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man." Genesis 9:6

Like Napier said, that was the deeply held cultural custom of the British, and it's a lot more defensible than suttee.

 

[FireDragon76]

...and you're making an apology for burning women alive.



Lame excuse... marriage had deep significance to the Victorian British as well.



...they didn't burn widows alive. They allowed widows to live after their husbands died.



The British generally didn't. All those ancient Hindu temples after 200 years of British rule are still there after all. Nevertheless:

"Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man." Genesis 9:6

Like Napier said, that was the deeply held cultural custom of the British, and it's a lot more defensible than suttee.

Indians didn't necessarily force widows to burn their women alive, it was an expectation of their culture and one way women processed the grief from losing a spouse. In a less individualistic culture where life is seen as more interconnected, the mindset is entirely different.

There's actually a Star Trek: the Next Generation episode that reminds me of this sort of of conflict of values ( Half a Life. Season 4, Episode 22) . Perhaps you have seen it? In the alien culture, the Kaelon, ritual suicide of everyone over 65 is considered a sacred rite that is unquestioned, and part of the drama of the episode is various characters coming to terms with that, and some coming to realize that the imposition of their own values upon an alien culture is cruel.

Half a Life (Star Trek: The Next Generation) - Wikipedia

I know Picard didn't go around the galaxy blowing up every civilization with different customs and values, even ones that were very different and potentially ethically problematic from his perspective. But the British did the equivalent with their version of empire.

 

[~Zao~]

Indians didn't necessarily force widows to burn their women alive, it was an expectation of their culture and one way women processed the grief from losing a spouse. In a less individualistic culture where life is seen as more interconnected, the mindset is entirely different.

There's actually a Star Trek: the Next Generation episode that reminds me of this sort of of conflict of values ( Half a Life. Season 4, Episode 22) . Perhaps you have seen it? In the alien culture, the Kaelon, ritual suicide of everyone over 65 is considered a sacred rite that is unquestioned, and part of the drama of the episode is various characters coming to terms with that, and some coming to realize that the imposition of their own values upon an alien culture is cruel.

Half a Life (Star Trek: The Next Generation) - Wikipedia

I know Picard didn't go around the galaxy blowing up every civilization with different customs and values, even ones that were very different and potentially ethically problematic from his perspective. But the British did the equivalent with their version of empire.

I don’t think your qualified to define the mindset of a woman or of a ritual suicide victim. Process the grief