So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

Gregory Thompson

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So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

If so, by which standard would you test it?

If not, what does the all things relate to?

How do you apply this?
 
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HTacianas

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So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

If so, by which standard would you test it?

If not, what does the all things relate to?

How do you apply this?

That's meant mostly as a warning against gnostic "apostles". It shows up again in the Revelation:

Rev 2:2 - I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:

I suppose you could test the bible as well. I've studied it rather intently for perhaps twenty years or so. Except for a couple of errors and splice marks here and there it seems legit.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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That's meant mostly as a warning against gnostic "apostles". It shows up again in the Revelation:

Rev 2:2 - I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:

I suppose you could test the bible as well. I've studied it rather intently for perhaps twenty years or so. Except for a couple of errors and splice marks here and there it seems legit.
Along those lines, i tend to take a "judge with mercy" paradigm.

Since the writers would be in a state of constant spiritual development, sometimes the application of Paul is eclipsed by the application of Jesus.

2Ti 4:14 Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:

I find this way, we have examples of how leaders in the faith responded for different times during our faith journey. The Jesus application for the above passage is to turn the other cheek, to bless and not curse when you're ready to apply the most excellent way ... it's not really an act of worship if it doesn't come out genuine.
 
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usexpat97

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By all means. Test the Bible. Probably the way you test it varies from person to person, but it's probably not wise to test it by disobeying it or defaming it and seeing what happens. Effective? Possibly. Wise? No.

I find Lee Stroebel's way perfectly fine: by investigating it. Verify the facts. So the Red Sea parted? What's the evidence? Is the Bible we have in our hands close to the original? How do we know? Why does it matter?
 
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Gregory Thompson

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By all means. Test the Bible. Probably the way you test it varies from person to person, but it's probably not wise to test it by disobeying it or defaming it and seeing what happens. Effective? Possibly. Wise? No.

I find Lee Stroebel's way perfectly fine: by investigating it. Verify the facts. So the Red Sea parted? What's the evidence? Is the Bible we have in our hands close to the original? How do we know? Why does it matter?
I find, testing the teachings by seeing what the fruit is from following that particular teaching very helpful in an age with several manuscript variants.

It is possible that we would miss something very important if we did not test everything in the bible, since it is also prophecy.
 
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Soyeong

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So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

If so, by which standard would you test it?

If not, what does the all things relate to?

How do you apply this?

Psalm 34:8 Oh, taste and see that the LORD is good! Blessed is the man who takes refuge in him!
 
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Carl Emerson

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I would have thought that the bible has already been tested - the OT by the patriarchs of the time - the NT by the patriarchs of the time - and the bible as a whole by the various church councils assembled for that exact purpose.

I think it is essential to believe that God Himself has watched over the process to make sure that what we have today is what He intended.

Did He not orchestrate the 'happenstance' of the discovery of the dead sea scrolls at a time when the mainly German scholars where casting doubt on the scripture being free of tampering over the years. The fact that we were presented with of copy of Isaiah about 1000 years older than any previous version, and was almost identical to the manuscrips we had, was His way of restoring our confidence in what we have.

Blessings,

Carl Emerson
 
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Gregory Thompson

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I would have thought that the bible has already been tested - the OT by the patriarchs of the time - the NT by the patriarchs of the time - and the bible as a whole by the various church councils assembled for that exact purpose.

I think it is essential to believe that God Himself has watched over the process to make sure that what we have today is what He intended.

Did He not orchestrate the 'happenstance' of the discovery of the dead sea scrolls at a time when the mainly German scholars where casting doubt on the scripture being free of tampering over the years. The fact that we were presented with of copy of Isaiah about 1000 years older than any previous version, and was almost identical to the manuscrips we had, was His way of restoring our confidence in what we have.

Blessings,

Carl Emerson
However, it is important to note, some books were removed from the canon in the 1800s revision of the bible.

I wouldn't characterize the decisions makers during that era as Patriarchs.
 
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My take on it is that in the two verses I know of where we are told to test the word, Acts 17:11 and 1Thes 5:21, the testing being done is on the words that are being given to us by teachers; that we are to use God's word in Scripture to prove whether or not their words align with God's intent.

Scripture is written and finished and nothing can be added nor taken away. Thus, any confusion or seeming contradictions in the Bible are problems with our understanding and not with God's word.
 
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Maria Billingsley

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So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

If so, by which standard would you test it?

If not, what does the all things relate to?

How do you apply this?
Test all "spirits" and confirm it is of God. Scripture is our school master and what we use to test these spirits. Testing scripture would be a whole different thing. This is something an unbeliever would do if they reject the validity of the Bible.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Michael, I have not made a study of this - what was removed?

Blessings,

Carl Emereson.
The books that appear in Orthodox and Catholic bibles but do not appear in the Protestant 66 book version. Commonly referred to as the apocrypha.

That the books were removed, and the reason for removal, indicates a sharp change in attitude towards how scripture should be used.

The progression from this point in time also influenced translations and the people who would do the translations.

This issue is one of many influencing the way the church changed its attitude at various times during history, thus the need for testing scriptures according to the core principles within the text.

For example, a person trying to remove reference to the trinity in the bible, would not know all of the texts that refer to said trinity throughout the bible since there are so many ... so some passages would hang out and point to the fact that something at one point was altered .. you know except this passage ... and oh yeah ... that passage ... etc.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Test all "spirits" and confirm it is of God. Scripture is our school master and what we use to test these spirits. Testing scripture would be a whole different thing. This is something an unbeliever would do if they reject the validity of the Bible.
To take it a step further however.

If the bible says do X while Y, and Z will result. Would you not test to see if this happens? And then question why, if it does not?
 
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Maria Billingsley

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To take it a step further however.

If the bible says do X while Y, and Z will result. Would you not test to see if this happens? And then question why, if it does not?
You will need to use a specific example in order for me to comment.I am not really understanding the x-y-z. A good practice is to compare scripture with scripture in order to reproof.

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
 
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Halbhh

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So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

If so, by which standard would you test it?

If not, what does the all things relate to?

How do you apply this?

Above people are using the word 'test' in more than one way, but another way of testing is actual real life testing of such as the proverbs and the instructions on how to live from Jesus, which is very radical in effect when one tests them I found out.

Maybe it's because I was an agnostic coming from a way of thinking from extensive reading in science and also getting a degree in the sciences, a worldview that sees endless hypotheses and theories -- all to be tested -- that when I was reading later a great many of the great thinkers and wisdom traditions, I was seeking not merely to intellectually compare, but instead I was gleaning ideas I could put into practice, test out.

To see if the idea was significantly better than how I was already living.

I tested a lot of things very well, like meditation (lived a year and a half in a meditation community), sweat lodges, reshaping my mental attitudes from The Tao (Lao Tzu), applying ideas from Emerson, and applying ideas of how to reform oneself from many of the great psychologists like Carl Rogers, Victor Frankel, Rollo May and many others, and a lot of comparing of outcomes.

I finally decided to test what felt like a bigger effort -- the primary and also emotionally risky things Jesus the Christ said to do.

Starting with "love your neighbor as yourself". I did this very literally, very much an 'as yourself' -- as if the person was going to be a very dear loved friend (this total stranger....) with precisely the next door neighbors on both sides (and again later in new locations also, since I could not believe how good the result was)....

I found that things Christ said worked far better than other competing ways, such as the more normal American way of --

Normal American way I was using:
--> Love a few select friends
--> be friendly to some advantageous acquaintances
--> usually be polite to people I'd encounter
--> be sure to keep 98% of people at arms length
--> be superficially polite to actual neighbors, for my own advantage
especially literal next door neighbors, to which it feels safer to just be truly superficial only.

So, see, I did test it -- real actual love, hard to do! and exhausting at first -- and as an agnostic.

It was an unbelievably good outcome.
I became impressed by that best-of-all-ways result of Jesus's commandment (in the love your neighbor as yourself instance).

Because of that, I tested more of what Jesus said, I think next the difficult and radical forgiving those not having earned it.

That, also, was so much better than what I had been doing. I knew because a meditator becomes more aware of their internal feeling, state of being. I could tell it was sharply better from having forgiven some people.

I began to think: "I'll find something that doesn't work."

I chose to test the almost-certainly-wishful-thinking "love your enemy".

I thought that would only work a little, only as long as I was doing all the 'love'. Likely l'd get humiliated. But I was determined to test until I could find something that failed.

It worked impossibly well (the only enemy I'd had became a true friend with real love, even though I could only offer love a few seconds on the first day, then it was all him.)

Jesus's teachings were working better than I imagined possible.

I had though they were just a good way to live in peace, a nice pleasant life. He'd be just a wise man. A good, wise man, and that was all.

Nope.

His instructions are far better than just a way to have some pleasant times and a less stressful life I discovered. They very radically improve life. Not just to a nice vacation day level.

I was finding what He said to do was better than all other competing alternative ways. Since "truth" about how to live is simply what works better than all other known ways, already I was finding what Jesus said is fully 'true' in the practical, everyday living way. The 100% success of His instructions began to pile up. I began to wonder if everything He said was true. I know anyone can test things He said this way, as direct testing, first hand.
 
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brinny

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Along those lines, i tend to take a "judge with mercy" paradigm.

Since the writers would be in a state of constant spiritual development, sometimes the application of Paul is eclipsed by the application of Jesus.

2Ti 4:14 Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:

I find this way, we have examples of how leaders in the faith responded for different times during our faith journey. The Jesus application for the above passage is to turn the other cheek, to bless and not curse when you're ready to apply the most excellent way ... it's not really an act of worship if it doesn't come out genuine.

Paul never contradicts Jesus. On another note, does the living God always "judge with mercy"? Would you care to elaborate?

Regarding "testing" the Bible, God's Word, how might one do that?

On another note, what HTacianas posted about the Gnostics in post #2 is of interest and to be taken into account.
 
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So the bible says to test all things, does this include the bible?

If so, by which standard would you test it?

If not, what does the all things relate to?

How do you apply this?
Hi, Michael :)

Testing does not necessarily mean to question. We can test something in order to get the most good out of it.

You test a race horse in order to see what the horse can do.

We can be in a trial and realize how God is able to use it for His purpose; so test any trouble for how God is able to turn it to His intention . . . like happened with Joseph > Genesis 37-50.

So, each time we read a scripture, assume we can get more out of it; so test it by being >

"swift to hear" (in James 1:19-20).

I do not know what the translated Greek word for this use of "test" can mean, though. So, we might test what I am offering, by looking that up :)
 
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