Jesus and His Father (the only ones who can re-form a life from death to alive).Who were the greatest?
I'm fond of St. Gregory the Great, St. Francis, St. Bernard, St. Catherine of Siena, and St. Pius V.
Oh, and I'm Protestant.
Are they (any of them) reformers ?
Nothing good. I didn't think they left catholicism .....Yes. All of them. Have you read about them?
These people were influential in the church, but "Reformers?" There isn't much to point to in that respect.
These people were influential in the church, but "Reformers?" There isn't much to point to in that respect.
Martin Luther and John Calvin are the Protestant Reformers I'm most familiar with. Between the two, I like Luther better.Who were the greatest?
Not to get technical, but leaving Catholicism was never the point of the Reformation. It was an attempt to change the Western Church rather than to found a new one. Were he alive today, Luther would probably not be happy that this schism has lasted for 501 years and counting. "Protestant" is also a broad label. Someone can call themselves a Protestant and not follow orthodox Christian doctrine.Nothing good. I didn't think they left catholicism .....
re search "reformers" >
"The Reformation (more fully the Protestant Reformation, or the European Reformation) was a movement within Western Christianity in 16th-century Europe that posed a religious and political challenge to the Roman Catholic church – and papal authority in particular."
excerpt from "The Finest of the Wheat" >
"A minister of the word is one who has the revelation of Christ, one in whom God has been pleased to reveal His Son (see Gal. 1.16). It is more than that he just says this is so, but he inwardly knows that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God. To say so takes only
440 The Finest of the Wheat
two or three minutes to recite, but the Lord says: “Flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in the heavens.” To know Christ is better than to know words; it is a seeing. As one sees this vision of the Son of God everything but Christ recedes, be it sanctification, righteousness, or life. Out of this entire universe nothing can be compared with Christ; no spiritual thing can vie with Him, for Christ is all and in all.
Outside of Christ there is neither life nor light, sanctification nor righteousness. Once a man is brought by God into this revelation of Christ, he begins to realize there is nothing apart from Christ. Christ is everything: He is the Son of God as well as the word of God; He is love, sanctification, righteousness, salvation, redemption, deliverance, grace, light and work. He fills everything. All which we have seen in the past, however much it may be, fades away before Him. Nothing can stand its ground before this grand revelation. Moses and Elijah disappear, so do Peter, James, and John. The Lord Jesus alone remains. He fills all and is all. Christ is the center as well as the circumference. God’s center and periphery are found in Christ.
After a person passes through this basic experience of being brought by God to Christ for a true knowledge of His Son, he begins to know the word of God. Thus shall he be able to supply Christ. Without this revelation of Christ, no one is able to minister Him to others."
Martin Luther and John Calvin are the Protestant Reformers I'm most familiar with. Between the two, I like Luther better.
Not to get technical, but leaving Catholicism was never the point of the Reformation. It was an attempt to change the Western Church rather than to found a new one. Were he alive today, Luther would probably not be happy that this schism has lasted for 501 years and counting. "Protestant" is also a broad label. Someone can call themselves a Protestant and not follow orthodox Christian doctrine.
Either way, the vote has to go to the Protestant reformers if we think of what they did and compare that with the record of such as the Catholic figures you named.The OP asked for "reformers," not "Reformers."
Either way, the vote has to go to the Protestant reformers if we think of what they did and compare that with the record of such as the Catholic figures you named.
Catherine of Siena, for example, is best known for persuading the bishop of Rome to return to Rome from France and take up residence in his own diocese! If that can even be called a reform while maintaining a straight face, it surely does not amount to much of one.
And Francis of Assisi, beloved as he is for his personal attributes, steadfastly refused to get into the reform business at all, so committed was he to respecting the authority of his church and its leaders.
I do admire William Tyndale a lot.The English Reformation and the Puritan Movement.