The End of Gun Control

Nithavela

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RestoreTheJoy

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Nithavela

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Have any thoughts of your own? Why weren't toddlers shooting someone every week in 1950 or 1960 or 1970, when there were guns in every home?
Lack of respect towards weapons which leads to them being left loaded were children can easily find them, instead of them being stored safely and without ammunition.
 
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Southernscotty

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Nithavela

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Trigger locks are free at every Sheriff's office and I suggest every one with kids use them.
Sadly too many people think that their children would never do anything like that.
 
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Nithavela

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Southernscotty

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Sadly too many people think that their children would never do anything like that.
Well kids now days do not realize what guns are for. I was raised with them and saw first hand what we done with them. Plus I was afraid of the spanking I knew I would get if I touched one. :]
 
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Humble me Lord

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If I had a 3d metal printer, I would be printing me off a nice new boat and a corvette first anyway.
Oh, wait, a new tractor, a riding lawnmower..........I'm sure I could think of more....
 
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Hank77

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Well kids now days do not realize what guns are for. I was raised with them and saw first hand what we done with them. Plus I was afraid of the spanking I knew I would get if I touched one. :]
Now a days most of the adult population have no experience with guns and they aren't expected to get any before they buy a gun.
 
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Nithavela

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Now a days most of the adult population have no experience with guns and they aren't expected to get any before they buy a gun.
I think that someone should have to get as much training to buy a gun as he has to buy a car.

Sadly, many people think this as completely unreasonable.
 
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Humble me Lord

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I agree, allot more education should be put out there for gun owners to be responsible.
It should be a felony to leave a loaded firearm somewhere unlocked where a child can get hold of it.
Sadly, allot of accidents occur due to just plain old laziness, or I guess it could be stupidity.
 
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Nithavela

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I agree, allot more education should be put out there for gun owners to be responsible.
It should be a felony to leave a loaded firearm somewhere unlocked where a child can get hold of it.
Sadly, allot of accidents occur due to just plain old laziness, or I guess it could be stupidity.
I think paranoia and action movies play a big part, too. Many gun owners play this fantasy in their head when someone invades their home and they go Rambo on them, but in the end the stashed away revolver hurts nobody but their own family.

Certainly you can find cases where someone defends his home with a handgun, but for each of these stories there is a dozen where someone is hurt because of sucidial impulses, domestic disagreements or accidents.
 
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Zoii

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It's called freedom. :)

Either we can or we can't trust ourselves... I think we can.
No how is it freedom? The design has largely been taken up by people in nations with tight gun control and successfully low murder rates . The person uploading it is only doing it to circumvent their own law. So while a smug American has allowed distribution, and while he may think himself clever, he has facilitated the breaking of laws in other countries. If Americans want to go shooting people with guns then fine - knock yourselves out if that's what you think freedom is.
 
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Mountainmike

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Would you still think that if it were your partner, parent or child that was killed?

And why is it that societies try to restrict bomb making materials or chemical weapons if bombs themselves are not the problem?

The programmed numbness of society to gun deaths - and rationalisations such as above - or shifting the blame elsewhere- in my view is the problem.

Gun deaths need putting into context.
Gun deaths are similar order to breast cancer deaths .So should congress stop research into cancer since it costs a huge sum of money and the fatality rates are low enough to be just one of those things?


Should research stop into vehicle safety - since that death rate is similar too?
Clearly not. The death rate is too high.



It is amazing that my entire generation grew up with guns in the house. It just wasn't a big deal - every post-WWII, Korea, or Vietnam vet had one or more stuck away somewhere. And imagine, we weren't killing ourselves or shooting up schools.

It's not the guns. They don't do anything but just sit there until someone with an agenda decides to act.
 
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dgiharris

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SO in summary, because gun control can't stop 100% of people from ever developing their own guns, there is no point in trying to impose gun control???

hmmm... what would happen to society and laws in general if we applied the above logic to everything else???
 
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dgiharris

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I think paranoia and action movies play a big part, too. Many gun owners play this fantasy in their head when someone invades their home and they go Rambo on them, but in the end the stashed away revolver hurts nobody but their own family.

Certainly you can find cases where someone defends his home with a handgun, but for each of these stories there is a dozen where someone is hurt because of sucidial impulses, domestic disagreements or accidents.

Another problem with guns is they just tend to make things worse.

Whatever situation you are facing, guns escalate things. One of the problems with having a gun is that it emboldens people to actually seek conflict so that they can then justifiably pull out their guns. There was a case in Texas where a bunch of young adults were partying outside down the street at 10pm or so. A firefighter that lived in the neighborhood got tired of the noise and decided to intervene. He took his gun with him. The confrontation started with a debate that turned into an argument. He escalated the conflict by talking smack and egging them on and when a physical altercation becomes imminent THEN he whips out his gun and says, "I fear for my life". He then calls the police while the people he is arguing with likewise call the police. The firefighter has the gun trained on one guy, the other guy's brother (or friend) tries to sneak up on the firefighter and the firefighter "fearing for his life" shoots and kills one of them. Firefighter was found guilty btw.

Had the firefigher "not" have had a gun the entire situation would have played out differently. For starters, he wouldn't have been emboldened to pick a fight with a group of people while outnumbered 6 to one. He would have been more inclined to be more civil and if that failed to simply call the police.

Yes, there are stories of people saving their lives or livelihood because they were armed. But those stories are few and far between compared to the stories in which innocent people are hurt or killed.
 
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ubicaritas

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Plastic zip guns definitely pose security challenges since they will probably easily pass through metal detectors.

Anybody ever remember the Clint Eastwood film in the 90's, In the Line of Fire? The villain played by John Malkovich tries to kill the President with a plastic zip gun that looks like a pack of cigarettes.

I'm surprised by this, honestly, even the freedom of speech is not absolute. Especially when that speech poses an immanent public danger, which is the case with information about making a plastic zip gun.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I know! They could never be used for something useful like defending one's self or family. Leave that to the police who are only minutes away when seconds count.

...but there's really a false-choice scenario that gets presented by hardcore conservatives every time this discussion happens.

A) "I can own or distribute whatever kinds of guns, and the government shouldn't be able to stop me"
B) "I'm left completely disarmed and have absolutely no practical means to defend myself or my family"

...are not the only two options here.

In reality, there are probably about a dozen different flavors gun control legislation models ranging from super-strict, to almost as lax as us with a few minor tweaks that could be considered and reviewed. Of course, the NRA lobbies to block even doing research into such subjects (which is odd, because if what they say is the definitive and undeniable truth they claim it is, they should jump at the chance to have that published, in writing, by researchers someone else's expense with not so much as a dime out of their own resources.)

I always encourage people to look at the legislation model in the Czech Republic for gun control.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_Czech_Republic

Some key points:
- You can own handguns, shotguns, AR-15's, Ak's, etc...
- You can reasonably obtain a CCW permit (and roughly a similar percentage of their population does; roughly 2-3% much like here in the US)
- They don't have gun free zones, and if you have your permit, you can carry on campuses and schools (more lax than us in that regard)
- Most gun are purchased for the purpose of defense; so it's not about hunting for them, they have historical culture with guns like we do
- Permits are "shall-issue", even for non-residents. Which means, if I went there on a 1-month vacation, provided I could pass their tests and met their criteria, I could carry while I was there. (again, a way they're more lax than we are)
- Universal reciprocity throughout all of their administrative districts

BUT, in order to do the things above, you need the following
- A mental health examination (which, since that's the target of NRA blame for every gun related tragedy, they shouldn't have a problem with it)
- Universal background checks (still not sure why people take issue with these)
- Pass a written test on the law
- Pass a practical examination showing you know how to handle a gun and hit what you're aiming at


The end result, a nation where they have expansive gun rights (in some ways more gun right than we do), with a few little tweaks and integrity measures, that has one of the lowest violent crime rates in the civilized world.

We could work toward that too....
IF:
- The far left could abandon their paranoia about "scary looking guns"
- The far right could abandon their slippery slope logic where they portray any and all integrity measures as a precursor to "tyranny"
 
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