Through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all-Original Sin

[ewq1938]

What about Galatians 2:20?

What about it?

 

[mark kennedy]

No. Also, born in sin is not the same as born with sin.

Sure it is, your born a sinner or your not.

 

[mark kennedy]

What about it?

If it's possible to be righteous by works Christ died for nothing.

 

[Jonaitis]

We are all our own "Adam" responsible for our own sins. We are not responsible for Adam's sins, nor is anyways else responsible for our sins. Each person is judged for their own sins.

Oddly, some could argue for this without falling into a palagian or semi-palagian worldview ... I don't agree with it, since it runs into many problems.

Edit: I am referring to this particular statement quoted above exclusively from whatever else he has said.

 

[ewq1938]

Sure it is, your born a sinner or your not.

No one is born with anyone else's sin, nor any sin at all.

 

[ewq1938]

If it's possible to be righteous by works Christ died for nothing.

We aren't discussing that. We are discussing original sin and whether it is biblical or not.

 

[Hammster]

Aren't you born in sin?

Yes. I was just trying to see if there was another way to view it.

 

[Hammster]

No. Also, born in sin is not the same as born with sin.

For all have sinned.

 

[ewq1938]

For all have sinned.

Yes all have sinned but that isn't the topic. Are babies born with Adam's sin? Is sin passed from parent to child?

 

[Hammster]

Yes all have sinned but that isn't the topic. Are babies born with Adam's sin? Is sin passed from parent to child?

Babies would be included in “all”.

 

[ewq1938]

Babies would be included in “all”.

We all know people eventually sin. I don't believe babies are old enough to be able to sin though. The issue is whether they are born with someone else's sin.

 

[Hammster]

We all know people eventually sin. I don't believe babies are old enough to be able to sin though. The issue is whether they are born with someone else's sin.

Then you’ll have to say that Paul got it wrong. I’m not willing to do that myself.

 

[ewq1938]

Then you’ll have to say that Paul got it wrong. I’m not willing to do that myself.

Paul didn't say babies sin. He said every person is a sinner clearly that means when they are past the age of accountability.

 

[Hammster]

Paul didn't say babies sin. He said every person is a sinner clearly that means when they are past the age of accountability.

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, - Romans 3:23

Nothing about an age of accountability. You won’t find that in scripture.

 

[redleghunter]

Wrong. Death is passed on only when that person sins their own sin. Adam's sin does not get passed down. It is unscriptural and scripture itself speaks against such a concept:

Eze_18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.


I didn't inherit any sin from my father and certainly not from Adam.

First you ignored the exhibition of the entirety of Romans 5:12-21
Perhaps go back to the OP and address each verse?

That law was given by God for man in judging fellow man. Not one who is a covenant breaker with God.

Explain why Korah’s family perished for his sin:

Numbers 16: NASB

23Then the LORD said to Moses, 24“Tell the congregation to move away from the dwellings of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram.”

25So Moses got up and went to Dathan and Abiram, and the elders of Israel followed him. 26And he warned the congregation, “Move away now from the tents of these wicked men. Do not touch anything that belongs to them, or you will be swept away because of all their sins.”

27So they moved away from the dwellings of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram. Meanwhile, Dathan and Abiram had come out and stood at the entrance of their tents with their wives and children and infants.


28Then Moses said, “This is how you will know that the LORD has sent me to do all these things, for it was not my own doing: 29If these men die a natural death, or if they suffer the fate of all men, then the LORD has not sent me. 30But if the LORD brings about something unprecedented, and the earth opens its mouth and swallows them and all that belongs to them so that they go down alive into Sheol, then you will know that these men have treated the LORD with contempt.”

31As soon as Moses had finished saying all this, the ground beneath them split open,32and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed them and their households, all Korah’s men and all their possessions. 33They went down alive into Sheol with all they owned. The earth closed over them, and they vanished from the assembly.

34At their cries, all the people of Israel who were around them fled, saying, “The earth may swallow us too!” 35And fire came forth from the LORD and consumed the 250 men who were offering the incense. (NASB)

Shall I quote all the Canaanite nations put to the sword women, children and cattle? What did those kids do?

Or should we compound you pretext with this?

Exodus 34: NASB
1Now the LORD said to Moses, “Cut out for yourself two stone tablets like the former ones, and I will write on the tablets the words that were on the former tablets which you shattered. 2“So be ready by morning, and come up in the morning to Mount Sinai, and present yourself there to Me on the top of the mountain. 3“No man is to come up with you, nor let any man be seen anywhere on the mountain; even the flocks and the herds may not graze in front of that mountain.” 4So he cut out two stone tablets like the former ones, and Moses rose up early in the morning and went up to Mount Sinai, as the LORD had commanded him, and he took two stone tablets in his hand. 5The LORD descended in the cloud and stood there with him as he called upon the name of the LORD. 6Then the LORD passed by in front of him and proclaimed, “The LORD, the LORD God, compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in lovingkindness and truth; 7who keeps lovingkindness for thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished, visiting the iniquity of fathers on the children and on the grandchildren to the third and fourth generations.” 8Moses made haste to bow low toward the earth and worship.9He said, “If now I have found favor in Your sight, O Lord, I pray, let the Lord go along in our midst, even though the people are so obstinate, and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us as Your own possession.” (NASB)


So to deny a clear teaching from Scriptures you have to find one verse which then nukes the rest of the Scriptures creating your own contradiction.

Now do you know why God established what you quoted from Ezekiel 18? Here’s why. The sons and daughters of Judah complained their fathers and mothers sinned so they were suffering for it.

Ezekiel 18: NASB
1Then the word of the LORD came to me, saying,

2“What do you mean by using this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying,
‘The fathers eat the sour grapes,
But the children’s teeth are set on edge’?

3“As I live,” declares the Lord GOD, “you are surely not going to use this proverb in Israel anymore. 4“Behold, all souls are Mine; the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine. The soul who sins will die.

 

[redleghunter]

No scripture states Adam's sin was passed down to anyone.

Indeed it does.

Romans 5: NASB

15But the free gift is not like the transgression. For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. 16The gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned; for on the one hand the judgment arose from one transgression resulting in condemnation, but on the other hand the free gift arose from many transgressions resulting in justification. 17For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.

18So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men.19For as through the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous. 20The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, 21so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[redleghunter]

No. Also, born in sin is not the same as born with sin.

Then why did Paul say by the transgression of Adam all are condemned? He said this after saying we all die.

There’s the use of sin and death. Sin is not used interchangeably or synonymous with death.

 

[ewq1938]

Then why did Paul say by the transgression of Adam all are condemned?

He explains why:

Romans 5:12 Therefore as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all men sinned

It doesn't say babies are born with Adam's sin. Adam's sin brought sin into the world, so death is only spread when each person commits their own sin. That is why original sin is unscriptural because it goes against what Paul teaches here.

 

[redleghunter]

No one is born with anyone else's sin, nor any sin at all.

Then why do we all die physically and why do we need the Reconciliation in order to enter eternal life?

 

[redleghunter]

We aren't discussing that. We are discussing original sin and whether it is biblical or not.

It is. I proved it in the OP. Start there.