CAN WE BE SAVED WHILE CONTINUING IN KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN? WHAT IS SIN? WHAT IS RIGHTEOUSNESS?

LoveGodsWord

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Ok question one from the scriptures

WHAT IS SIN?

JAMES 2:8-12

[8], If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well: [9], But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. [10], For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. [11] For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW

Yep, James is pretty clear if we brake ANY of God's Law (10 commandments) then we are a TRANSGRESSOR of God's LAW and commit SIN. James quotes two of the 10 Commandments that are summed up in the 2nd great commandments of LOVE to our neighbor in v11

links to...........

1 JOHN 3:4 [4] Whosoever commits SIN transgresses also the law: for SIN is the transgression of the law.

John is saying the same thing as James and states that if we TRANSGRESS God's LAW then we commit SIN because SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF GOD'S LAW. So it is very clear that SIN is breaking ANY of God's LAW (10 commandments). We will look at the chapter context shortly which give the example in v15 of MURDER God's 6th Command of the 10.

Links to...........

ROMANS 7:7 [7], What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I HAD NOT KNOWN SIN BUT BY THE LAW: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, THOU SHALT NOT COVET.

Well here we have Paul in agreement with James and John also telling us that SIN is breaking God's commandments and uses the 10th commandment as an example of breaking any of God's LAW (10 commandments) = SIN (Exodus 20:17)

Links to...

ROMANS 3:20 [20], Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: FOR BY THE LAW IS THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN.

Context is v9; both Jew and Greek ALL under SIN, v10 None are righteous no not one, v11 None seek after God, v12 All have gone out of the way, there is none that does good [χρηστότης means MORAL excellence]. v13-18 Peace they have not known, destruction is in their way; they do not fear God. Now the CONTEXT is there is none that do GOOD which is in reference to χρηστότης MORAL excellence. Now let's look at v19-20

ROMANS 3:19-21
[19] Now we know that whatsoever things the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Context is no one does good χρηστότης MORAL excellence. God's LAW (10 Commandments) are the standard of RIGHTEOUSNESS.

PSALMS 119:172 [172], My tongue shall speak of your word: for all your commandments are righteousness [צדק; tsedeq means; the right natural, moral or legal; also (abstractly) equity or (figuratively) prosperity: - X even, (X that which is altogether) just (-ice), ([un-]) right (-eous) (cause, -ly, -ness)].

RIGHTEOUSNESS צדק; tsedeq in God's LAW is the standard of χρηστότης; MORAL excellence

The CONTEXT then is doing GOOD in reference to God's LAW (10 Commandments) v19 that is defines SIN and makes all the world guilty before GOD.

[20], Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

No one is justified by God's LAW which is the standard of RIGHTEOUSNESS [Moral excellence and Good] because if broken it gives us a KNOWLEDGE of sin. Already defined in James as breaking any of God's 10 Commandments.

[21], But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

God's LAW is the standard of RIGHTOEUSNESS (Psalms 119:172) MORAL EXCELLENCE standard of what is GOOD. The RIGHTOUENESS of GOD outside of the LAW being witnessed by the LAW and the prophets v22 which is by FAITH in Christ; WHY? v23 because ALL HAVE SINNED broken God's LAW. v24-28 we are only made righteous by faith in Christ without the deeds of the law. v31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

.....................

CONCLUSION: PAUL, JAMES and JOHN all agree together that if we break any of God's LAW (10 commandments) we commit SIN. All three use example of breaking the 10 Commandments as what defines sin. The CONTEXT of 1 JOHN 2:3-4 tells us that the reason for JOHNS epistle in v1 is THAT WE SIN NOT. God's WORD defines SIN as BREAKING any of God's 10 Commandments. Therefore brother with CONTEXT added back in the commandments JOHN is referring to that we SIN (breaking God's 10 commandments) is the 10 Commandments.

God bless.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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And in doing so what have we done... put our will ahead of God's. Original sin.

Indeed tim, this is true. It is a sinful nature that we have and this is what we need saving from. The GOOD NEWS of the GOSPEL is that we have a Saviour in JESUS who can save us from our sins (breaking God's LAW).

God bless
 
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timothyu

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Indeed tim, this is true. It is a sinful nature that we have and this is what we need saving from. The GOOD NEWS of the GOSPEL is that we have a Saviour in JESUS who can save us from our sins (breaking God's LAW).
How does He stop us from putting our will first? We still do it every day in thought if not in deed as Jesus said.

What He did teach us was how the self serving ways of man were the cause of all our woes and acting in the way of the Kingdom could alleviate that. He gave us a living example to follow of an alternative system unnatural to mankind, loving neighbour as self. We exercise the same choice that got us removed from the Garden in order to get back in.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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How does He stop us from putting our will first? We still do it every day in thought if not in deed as Jesus said.

What He did teach us was how the self serving ways of man were the cause of all our woes and acting in the way of the Kingdom could alleviate that. He gave us a living example to follow of an alternative system unnatural to mankind, loving neighbour as self. We exercise the same choice that got us removed from the Garden in order to get back in.

What do you think these scriptures mean *GALATIANS 5:16; ROMANS 8:1-4; HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; JOHN 8:31-36; ROMANS 3:31; MATTHEW 22:36-40; ROMANS 13:8-10?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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What do you think these scriptures mean *GALATIANS 5:16; ROMANS 8:1-4; HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; JOHN 8:31-36; ROMANS 3:31; MATTHEW 22:36-40; ROMANS 13:8-10?

These are only a few scriptures. Jesus came to save us from sin (breaking God's commandments) by giving us a new heart to love through faith.
 
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timothyu

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LoveGodsWord

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Kingdom over the backwards world of man. Kingdom was Jesus good news.

What about this scripture *MATTHEW 9:12-13, what does it mean to you and what part do you think God's LAW (10 commandments) plays in righteousness and sin?
 
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JLB777

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These are only a few scriptures. Jesus came to save us from sin (breaking God's commandments) by giving us a new heart to love through faith.


He saves us from God’s wrath.


Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. Romans 5:9




Salvation - Strongs G4991 - sōtēria ; NOUN


The KJV translates Strong's G4991 in the following manner:salvation (40x), the (one) be saved (1x), deliver (with G1325) (1x), health (1x), saving (1x), that (one) be saved (with G1519) (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. deliverance, preservation, safety, salvation
    1. deliverance from the molestation of enemies
    2. in an ethical sense, that which concludes to the soul's safety or salvation
      1. of Messianic salvation
  2. salvation as the present possession of all true Christians
  3. future salvation, the sum of benefits and blessings which the Christians, redeemed from all earthly ills, will enjoy after the visible return of Christ from heaven in the consummated and eternal kingdom of God.
  • The eternal preservation of our entire being, spirit, soul, and body, from all enemies, including death.
  • The saving, delivering and rescuing of our entire being from the wrath of God, which is the second death, the lake of fire.

For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 1 Thessalonians 5:9






Saved - Strongs G4982 - sōzō ; VERB


The KJV translates Strong's G4982 in the following manner:save (93x), make whole (9x), heal (3x), be whole (2x), miscellaneous(3x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. to save, keep safe and sound, to rescue from danger or destruction
    1. one (from injury or peril)
      1. to save a suffering one (from perishing), i.e. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health
      2. to preserve one who is in danger of destruction, to save or rescue
    2. to save in the technical biblical sense
      1. negatively
        1. to deliver from the penalties of the Messianic judgment
        2. to save from the evils which obstruct the reception of the Messianic deliverance

Though a different word from salvation (sōtēria), saved (sozo), is used in the same way. Salvation is what we receive, (noun), as an end result of what Jesus did for us on the cross, being that He saved (verb) us, continues to save us, as we continue to believe, and continue in the faith.



But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. Romans 5:8-10



Therefore the same definition applies:


Saved -
  • The eternal preservation of our entire being, spirit, soul, and body, from all enemies, including death.
  • The saving, delivering and rescuing of our entire being from the wrath of God, which is the second death, the lake of fire.




JLB
 
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LoveGodsWord

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He saves us from God’s wrath.


Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. Romans 5:9




Salvation - Strongs G4991 - sōtēria ; NOUN


The KJV translates Strong's G4991 in the following manner:salvation (40x), the (one) be saved (1x), deliver (with G1325) (1x), health (1x), saving (1x), that (one) be saved (with G1519) (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. deliverance, preservation, safety, salvation
    1. deliverance from the molestation of enemies
    2. in an ethical sense, that which concludes to the soul's safety or salvation
      1. of Messianic salvation
  2. salvation as the present possession of all true Christians
  3. future salvation, the sum of benefits and blessings which the Christians, redeemed from all earthly ills, will enjoy after the visible return of Christ from heaven in the consummated and eternal kingdom of God.
  • The eternal preservation of our entire being, spirit, soul, and body, from all enemies, including death.
  • The saving, delivering and rescuing of our entire being from the wrath of God, which is the second death, the lake of fire.
For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 1 Thessalonians 5:9






Saved - Strongs G4982 - sōzō ; VERB


The KJV translates Strong's G4982 in the following manner:save (93x), make whole (9x), heal (3x), be whole (2x), miscellaneous(3x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. to save, keep safe and sound, to rescue from danger or destruction
    1. one (from injury or peril)
      1. to save a suffering one (from perishing), i.e. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health
      2. to preserve one who is in danger of destruction, to save or rescue
    2. to save in the technical biblical sense
      1. negatively
        1. to deliver from the penalties of the Messianic judgment
        2. to save from the evils which obstruct the reception of the Messianic deliverance

Though a different word from salvation (sōtēria), saved (sozo), is used in the same way. Salvation is what we receive, (noun), as an end result of what Jesus did for us on the cross, being that He saved (verb) us, continues to save us, as we continue to believe, and continue in the faith.



But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. Romans 5:8-10



Therefore the same definition applies:


Saved -
  • The eternal preservation of our entire being, spirit, soul, and body, from all enemies, including death.
  • The saving, delivering and rescuing of our entire being from the wrath of God, which is the second death, the lake of fire.




JLB


Yep and your point here brother is????
 
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ace of hearts

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Sorry if I am being slow. I was just waiting to see the view of others as the first question is really the foundation to the rest of the questions being asked in the OP.
You're requiring a specific answer to validate your position. Since sin came before you desired answer, how do you define what sin is?
 
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ace of hearts

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Not so much collecting but seeing how others view the sublect. Many do not read God's WORD for themselves and sometimes it's also good to see the understanding others may have on a subject.

God bless.
You don't know yet? How long have you been posting here? Your post count indicates a long time.
 
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ace of hearts

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Ok question one from the scriptures

WHAT IS SIN?

JAMES 2:8-12

[8], If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well: [9], But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. [10], For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. [11] For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW

Yep, James is pretty clear if we brake ANY of God's Law (10 commandments) then we are a TRANSGRESSOR of God's LAW and commit SIN. James quotes two of the 10 Commandments that are summed up in the 2nd great commandments of LOVE to our neighbor in v11

links to...........

1 JOHN 3:4 [4] Whosoever commits SIN transgresses also the law: for SIN is the transgression of the law.

John is saying the same thing as James and states that if we TRANSGRESS God's LAW then we commit SIN because SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF GOD'S LAW. So it is very clear that SIN is breaking ANY of God's LAW (10 commandments). We will look at the chapter context shortly which give the example in v15 of MURDER God's 6th Command of the 10.

Links to...........

ROMANS 7:7 [7], What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I HAD NOT KNOWN SIN BUT BY THE LAW: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, THOU SHALT NOT COVET.

Well here we have Paul in agreement with James and John also telling us that SIN is breaking God's commandments and uses the 10th commandment as an example of breaking any of God's LAW (10 commandments) = SIN (Exodus 20:17)

Links to...

ROMANS 3:20 [20], Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: FOR BY THE LAW IS THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN.

Context is v9; both Jew and Greek ALL under SIN, v10 None are righteous no not one, v11 None seek after God, v12 All have gone out of the way, there is none that does good [χρηστότης means MORAL excellence]. v13-18 Peace they have not known, destruction is in their way; they do not fear God. Now the CONTEXT is there is none that do GOOD which is in reference to χρηστότης MORAL excellence. Now let's look at v19-20

ROMANS 3:19-21
[19] Now we know that whatsoever things the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Context is no one does good χρηστότης MORAL excellence. God's LAW (10 Commandments) are the standard of RIGHTEOUSNESS.

PSALMS 119:172 [172], My tongue shall speak of your word: for all your commandments are righteousness [צדק; tsedeq means; the right natural, moral or legal; also (abstractly) equity or (figuratively) prosperity: - X even, (X that which is altogether) just (-ice), ([un-]) right (-eous) (cause, -ly, -ness)].

RIGHTEOUSNESS צדק; tsedeq in God's LAW is the standard of χρηστότης; MORAL excellence

The CONTEXT then is doing GOOD in reference to God's LAW (10 Commandments) v19 that is defines SIN and makes all the world guilty before GOD.

[20], Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

No one is justified by God's LAW which is the standard of RIGHTEOUSNESS [Moral excellence and Good] because if broken it gives us a KNOWLEDGE of sin. Already defined in James as breaking any of God's 10 Commandments.

[21], But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

God's LAW is the standard of RIGHTOEUSNESS (Psalms 119:172) MORAL EXCELLENCE standard of what is GOOD. The RIGHTOUENESS of GOD outside of the LAW being witnessed by the LAW and the prophets v22 which is by FAITH in Christ; WHY? v23 because ALL HAVE SINNED broken God's LAW. v24-28 we are only made righteous by faith in Christ without the deeds of the law. v31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

.....................

CONCLUSION: PAUL, JAMES and JOHN all agree together that if we break any of God's LAW (10 commandments) we commit SIN. All three use example of breaking the 10 Commandments as what defines sin. The CONTEXT of 1 JOHN 2:3-4 tells us that the reason for JOHNS epistle in v1 is THAT WE SIN NOT. God's WORD defines SIN as BREAKING any of God's 10 Commandments. Therefore brother with CONTEXT added back in the commandments JOHN is referring to that we SIN (breaking God's 10 commandments) is the 10 Commandments.

God bless.
If God's written law is the standard, how can our righteousness exceed that of the scribes and Pharisees?

Why are Abraham and King David righteous? Neither kept the law because both sinned as the record shows.
 
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ace of hearts

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Indeed tim, this is true. It is a sinful nature that we have and this is what we need saving from. The GOOD NEWS of the GOSPEL is that we have a Saviour in JESUS who can save us from our sins (breaking God's LAW).

God bless
What I read here is Jesus saved us from the law because you seem to believe one can't sin if there was no law.
 
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ace of hearts

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These are only a few scriptures. Jesus came to save us from sin (breaking God's commandments) by giving us a new heart to love through faith.
This doesn't give us any more ability than before. What is called Christians is proof. And that is backed up with 1 JN 1:9.
 
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timothyu

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LoveGodsWord

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You're requiring a specific answer to validate your position. Since sin came before you desired answer, how do you define what sin is?

Not at all. As posted earlier only God's WORD is true and we should believe and follow it. Did you have any scriptures to share for the questions in the OP?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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You don't know yet? How long have you been posting here? Your post count indicates a long time.

The first question has already been answered in post # 81 here. More answers to the questions in the OP will continue to come. This is a discussion. Did you have any scriptures to share for your view in regards to the questions in the OP?
 
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ViaCrucis

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How many brownie points do I need to have stored up in order to compensate for all my sinful, wicked, and selfish actions and behavior in order to properly earn God's full acceptance?

-CryptoLutheran
 
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LoveGodsWord

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How many brownie points do I need to have stored up in order to compensate for all my sinful, wicked, and selfish actions and behavior in order to properly earn God's full acceptance?

-CryptoLutheran

Why do you feel brother you need to earn something that is a free gift given to all that BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD *EPHESIANS 2:8? However, is God's LAW (10 commandments) abolished through faith or is it establsihed in the heart to love *ROMANS 3:31; HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10? If our faith has no fruit is it the Faith that God wants us to have or the faith of the devils *JAMES 2:18-20; 26; MATTHEW 7:16-23?
 
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