The 'Invisible church' bugs me.

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Jackson Cooper

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Growing up I heard all Christian denominations, particularly protestant or evangelical ones, being referred to as 'the Church'.

Apparently this is their interpretation of what Jesus did when He founded His church which the gates of Hell shall never overcome.

I would think that a Holy church wouldn't be filled with thousands of different denominations contradicting one another, and be susceptible to constant additions and changes.
What's a good response to someone that refers to the invisible church?
 

Doug Melven

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Growing up I heard all Christian denominations, particularly protestant or evangelical ones, being referred to as 'the Church'.

Apparently this is their interpretation of what Jesus did when He founded His church which the gates of Hell shall never overcome.

I would think that a Holy church wouldn't be filled with thousands of different denominations contradicting one another, and be susceptible to constant additions and changes.
What's a good response to someone that refers to the invisible church?
Look at the church in the first century that Paul wrote to.
The reasons he wrote his letters was to correct wrong doctrine that was in the church already.
 
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JIMINZ

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Growing up I heard all Christian denominations, particularly protestant or evangelical ones, being referred to as 'the Church'.

Apparently this is their interpretation of what Jesus did when He founded His church which the gates of Hell shall never overcome.

I would think that a Holy church wouldn't be filled with thousands of different denominations contradicting one another, and be susceptible to constant additions and changes.
What's a good response to someone that refers to the invisible church?

.
The Invisible Church as you call it, is the Body of Christ.

The Body of Christ is made up of Believers from every Denomination as God sees fit to include them, there isn't any Denomination regardless of how they word it is the One True Church.

1Co. 12:18
But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him.

Regardless of which Denomination you may belong to they are man made bodies of Believers, when Christ returns, those that are his will meet Him in the air, those that are not His will remain in the ground.

Remember the Parable of the Tares?
 
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HTacianas

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Growing up I heard all Christian denominations, particularly protestant or evangelical ones, being referred to as 'the Church'.

Apparently this is their interpretation of what Jesus did when He founded His church which the gates of Hell shall never overcome.

I would think that a Holy church wouldn't be filled with thousands of different denominations contradicting one another, and be susceptible to constant additions and changes.
What's a good response to someone that refers to the invisible church?

Since most of them adhere to Sola Scriptura, ask them "where does it say that in the bible"?
 
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buzuxi02

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There is no invisible church(es) on earth. The Body of Christ is not broken nor segmented nor fractured. Scripture says. Not a bone of His was broken as prophecy foretold, the Body cannot be divided and partitioned.
Scripture also says those being added were of one mind, one heart , one soul (Acts4:32) it clearly says to be of one Spirit, one faith, one baptism ( Ephesians 4:3-5). That the Church is of one bread because we partake of one bread (1 Corinthians 10:17).

The Creed clearly states there is One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church and the meaning of the phrase is clarified in the very same canons of the 2nd Ecumenical council which gave us this phrase in the Creed.
The Holy Spirit is not the spirit of confusion there is only a withering away and falling away from that one body not equally competing rivalries.
 
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Visible Church = Church as viewed through natural the five senses = man's perception
Invisible Church = All born again believers in Christ united by the Spirit who is invisible, by the Spirit we're sealed and the seal is invisible to the natural senses, the whole spiritual realm being invisible to the natural senses = man's perception

So far as God is concerned there is one Church, one body, because He can see both the natural and the supernatural with full and equal clarity.

It is what is because of the Creator - creation distinction. In Heaven the veil will be lifted, no more seeing through a glass darkly. People are always saying things to the effect; "by their fruits you will know them", but seriously how well do you think you know everyone at your Church? In human perception, a lifetime can be a long time, and people can and often do change, go through things few if any may know about. It's not like we can go to our Church and divide people into saved and not saved groups, though I would not doubt many have tried in their minds, but we do not even know the day of one person's future salvation in Christ. They could be sitting next to us, and we would never know it, or perhaps they are an apostate, enjoying the visible benefits without inward conversion only to drop out altogether and deny what they once professed outwardly with their lips. So in the here and now, I think the distinction is important for people to understand, it can help in many ways, answer questions and bring peace to the believer's storm.
 
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buzuxi02

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Apologetic warrior,

Where did you find this gnostic interpretation? By what mechanism were you sealed by the Spirit?
Alot of esoteric explanations yet no scriptural verses from the protestant viewpoint, quite revealing. Where in scripture is syncretistic ecumenism endorsed?
 
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JIMINZ

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Apologetic warrior,

Where did you find this gnostic interpretation? By what mechanism were you sealed by the Spirit?
Alot of esoteric explanations yet no scriptural verses from the protestant viewpoint, quite revealing. Where in scripture is syncretistic ecumenism endorsed?

.
Ummm would this do.

Eph. 1:13
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Eph. 4:30
And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
 
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buzuxi02

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Wouldn't then this falling away denote false belief, ie a false Christianity in the Protestant Denominations which is believed by those not adhering to
"The One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church"?

Are you saying Protestants have received another Gospel?

Gal. 1:8
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Of course it's a different gospel. It so different that you sola scripturalist turn on and devour your own as in the case of Jehovahs Witness and SDA. They use sola scripture to come to their conclusions but since their conclusions differ from yours, though using an identical method you anathemize each other.
 
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Apologetic warrior,

Where did you find this gnostic interpretation? By what mechanism were you sealed by the Spirit?
Alot of esoteric explanations yet no scriptural verses from the protestant viewpoint, quite revealing. Where in scripture is syncretistic ecumenism endorsed?

2 Corinthians 1:22 who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

Ephesians 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

So apparently the Apostle Paul is the original Gnostic. :rolleyes:
 
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buzuxi02

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Ummm would this do.

Eph. 1:13
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Eph. 4:30
And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
"In whom you also trusted", who did you hear them from and why do they differ from your other "invisible" brethren. I'm sure all of you trust your sources, but what are these sources? Who laid hands on you to seal you and teach you and why do they not agree with each other?
 
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Of course it's a different gospel. It so different that you sola scripturalist turn on and devour your own as in the case of Jehovahs Witness and SDA. They use sola scripture to come to their conclusions but since their conclusions differ from yours, though using an identical method you anathemize each other.

Maybe try to stay on topic? Sola Scriptura is not it. Neither are disagreements where essentials are not concerned and Protestants...knowledgeable ones reject JW and Mormon dogmas because they are fundamentally wrong in the essentials, in the foundational doctrines, you know, like the doctrine of God, miss the boat on that one, and you may bump into the boat, but miss it just the same.
 
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