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No they are not. Jesus spoke a lot about Hades.The grave and hell are the same
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No they are not. Jesus spoke a lot about Hades.The grave and hell are the same
Upon death of our mortal bodies we are present with the Lord. The text actually says that.
This is the Resurrection not what Paul speaks of in what I cited.22 But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
23 For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:
24 Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you.
He desires to depart and die so that he can live again with Christ, when we pair this with what he said here
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
We see that Paul knows/believes that a person does not dwell with the Lord until they are resurrected
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
Isn’t it clear. Present with the Lord. Where Jesus is.Where ?
No they are not. Jesus spoke a lot about Hades.
Sorry brother, it does not say that.This is the Resurrection not what Paul speaks of in what I cited.
Dead mortal body present with the Lord. That’s what the text says.
Upon death of our mortal bodies we are present with the Lord. The text actually says that.
Yes at physical death it says the body dies and the soul sleeps. Each of those passages say the body is dead but the man within the tabernacle of flesh, the spirit/soul of the person, lives on and sleeps.The word "sleep" when referring to death, refers to the physical death of believers, not soul sleep (John 11:11-12; Acts 7:60; 1 Corinthians 15:6,18,20,51; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-15; 2 Peter 3:4).
Paul mentions nothing about time. He mentions presence with the Lord. Again the text actually says this.Is the "text" like "the letter" that kills? Like so sad you don't understand ? (don't worry.... most don't) ..... just seek the truth, and keep seeking..... be willing and seeking Jesus .....
Actually, too, it is true, yet time has no meaning.... so you're not 'exactly' wrong, just other things you believe because of your error do not agree with Scripture always.
The text suggests nothing of the kind. Sleep is the euphemism for a dead body. Because it looks asleep.Yes at physical death it says the body dies and the soul sleeps. Each of those passages say the body is dead but the man within the tabernacle of flesh, the spirit/soul of the person, lives on and sleeps.
Isn’t it clear. Present with the Lord. Where Jesus is.
The response usually given to the above account of the Transfiguration is twofold:
1-This was a one time event
2-This was a vision of things to come
How would you respond to the above?
No it doesn't. If you read Mathew's account of the Transfiguration you'll see that what they saw was a vision. Both Moses and Elijah were dead.
Interesting points. I think 90% of what I have learned about the state of the dead comes from the story of the Rich Man and Lazarus. Tons of information about the afterlife. Although it was a view from before the resurrection. So we have to bear that in mind.I don’t pretend to argue for soul sleep, but could it not be argued that the Transfiguration was a specific special occurrence that may not represent the state of all souls at all times? Clearly, the Transfiguration was used to send a message that Jesus was the Son of God, and Elijah and Moses were used as witnesses to that. Could God, in Holy Trinity, not have suspended the usual state of affairs for this unique occurrence?
(That said, I think there are other arguments against soul sleep - like the rich man and Lazarus - that speak more to the issue).