THE LORD'S DAY IS THE SABBATH DAY NOT SUNDAY!

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LoveGodsWord

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No, I'm unable to provide interpretation you agree with when I provide scripture. You don't distinguish one from the other.
Well I would agree with that if I agreed with your opinion about the meaning of those scriptures. I don't so I don't.
Well, or we must agree on the meaning of the scriptures we provide because scriptures can't be the substance of the discussion otherwise.

Sorry Eloy, I do not see your interpretation in the scriptures. You provide scripture but you read into the scriptures things they are not saying. If you were able to provide scripture that says what you are saying it would be helpful but so far you have not. As a result I am not able to follow you.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Exactly because God's rest is a state of being not a temporal duration.

Actually it is both a state and duration. The SEVENTH DAY of the creation week was set apart by God, blessed and made an ETERNAL HOLYDAY because God rested on the SEVENTH DAY of the creation week.

GENESIS 2:1-3
[1], Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
[2], And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
[3], And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

God set this time apart for mankind and Jesus commands us to keep this time HOLY because it is God's REST (Mark 2:27-28 and Exodus 20:8-11)

Those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD enter into God's SABBATH REST but accorinding to HEBREWS 4 only those who BELIEVE AND FOLLOW God's WORD and enter the GOSPEL rest enter into God's SABBATH REST. Hebrews 4v9 There remains therefore a SABBATH REST to the people of God.

Paul is arguing you cannot enter into God's SABBATH REST without entering into God's GOSPEL rest.
 
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Eloy Craft

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Sorry Eloy, I do not see your interpretation in the scriptures. You provide scripture but you read into the scriptures things they are not saying. If you were able to provide scripture that says what you are saying it would be helpful but so far you have not. As a result I am not able to follow you.
Ok so you use scripture to prove the meaning of scripture.. What if someone doesn't think the scripture you are using means what you think it means? It's like wearing different colored glasses, everything is a different color. Every scripture will mean something at least a little different. I am with you in the sense that truth doesn't violate truth. The interpretation of scripture has to have a starting point that isn't colored by error. Jesus gave us that and promised the community that surrounded Him that it would not be lost. If it is lost then being guided to all truth isn't possible with an adulterated doctrin.
 
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Eloy Craft

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BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD everyday you will enter into God's gospel rest and his Sabbath rest.
I completely agree with that. It can't be eternal and be a duration. A duration has a beginninjg and an end. Eternity has no duration. "half a time". What is half a second, half that, and half that. Infinite regress. Half a time is a way of describing eternity. A moment without duration. No beginning no end.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Ok so you use scripture to prove the meaning of scripture.. What if someone doesn't think the scripture you are using means what you think it means? It's like wearing different colored glasses, everything is a different color. Every scripture will mean something at least a little different. I am with you in the sense that truth doesn't violate truth. The interpretation of scripture has to have a starting point that isn't colored by error. Jesus gave us that and promised the community that surrounded Him that it would not be lost. If it is lost then being guided to all truth isn't possible with an adulterated doctrin.

Yes correct prayerfully use scripture asking for God's guidence and claim the promises of John 14:26; John 16:13; John 7:17; John 8:32 to prove the meaning of scripture. Let God's WORD interpret itself.

The starting point for example can be a topic of study. Within chapter and scripture context is also very important in any of the above but asking God to be our teacher and guide is also part of the NEW covenant promise of Hebrews 8:11
 
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LoveGodsWord

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I completely agree with that. It can't be eternal and be a duration. A duration has a beginninjg and an end. Eternity has no duration. "half a time". What is half a second, half that, and half that. Infinite regress. Half a time is a way of describing eternity. A moment without duration. No beginning no end.

An eternal duration is for example every SEVENTH DAY is the SABBATH of God's REST and 4th Commandment (from sunset to sunset). God says it is a perpetual covenant (ETERNAL or EVERLASTING)
 
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Eloy Craft

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An eternal duration is for example every SEVENTH DAY is the SABBATH of God's 4th Commandment. God says it is a perpetual covenant (ETERNAL or EVERLASTING)
Yes it is one of the seven and it is here for a short while and goes to it's destruction. It is also the eighth and one of the seven..

:preach: Please bear with me my friend. If Jesus became the woman at the well's real husband He would be her seventh. He could only stay a short while (two days) because He was going to His....unbelievers see it as destruction but it's a stumbling block for them,. When He is Risen He is the eighth and one of the seven. This pattern is in her story and Revelation. Also the pattern of the creation week and all time. And I believe it happened to the seventh day in
Christ and is happening throughout the age of Grace and is yet to be complete..Thank you for bearing with me and may Christ continue to Bless you and His Peace reign in your heart.
 
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BNR32FAN

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You say you could not quote 613 commandments from scripture, because it would be too long. My question remains, why did you divide the texts the way you did to reach 613?

I do not work for 'dodge'.

Text please.

Surely you must realize that by condemning others for not keeping the sabbath and yet you yourself are willingly disregarding God’s commandments of writing a Torah and observing the Passover sacrifice that your actions are hypocritical.
 
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bekkilyn

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Sorry Eloy, I do not see your interpretation in the scriptures. You provide scripture but you read into the scriptures things they are not saying. If you were able to provide scripture that says what you are saying it would be helpful but so far you have not. As a result I am not able to follow you.

What you seem to believe is "reading into the scriptures things they are not saying", others are able to comprehend that scriptures are full of a *depth* that you are missing by only being familiar with them on a surface level. Do you believe God is really so shallow? 2 + 2 really doesn't always equal 4, and that's speaking mathematically.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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What you seem to believe is "reading into the scriptures things they are not saying", others are able to comprehend that scriptures are full of a *depth* that you are missing by only being familiar with them on a surface level. Do you believe God is really so shallow? 2 + 2 really doesn't always equal 4, and that's speaking mathematically.

Really bekkilyn? Then prove it with scripture. So far you have not provided any but quote yourself over God's Word. Only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God.
 
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Loren T.

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God's Ten Commandments are light (Proverbs 6:23; Isaiah 8:20), including the central commandment, the 4th (Exodus 20:8-11), and is never a shadow, and is never an ordinance, and never carnal, but spiritual (Romans 7:14).
So, I'm assuming you do no work on the sabbath. For example do you refrain from:
Transporting an object between a private domain and the public domain, or for a distance of 4 cubits within the public domain?
Do you only go places within walking distance?
Since not too many people do this kind of work anymore, we could eliminate these:
Sowing
Plowing
Reaping
Binding sheaves
Threshing
Winnowing
Selecting
Grinding
Sifting
Kneading
Baking
Shearing wool
Washing wool
(Although I'm pretty sure my wife has washed wool on Sunday, our "sabbath"
Beating wool
Dyeing wool
Spinning (Boy my wife is in trouble, she spins all the time, seriously)
Weaving(She's done this too.)
Making two loops
Weaving two threads
Separating two threads
Tying
Untying
Sewing stitches
Tearing
Trapping(I check my traps on the sabbath)
Slaughtering
Flaying
Tanning
Scraping hide(I'm a hide tanner, but I do take sundays off.)
Marking hides
Cutting hide to shape
Writing two or more letters
Erasing two or more letters
Building
Demolishing
Extinguishing a fire
Kindling a fire(How an I going to keep the house warm in winter? and no more cookouts!)
Putting the finishing touch on an object.

Now, since we are in modern days, the Jews have changed this up somewhat and refrain from:
  • writing, erasing, and tearing;
  • business transactions;
  • driving or riding in cars or other vehicles;
  • shopping;
  • using the telephone;
  • turning on or off anything which uses electricity, including lights, radios, television, computer, air-conditioners and alarm clocks;
  • cooking, baking or kindling a fire;
  • gardening and grass-mowing;
  • doing laundry
So, my question is, do you really follow the Sabbath rules? Do you stop work at Sundown the day before, for example?
 
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Loren T.

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But if they are claiming that Christ is the bible (written word) and they are getting all of their ideas of salvation from the laws in the bible and taking chosen verses extremely literally while ignoring any possible deeper meanings, then salvation by works of law would be the same to them as salvation found in Christ. It's pretty convoluted.
I agree. The theology baffles me.
 
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bekkilyn

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Really bekkilyn? Then prove it with scripture. So far you have not provided any but quote yourself over God's Word. Only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God.

You want me to prove from scripture that you do not understand the depth of scripture? You have already proved it throughout this entire discussion. God is not shallow and neither is his written word.

Do you not see a single problem with your belief that you are always 100% right with your view of scripture and that everyone who disagrees for *any* reason is always 100% wrong?
 
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BNR32FAN

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1. That God's 4th commandments 7th day Sabbath has been abolished?

2. That Jesus is a Sabbath?

3. The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

4. Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

5. Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

6. That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

7. That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

8. Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

9. That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

10. From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

11. Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

12. That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

13. That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

14. Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

15. Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

16. Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

17. That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?

18. That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?

19. That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

20. That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

21. Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

22. Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

23. Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

24. Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

25. Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

26. Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

27. Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

I’m curious why you repeat the same questions several times? Actually I did answer all these questions by quoting Romans 14 and Colossians 2:16. You say they don’t pertain to the sabbath I say they do. Romans 14 refers to choosing a day of worship Colossians 2:16 specifically refers to Sabbaths. Notice that Paul doesn’t make any distinctions on which day of worship or which Sabbath that would exclude the Saturday Sabbath. The purpose of the Sabbath is to honor God. Jesus has given us freedom from the law and we are to serve the purpose of the law. God commanded that no one may work on the Sabbath yet Jesus and the apostles did work on the Sabbath because their work did not contradict the purpose of the law or the purpose of God’s commandment.

“But you would not have condemned my innocent disciples if you knew the meaning of this Scripture: ‘I want you to show mercy, not offer sacrifices.’”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭12:7‬

Here Jesus is giving an example that the meaning and purpose of the law superceeds the letter of the law. Love, compassion, and honoring God are the purpose of the law. Take Rahab for example who was counted as righteous for lying to Jericho’s men and hiding the Israelite spies. Rahab had broken a commandment of God by lying and yet because of her compassion she was counted as righteous. She kept the purpose of the law yet disregarded the letter of the law.

Regarding the Passover sacrifice. The Passover sacrifice is not a sin offering. In fact a sin offering often had to take place before a person could perform the Passover sacrifice because the person performing the ritual had to be ceremonially clean. So for a person who follows the letter of the law Jesus’ sacrifice does not abolish the need for the Passover sacrifice. God had commanded that it must be kept for all time. The writing of the Torah scroll is also still a commandment if God and still in effect.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I am not your friend.

Philippians 3:18 (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:

Here’s the rest of that passage you quoted.

“They are headed for destruction. Their god is their appetite, they brag about shameful things, and they think only about this life here on earth. But we are citizens of heaven, where the Lord Jesus Christ lives. And we are eagerly waiting for him to return as our Savior.”
‭‭Philippians‬ ‭3:19-20‬

W2L obviously does not fit the description of these people Paul is mentioning. You are too quick to judge and show a lack of compassion my friend. It’s not necessary to be rude or impolite to teach the word of God. It’s actually very important that we try to avoid unkind words when teaching the gospel so as to not cause a defensive position in the person we are trying to teach. It’s also important because as Christian we should strive to be like Christ and to be a light to others. We are representatives of Christ and rude behavior discredits us.
 
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Pyong Ping

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I dont see sabbath keeping listed as fruit of the spirit...
It is because you are willingly blind, and choose not to see:

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Ephesians 5:9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;)

Notice, "love":

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Exodus 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

Deuteronomy 5:10 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments.

Notice, "goodness":

Proverbs 4:2 For I give you good doctrine, forsake ye not my law.

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

Romans 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

1 Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

Notice, "righteousnes"

Deuteronomy 4:8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

Psalms 119:172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

Isaiah 48:18 O that thou hadst hearkened to my commandments! then had thy peace been as a river, and thy righteousness as the waves of the sea:

Notice, "truth":

Psalms 119:142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.

Psalms 119:151 Thou art near, O LORD; and all thy commandments are truth.

Malachi 2:6 The law of truth was in his mouth, and iniquity was not found in his lips: he walked with me in peace and equity, and did turn many away from iniquity.
 
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Pyong Ping

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...nor do i see failing to observe sabbath listed as a work of flesh.

galatians 5:13 For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another....
It is because you are willingly blind, and choose not to see:

Walking in "liberty", is to walk apart from sin (1 John 3:4) and in obedience to God's commandments, for sin (1 John 3:4) is slavery, bondage (see God called people out of "bondage", Exodus 20:1-2, that they may be free, Exodus 20:2-17):

Psalms 119:41 VAU. Let thy mercies come also unto me, O LORD, even thy salvation, according to thy word.
Psalms 119:42 So shall I have wherewith to answer him that reproacheth me: for I trust in thy word.
Psalms 119:43 And take not the word of truth utterly out of my mouth; for I have hoped in thy judgments.
Psalms 119:44 So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever.
Psalms 119:45 And I will walk at liberty: for I seek thy precepts.
Psalms 119:46 I will speak of thy testimonies also before kings, and will not be ashamed.
Psalms 119:47 And I will delight myself in thy commandments, which I have loved.
Psalms 119:48 My hands also will I lift up unto thy commandments, which I have loved; and I will meditate in thy statutes.

Law of "liberty", is God's Commandments:

James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
James 1:23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
James 1:24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
James 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

The Ten Commandments are the Law of the King/Priests:

James 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
James 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
James 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
James 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Sin (1 John 3:4) is the bondage:

Acts 8:23 For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity.

God's grace leads out of bondage of sin (1 John 3:4) into obedience to His will (Psalms 40:8):

Exodus 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

Deuteronomy 5:6 I am the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

As for "works", notice, it is "works", and not "rest", which is that the Sabbath commandment is about. To break God's Law, is to still be in one's own "works", and not entered into the "rest" with God, whose "works" were "finished" "from the foundation of the world" (Genesis 2:1-3), in the 7th day. To break the Sabbath commandment is self-murder (Galatians 5:21), since it breaks down the body, mind and heart, for one was supposed to cease, but didn't and gave the body, mind and heart not the specified time to rest. It breaks all of the commandments, and is adultery, spending the time with another, doing ones own thing rather than what God required:

Isaiah 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

Notice James again:


James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
 
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W2L

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It is bceause you are willingly blind, and choose not to see:

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Ephesians 5:9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;)

Notice, "love":

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Exodus 20:6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

Deuteronomy 5:10 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments.

Notice, "goodness":

Proverbs 4:2 For I give you good doctrine, forsake ye not my law.

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

Romans 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

1 Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

Notice, "righteousnes"

Deuteronomy 4:8 And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

Psalms 119:172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

Isaiah 48:18 O that thou hadst hearkened to my commandments! then had thy peace been as a river, and thy righteousness as the waves of the sea:

Notice, "truth":

Psalms 119:142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.

Psalms 119:151 Thou art near, O LORD; and all thy commandments are truth.

Malachi 2:6 The law of truth was in his mouth, and iniquity was not found in his lips: he walked with me in peace and equity, and did turn many away from iniquity.
The apostles never commanded sabbath.
 
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