The thought of being justified by works seems to take away God's Glory

[JohnB445]

I know there will be people twisting this, and radically misinterpreting what I'm saying so I will quickly quote Romans 6 to hold back the strawman.
Dead to Sin, Alive to God
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

5For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6We know that our old selfawas crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7For one who has died has been set freeb from sin. 8Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

If anyone is Born Again by the will of God, Not the will of the flesh. They will understand that the Holy Spirit convicts of sin, that it changes them and sanctifies them overtime.

Now that, any possible misinterpretation is out of the way.

Is there any possible danger with someone fully trusting Jesus Christ and giving 100% credit to God? Doing good works out of love and obedience, not out of fear or feeling of obligation but because they want to grow in their relationship with God, and they give 100% credit to God for their good works and trust that God is 100% doing the saving.

Is God on Judgement day really going to accuse them for fully trusting in him, even if they obeyed him out of pure love and not of obligation? The Idea that Jesus dying for our sins not being enough doesn't sound right at all, as no credit should be given to us as we are as Martin Luther says we are "Snow covered in dung" yea it sounds quite bad that we are "we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." quoted in Isaiah 64:6. Its the truth we are not good people according to God, and we are no where even close to his standards.

Now does that mean we are completely helpless and shouldn't even bother repenting of sin? Of course not, because when God saves us he doesn't leave us dead in our sins, we are given a new life we become a new. So we are able to choose good, and overtime be sanctified conforming to the image of God.

So is there any real fault to those who are fully trusting in God, while at the same time are regenerated and walking in obedience?

I cannot imagine even thinking of contributing in any part in God's redemption, as I am nothing without God, and can do nothing apart from him.

 

[WESTOZZIE]

John 5:24 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

 

[bcbsr]

I know there will be people twisting this, and radically misinterpreting what I'm saying so I will quickly quote Romans 6 to hold back the strawman.
Dead to Sin, Alive to God
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

5For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6We know that our old selfawas crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7For one who has died has been set freeb from sin. 8Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

If anyone is Born Again by the will of God, Not the will of the flesh. They will understand that the Holy Spirit convicts of sin, that it changes them and sanctifies them overtime.

Now that, any possible misinterpretation is out of the way.

Is there any possible danger with someone fully trusting Jesus Christ and giving 100% credit to God? Doing good works out of love and obedience, not out of fear or feeling of obligation but because they want to grow in their relationship with God, and they give 100% credit to God for their good works and trust that God is 100% doing the saving.

Is God on Judgement day really going to accuse them for fully trusting in him, even if they obeyed him out of pure love and not of obligation? The Idea that Jesus dying for our sins not being enough doesn't sound right at all, as no credit should be given to us as we are as Martin Luther says we are "Snow covered in dung" yea it sounds quite bad that we are "we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." quoted in Isaiah 64:6. Its the truth we are not good people according to God, and we are no where even close to his standards.

Now does that mean we are completely helpless and shouldn't even bother repenting of sin? Of course not, because when God saves us he doesn't leave us dead in our sins, we are given a new life we become a new. So we are able to choose good, and overtime be sanctified conforming to the image of God.

So is there any real fault to those who are fully trusting in God, while at the same time are regenerated and walking in obedience?

I cannot imagine even thinking of contributing in any part in God's redemption, as I am nothing without God, and can do nothing apart from him.

I think the Bible parses between justification and sanctification. The only contribution we make to justification is trust in the Lord Jesus to save us, which according to Romans 4 is not itself classified as a work and it's nothing to boast about. Thus justification (forgiveness of sins) is a free gift.

Sanctification is a matter of cooperation with the Holy Spirit as He leads and we follow. That does involve more in the way of effort on our part. Though sanctification has no impact on our status as those who have been sealed and eternally security. But it does have a bearing on our fruitfulness and on our rewards in heaven. (1Cor 3:11-15) There are rewards for services rendered, God judging impartially in that matter for those who have been saved.

 

[fhansen]

I know there will be people twisting this, and radically misinterpreting what I'm saying so I will quickly quote Romans 6 to hold back the strawman.
Dead to Sin, Alive to God
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

5For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6We know that our old selfawas crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7For one who has died has been set freeb from sin. 8Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

If anyone is Born Again by the will of God, Not the will of the flesh. They will understand that the Holy Spirit convicts of sin, that it changes them and sanctifies them overtime.

Now that, any possible misinterpretation is out of the way.

Is there any possible danger with someone fully trusting Jesus Christ and giving 100% credit to God? Doing good works out of love and obedience, not out of fear or feeling of obligation but because they want to grow in their relationship with God, and they give 100% credit to God for their good works and trust that God is 100% doing the saving.

Is God on Judgement day really going to accuse them for fully trusting in him, even if they obeyed him out of pure love and not of obligation? The Idea that Jesus dying for our sins not being enough doesn't sound right at all, as no credit should be given to us as we are as Martin Luther says we are "Snow covered in dung" yea it sounds quite bad that we are "we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." quoted in Isaiah 64:6. Its the truth we are not good people according to God, and we are no where even close to his standards.

Now does that mean we are completely helpless and shouldn't even bother repenting of sin? Of course not, because when God saves us he doesn't leave us dead in our sins, we are given a new life we become a new. So we are able to choose good, and overtime be sanctified conforming to the image of God.

So is there any real fault to those who are fully trusting in God, while at the same time are regenerated and walking in obedience?

I cannot imagine even thinking of contributing in any part in God's redemption, as I am nothing without God, and can do nothing apart from him.

In Catholic theology justice or righteousness consists of three virtues, wrought in us by grace/ the presence of the Trinity dwelling within. These three are faith, hope, and love, with the most important of these being love, which is why the Greatest Commandments are what they are.

Love is the epitome of righteousness or holiness for man; it's what makes us just. God wouldn't be satisfied with anything less for man. And love acts, by it's nature, for the good of others, for the right reason. So, as a 16th century believer put it, "At the evening of life we shall be judged on our love.
Love is the heart and soul of the gospel.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I know there will be people twisting this, and radically misinterpreting what I'm saying so I will quickly quote Romans 6 to hold back the strawman.
Dead to Sin, Alive to God
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

5For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6We know that our old selfawas crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7For one who has died has been set freeb from sin. 8Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

If anyone is Born Again by the will of God, Not the will of the flesh. They will understand that the Holy Spirit convicts of sin, that it changes them and sanctifies them overtime.

Now that, any possible misinterpretation is out of the way.

Is there any possible danger with someone fully trusting Jesus Christ and giving 100% credit to God? Doing good works out of love and obedience, not out of fear or feeling of obligation but because they want to grow in their relationship with God, and they give 100% credit to God for their good works and trust that God is 100% doing the saving.

Is God on Judgement day really going to accuse them for fully trusting in him, even if they obeyed him out of pure love and not of obligation? The Idea that Jesus dying for our sins not being enough doesn't sound right at all, as no credit should be given to us as we are as Martin Luther says we are "Snow covered in dung" yea it sounds quite bad that we are "we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." quoted in Isaiah 64:6. Its the truth we are not good people according to God, and we are no where even close to his standards.

Now does that mean we are completely helpless and shouldn't even bother repenting of sin? Of course not, because when God saves us he doesn't leave us dead in our sins, we are given a new life we become a new. So we are able to choose good, and overtime be sanctified conforming to the image of God.

So is there any real fault to those who are fully trusting in God, while at the same time are regenerated and walking in obedience?

I cannot imagine even thinking of contributing in any part in God's redemption, as I am nothing without God, and can do nothing apart from him.

After a person accepts Jesus as their Savior, can they refuse to help the poor in this life (Which is a work)?

Jesus says:

31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."
(Matthew 25:31-46).​

If you simply read and believe these words of Jesus above, you will come to the conclusion that you do have to do works of faith as a part of your faith in Jesus Christ. For James says that he will show you his faith by his works (James 2:18). Works are just the by-product of a true faith. But these works have to be grounded in the Bible and not in our own imagination.

Please keep in mind that if works do not truly save, then you can refuse to help the poor in this life and just believe on Jesus and be saved. But Matthew 25:31-46 paints a different story.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I know there will be people twisting this, and radically misinterpreting what I'm saying so I will quickly quote Romans 6 to hold back the strawman.
Dead to Sin, Alive to God
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

5For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6We know that our old selfawas crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7For one who has died has been set freeb from sin. 8Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

If anyone is Born Again by the will of God, Not the will of the flesh. They will understand that the Holy Spirit convicts of sin, that it changes them and sanctifies them overtime.

Now that, any possible misinterpretation is out of the way.

Is there any possible danger with someone fully trusting Jesus Christ and giving 100% credit to God? Doing good works out of love and obedience, not out of fear or feeling of obligation but because they want to grow in their relationship with God, and they give 100% credit to God for their good works and trust that God is 100% doing the saving.

Is God on Judgement day really going to accuse them for fully trusting in him, even if they obeyed him out of pure love and not of obligation? The Idea that Jesus dying for our sins not being enough doesn't sound right at all, as no credit should be given to us as we are as Martin Luther says we are "Snow covered in dung" yea it sounds quite bad that we are "we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." quoted in Isaiah 64:6. Its the truth we are not good people according to God, and we are no where even close to his standards.

Now does that mean we are completely helpless and shouldn't even bother repenting of sin? Of course not, because when God saves us he doesn't leave us dead in our sins, we are given a new life we become a new. So we are able to choose good, and overtime be sanctified conforming to the image of God.

So is there any real fault to those who are fully trusting in God, while at the same time are regenerated and walking in obedience?

I cannot imagine even thinking of contributing in any part in God's redemption, as I am nothing without God, and can do nothing apart from him.

Is love or good works something that all born again believers will just automatically do? If so, then why would God's Word say for us believers to "Continue in the grace of God"? (Acts of the Apostles 13:43), "Continue in the faith"? (Colossians 1:23), "Let brotherly love continue."? (Hebrews 13:1) or why would Jesus tell us to: "Continue in my love."? (John 15:9).

The Bible tells us that...

We need to endure in our faith to continue to be saved:

"But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;" Hebrews 3:13-14.

"Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him." James 1:12.

"But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. Matthew 24:13.

"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." Revelation 2:10.

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Revelation 2:7.

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death." Revelation 2:11.

"He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels." Revelation 3:5.

"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." Jude 1:21.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In response to the OP thread title:
"The thought of being justified by works seems to take away God's Glory."

However, the Bible says good works glorify your Father in Heaven.

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven."
(Matthew 5:16).​

So the OP thought is incorrect.

 

[JohnB445]

In response to the OP thread title:
"The thought of being justified by works seems to take away God's Glory."

However, the Bible says good works glorify your Father in Heaven.

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven."
(Matthew 5:16).​

So the OP thought is incorrect.

Don't know if you read the post. I put Roman's 6 just for this reason.

Is one saved by God or themselves(performance)?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Don't know if you read the post. I put Roman's 6 just for this reason.

Is one saved by God or themselves(performance)?

This is nothing new that I have not dealt with before. This is merely preaching a double message (whether you realize that fact or not). I am going to make this real simple. Do you believe King David was saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder? Yes or no?

See, the problem is that you are not agreeing with a simple verse like James 2:24. It says we are justified by works and you are saying this is not so (contrary to the Bible).

 

[JohnB445]

This is nothing new that I have not dealt with before. This is merely preaching a double message (whether you realize that fact or not). I am going to make this real simple. Do you believe King David was saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder? Yes or no?

See, the problem is that you are not agreeing with a simple verse like James 2:24. It says we are justified by works and you are saying this is not so (contrary to the Bible).

Faith produces works. James it talking about faith that produces nothing. He calls that dead faith.

I'm talking about trust. Are you trusting God or yourself's performance.

As for King David, I don't know much about him. This is my 4th month coming to Christ so I won't know everything. The only OT books I read was Genesis and Proverbs.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Faith produces works. James it talking about faith that produces nothing. He calls that dead faith.

I'm talking about trust. Are you trusting God or yourself's performance.

As for King David, I don't know much about him. This is my 4th month coming to Christ so I won't know everything. The only OT books I read was Genesis and Proverbs.

When Peter failed to walk in water (which is a work), Jesus questioned Peter’s faith.

For example: If Rick said that his old rocking chair on his porch was able to hold his weight, and he said he believed that with all his heart, would he truly be showing forth that his statement of faith was true if he never sat in the chair? Especially if he was asked to sit in it and yet he refused to do so? In other words, if Rick believed that his porch chair would hold his weight (and he told others this), he would no doubt take the action necessary by sitting in that chair to prove that such a statement was true. Otherwise it would just be an empty profession of faith. In other words, if a person says they love God, and they have no visible good fruit to show that such a thing is true, then it would be just an empty profession of faith that they love God. Meaning, they really do not love God. It would just be a paying of lip service. I mean, a man can say he loves his wife, but if he does nothing to please her in any way, then he really does not love her. Action shows forth whether one's faith is the genuine and the real article vs. it being fake.

James says faith without works is dead.
A dead faith cannot save anyone.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Faith produces works. James it talking about faith that produces nothing. He calls that dead faith.

I'm talking about trust. Are you trusting God or yourself's performance.

As for King David, I don't know much about him. This is my 4th month coming to Christ so I won't know everything. The only OT books I read was Genesis and Proverbs.

Faith comes by hearing (obeying) the Word of God (Romans 10:17). There are many commands that are given to us by Jesus and His followers. If you are not obeying the Lord’s commands then you are not truly trusting in God.

 

[JohnB445]

When Peter failed to walk in water (which is a work), Jesus questioned Peter’s faith.

For example: If Rick said that his old rocking chair on his porch was able to hold his weight, and he said he believed that with all his heart, would he truly be showing forth that his statement of faith was true if he never sat in the chair? Especially if he was asked to sit in it and yet he refused to do so? In other words, if Rick believed that his porch chair would hold his weight (and he told others this), he would no doubt take the action necessary by sitting in that chair to prove that such a statement was true. Otherwise it would just be an empty profession of faith. In other words, if a person says they love God, and they have no visible good fruit to show that such a thing is true, then it would be just an empty profession of faith that they love God. Meaning, they really do not love God. It would just be a paying of lip service. I mean, a man can say he loves his wife, but if he does nothing to please her in any way, then he really does not love her. Action shows forth whether one's faith is the genuine and the real article vs. it being fake.

James says faith without works is dead.
A dead faith cannot save anyone.

Yea, and I said faith without works is dead.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yea, and I said faith without works is dead.

So then that means works of faith are necessary for salvation and they do not take away the glory of God. In fact, God gives us commands to work. If you don't do them, then you are not trusting Him.

 

[JohnB445]

So then that means works of faith are necessary for salvation and they do not take away the glory of God. In fact, God gives us commands to work. If you don't do them, then you are not trusting Him.

God gets the credit, however.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yea, and I said faith without works is dead.

Was King David saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder?
Yes, or no?
Please answer this question.

 

[JohnB445]

Was King David saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder?
Yes, or no?
Please answer this question.

My best guess would be no.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

God gets the credit, however.

Well, it is more like a cooperation with God. Sure, God does the good work through us, but we have to surrender to God. If we do not surrender and obey His Word, then God cannot do the good work through us. There are hundreds of commands in the New Testament. You are not going to just automatically do them all unless you do a study to find them and then you actively seek to apply them to your life. Jesus says if you love me, keep my commandments (John 14:15). Paul says if any man loves not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed (See 1 Corinthians 16:22). Jesus says if you will enter into life keep the commandments (Matthew 19:17). Jesus admits to the truth involving a lawyer that loving God (that includes specific details) and loving your neighbor is how to inherit eternal life (See Luke 10:25-28). Not helping the poor in this life means we did not do it unto Jesus and we can be cast into everlasting fire (See Matthew 25:31-46). Not preaching the gospel in this life is a salvation issue (See Luke 9:62). A Christian who does not love their brother means there is no eternal life abiding in them (See 1 John 3:15).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

My best guess would be no.

You have answered correctly. David needed to confess of his sins in order to be forgiven (Psalms 51). Most in the Eternal Security or OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) camp teach otherwise. They believe you can commit grievous sin occasionally and be saved while doing so as long as you do not make it a lifestyle of sin your whole life. But they do not believe you can overcome grievous sin, when the Bible teaches otherwise. They believe that a little bit of a lifestyle of sin (righteous one day or one minute and then sinning the next minute or next day) is what it sounds like many of them teach. They say they strive to overcome sin, but then they contradict themselves and say that nobody can overcome grievous sin in this life. They believe you are saved and you cannot become unsaved. This of course minimizes the dangers of sin. Jesus warned us that if a person looks upon a woman in lust, their whole body can be cast into hell fire (See Matthew 5:28-30). Jesus says if we do not forgive, we will not be forgiven (Matthew 6:15). So the Free Grace churches will teach that all you need to have is a belief in Jesus to be saved (When the Bible teaches that you need to have both faith + works of faith to be saved). They will not teach you that grievous unrepentant sin can cause a separation between a believer and God (Whereby a believer needs to confess of it in order to be forgiven - See 1 John 1:9).

 

[JohnB445]

You have answered correctly. David needed to confess of his sins in order to be forgiven (Psalms 51). Most in the Eternal Security or OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) camp teach otherwise. They believe you can commit grievous sin occasionally and be saved while doing so as long as you do not make it a lifestyle of sin your whole life. But they do not believe you can overcome grievous sin, when the Bible teaches otherwise. They believe that a little bit of a lifestyle of sin (righteous one day or one minute and then sinning the next minute or next day) is what it sounds like many of them teach. They say they strive to overcome sin, but then they contradict themselves and say that nobody can overcome grievous sin in this life. They believe you are saved and you cannot become unsaved. This of course minimizes the dangers of sin. Jesus warned us that if a person looks upon a woman in lust, their whole body can be cast into hell fire (See Matthew 5:28-30). Jesus says if we do not forgive, we will not be forgiven (Matthew 6:15). So the Free Grace churches will teach that all you need to have is a belief in Jesus to be saved (When the Bible teaches that you need to have both faith + works of faith to be saved). They will not teach you that grievous unrepentant sin can cause a separation between a believer and God (Whereby a believer needs to confess of it in order to be forgiven - See 1 John 1:9).

I don't believe there is such a thing as no changed life after salvation.

Salvation results in a changed life. God changed it, not us.

If their life doesn't change, they probably were never saved to begin with.

Being Born again by the Holy Spirit is a supernatural event, where it indwells inside the body. Then Sanctification begins.

If they sin wilfully or have no desire to grow in faith, they are unbelievers. As actions show what they believe.

If they have no fruit being produced or are dead in sin and diving deeper, they should be concerned.