For example, Isaiah 34 that you brought up.
Isaiah 34:4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.
This sounds a lot like something mentioned in Revelation 6,
Yes it does!,
However the Context of Isaiah 34 is the Destruction of EDOM.
The Day of the Lord (Isa 34:8) against all nations back in the 500s BC. The particular mention of God's sacrifice of the nations (including Edom) found in Isa 34 harmonizes with
Ezekiel 25 and 26, where Edom's doom is particularly listed in Ez 25:12-14. It also harmonizes with
Jeremiah 49:7-22 and the entire prophecy of Obadiah. As the prophecies said, Edom was destroyed
at that time.
Here again we see the usual apocalyptic metaphors at the time of Edom's destruction: Jehovah comes down for battle to bring his sword against nations (Isa 34:5-9), the universe colapses (Isa 34:4), the destruction of these civilizations is compared to a blood sacrifice on God's alter (34:6), it's the Day of the Lord's vengeance (Isa 34:8 -- compare to the Day of the Lord's vengeance of AD 66-70 spoken of in
Luke 21:20-22) and so on. We could find many more apocatlyptc metaphors by seraching the Ezekiel and Jeremiah and Obediah accounts. All this, of course, shows us how Christ's coming in the glory of the Father at AD 66-70 was
precisely of the same nature as all the previous Jehovhah-comings foretold by the prophets and fulfilled in OT times.
It is likewise evident that the various disasters of
Isaiah 19 upon Egypt are personally doled out by Yahweh's coming. Yahweh rides a cloud down to Egypt (19:1). He leads a civil war in the country (19:2). Yahweh turns them over to the cruel Assyrian Monarch (probably Sargon). Yahweh brings disasters upon them (19:16). This passage was fulfilled, and serves as another strong context for how we are to understand the Lord's coming against Israel and the nations back in the first century when the commonwealth was destroyed, Rome burned, the demonized Temple worship both at Jerusalem and Rome were leveled, and the Kingdom of God triumphed as the New Covenant Church was established forever.
What I tend to think needs to be determined first, is this. the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken. What exactly is that referring to? Maybe we need to go to the book of Revelation and see if it can help us with this.
Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
Revelation 6:12-17 is St. John's use of nearly identical apocalyptic language to
past apocalypses, and we see there that the truth of the passage is symbolic in the same ways the OT prophets used the terms for apocalypses in their days:
Revelation 6:12-15
I looked when He broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth made of hair, and the whole moon became like blood; and the stars of the sky fell to the earth
[compare to Isaiah 13:10; Ez 32:7,8] , as a fig tree casts its unripe figs when shaken by a great wind. The sky was split apart like a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
[compare to Isa 34:4]. Then the kings of the earth and the great men and the commanders and the rich and the strong and every slave and free man hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains
[compare to Is 2:10,19,21]
In the same way as these things had been fulfilled in ancient times through the fall of kings and nations and civilizations, so also were these things fulfilled back in the first century when Christ and the apostles declared them and they came to pass, especially in the desolation of apostate Israel.
What are the chances, whether literal or not, that the following happens multiple times in history, thus at different times in history? and the stars shall fall from heaven(Matthew 24:30)---And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth(Revelation 6:13)
If we are to believe scripture, then we must admit
100% chance of that.
We only need Compare Matthew 24 and Revelation with God's coming to O.T. Babylon in 539BC (Isa 13:10-13, 13:1, and 13:17), OR God's coming to Edom in 703BC (Isa 34:3-5), OR God's coming to Egypt in 572BC (Ez 32:7-11) OR God's coming to Nineveh in 612BC (
Nahum 1). So
Matthew 24:29 was ALSO fulfilled at the fall of the Temple and Jerusalem in exactly the same way as the many times before. Surely you don't expect A GREAT MANY stars like our sun to literally hit our earth as we see in
Revelation 6:13???
It seems to me that you are not understanding these phrases as they are biblically used.
First, you emphasize that he will be "seen coming with clouds" as stated in Matt 24:30 and Rev 1:7. But didn't you notice that this very event is described in
Revelation 14:14-20, which is clearly a
heavenly event and not an earthly one? Read that
Revelation 14:14-20 passage to see that ST. John is not thinking of a physical event in the skies overhead.
Also, Jehovah's OT apocalypses are
always described as Jehovah coming down and leading armies, and shooting arrows, and bowing the heavens and destroying the earth and such. Those OT events had corresponding judgments on earth, but the Jews knew Jehovah
never literally and physically did those things. Yet the prophets spoke in very physical/literal terms about those judgments:
*Yahweh came down and shot his arrows at Saul and his armies, destroying the earth and the heavens at the time (2 Sam 22:8-16)
*Yahweh came down and shot his arrows over Greece and blew His trumpet (
Zechariah 9:13-16);
*Yahweh came down riding a cloud to beat up on Egypt (Isa 19:1-2);
*Yahweh made bare his Holy Arm in the eyes of all nations (Isa 52:10);
*Yahweh came to the Israelites at Sinai and Seir with Ten Thousand of His Saints and led a march on the fields of Edom (Deut 33:2;
Judges 5:4-5);
*Yahweh destroyed the universe when he judged Israel through Babylon (Jer 4:22-30) and did so again when he judged Egypt by Babylon (Ezekiel 32:2-8).
So also did Christ do these things when "the Lord of the Vineyard came" in AD 66-70 and was to them the Stone that crushed them to powder and removed the Kingdom of God from them (see
Matthew 21:40-45).
Again, you appear to wish to apply a POLAR OPPOSITE interpretation to this set precedent but you havent shown us any Biblical instruction to do so.